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1977 Princess 1.8 HL


phil_lihp

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That screeching might not be the belt, it might be the tensioner bearing.  I only know this because the day that @dollywobbler tried to drive mine, the tensioner was screeching its tits off on the way home.  Short fix was to squirt some WD40 (other lubricants are available) into the tensioner, long fix was to use a worse looking tensioner off another car that's been lovely and quiet since.  Also, because of where the belts are, if you go through a puddle just so the auxiliary belt quite often screeches its tits off until its dried out again.

Nice to hear it running and great solution on the rear seat, looks just right.  On the exhaust, as @Mr_Bo11ox pointed out to me way back when, there's a stay that goes from the downpipe to the gearbox, it snaps, and when it snaps the exhaust blows, usually at the manifold joint.  If it's missing/broken, it's a good idea to replace it so you don't end up pulling out your own hair in frustration at trying to get the exhaust to stay sealed for more than five miles at a time.

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Thanks, but there's no tensioner on this one, the belt goes to the alternator and waterpump and that's it, it's a pushrod engine so there's no cambelt.  Does at least mean there's only two things it can be, I hope it isn't my NOS waterpump but entirely possible it is.  I'll investigate today.  Thanks for the exhaust advice, I will be trying to sort that later today as well.

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Much achievementing was done today.  I started off with the exciting task of getting the car up on the ramps I bought from an antique shop in town a few months ago - they've previously been tested out on my Granvia which has relatively chunky tyres and they were fine then, mildly alarming process coaxing the car up then as it struggled to pull itself up gently without a short run up so trying to balance that with not shooting off the front was interesting. 

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Oil change completed, many litres of mucky, ancient oil came out, this thing takes 5.8 litres!  I will have to order some more, I only had 5 although it's up to above the minimum mark, I guess this is due to it sharing the oil with the gearbox.  New filter is a smidge smaller than the old one but is a perfect fit - behold my 30 year old filter, which came off with minimal hassle.

While I had access to her nether regions I could confirm the seller's description that underneath, this car is very, very solid - maybe the underseal's hiding something awful but there's no obvious signs of it, everything looks straight and pretty original.  The exhaust has been getting louder and louder and my inexpert ears led me to the join between what looks like the original front pipe and a newer rear section which the seller fitted.  It looks like the front section might have been cut back to get the old bits off, there is a gap in the flange and no option to move the pipe around to fix that.  In the photo below, there was a clamp over the joint, I'd already removed it to get a proper look at the joint.  You can just seen the little rectangle of open exhaust, matched on the opposite side as well. 

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I therefore deployed the time-honoured fix of clamping a bit of tin (Sainsburys Basics tomatoes if you're keeping notes) over a smothering of exhaust paste to hopefully seal it up.

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Started it up and...it sounds the same.  Further investigation reveals that silencing this joint has highlighted the front flexi is where most of the noise is coming from.  I cannot find a hole anywhere, it looks sound so I assume the flexi section itself is just knackered.  However it looks like I can get a new one for £30 (it's the top one with the long flexible joint in the picture):

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AUSTIN-PRINCESS-1800-1975-TO-1978-EXHAUST-SINGLE-FRONT-PIPE-WITH-FLEX-OR-BALL/362616168430?epid=28008822873&hash=item546d9b9fee:g:hY4AAOSwRLZUIVEY

No idea if that is likely fit very well but probably worth a go.

I also fitted a replacement secondhand passenger sidelight/indicator unit as the old one had rotted to bits inside and the wires had disintegrated.  That worked fine but further investigation showed the driver's one is just as bad so I'll need to replace that one too.

Finally to cap off the day's work, I hoovered most of the dirt out of the interior and refitted the nice clean carpets and dry sound insulation - really pleased with this, it feels like the car's coming together more and the inside is a lot more pleasant now. 

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Spot the colour different in the footwells where the original BL rubber mats have protected it - I've now cleaned and reinstated those.

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My gaffer tape windscreen seal seems to be doing the trick for now keeping the floors dry and I'm hoping to get the new seal installed very soon.  The observant among you may notice the sill carpet is still horrible, that's because it's a completely lost cause and a lot of it had simply rotted to bits where it'd been left soaking wet for months.  It's now at least dry and I've hoovered off the worst of the muck but at some point I'll need to make up some new ones.

I capped all this off with a couple more runs up and down my road - the antisocial exhaust is a nuisance but other than that it's working pretty well.  In fact I got so brave that instead of turning around at the bottom of my road, I turned off up a steep hill and drove for about a mile up and down a quiet B-road to give it a proper test.  I loosened off the alternator belt this morning to see if that would quieten down the alternator - it did and in doing so caused a horrendous belt squeal instead.  Task failed successfully; I will whip the alternator off and drop it down to a local business that rebuild them, they've done excellent and reasonably priced work in the past and I'd prefer to fix the original if I can - if it's not saveable I can always pick up a cheapo new one.

The driving experience is best described as functional; it starts very easily, idles well and drives in a straight line pretty well, however it wants the choke on otherwise going up hills results in a complete loss of power and lots of bangs and pops (this might be part of the reason for the exhaust blow) - putting the choke back on cures that but it seems extremely gutless.  I am going to guess that my next avenue must be the timing, further investigation required there.

So the next few significant jobs are likely to be:

* Fix/replace the alternator
* Sort the timing/carb adjustment
* Bleed the brakes - it has brand new calipers and lines throughout but the pedal has a lot of travel
* Replace the blown exhaust section
* Get it to my local mechanic for a suspension pump and some welding plus a fine-tune of timing/carb settings

Bound to be a few more things but after that the main thing on my agenda will be putting some miles on it.

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On 6/6/2020 at 5:20 PM, somewhatfoolish said:

You've left the air filter off, so it will be lean and need a little choke to run worth a damn. Don't adjust mixture or idle until the airfilter is back on.

I don't think this is right, if the an air filter is impeding airflow at idle to that extent then it's either too small, or so filthy it needs chucking. It would literally strangle the engine at 5000rpm, when the requirement for air is roughly 5x what it is at idle.

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You've probably already mentioned it, but what percentage of fuel in  the tank is fresh and how much is years old?  My landcrab (same engine) is behaving much the same (won't run off choke) but I'm confident it will get better as I add more fresh fuel.,  I guess I have the benefit of knowing that the carb settings and timing haven't changed since I last had it on the road ten years ago.

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Today's job escalated somewhat.  As it didn't rain all day like it was forecast to, I decided to remove the noisy alternator so I can get it refurbished in town.  That was easy enough, I had to remove all the bolts when I changed the water pump a few weeks back anyway so it only took a few minutes.  

With that done, I thought I'd have a crack at replacing the knackered radiator fan.  This in turn required disturbing the radiator, which in turn lead to philosophical questions such as "why are my feet getting wet?"    The answer turned out to be because, not entirely surprisingly, a pin hole had appeared in the front of the radiator and was tinkling water out at a steady rate.  I removed it - necessary to get the bulky fan out anyway - and sure enough, it's looking pretty sorry for itself.  It's got one or two holes in it and the bottom edge is looking pretty rusty.

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Honestly, I have a good mind to ring this lot up and complain - you get your radiator replaced and 35 years later you have to do it again. 

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I wonder actually if this might have been an emergency replacement, the car has lived near Reading since '79 so perhaps the original let go during a trip out west.  We may never know.

Any thoughts on the best way to resolve this?  There's a NOS one on eBay (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AUSTIN-PRINCESS-1800-NEW-RADIATOR/402279540998?hash=item5da9baa906:g:JzYAAOSw3X1e0iNw) but it's £100 and I am a cheapskate, I may see if there's any local places that can repair it but no idea if that's feasible or cost-effective.  It definitely needed attention anyway, despite the cooling system being filled with clean water and a scoop of detergent a few weeks back, what came out was murky brown filth and there was a fair amount of silt in the radiator.  I had intended to give it a flush through with a hosepipe soon anyway prior to refilling with the proper coolant, there's a couple of original hoses that still could benefit from being replaced as well.

The old fan used to work when the car was first dragged out of the barn but since being with me hasn't been too happy, the motor is quite seized so it does this: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1KFXLLKtaZSISLMOdAaSFnYi9MMYOcR2J/view?usp=sharing (hideous noise alert, turn down your volume)

The new fan is a cheapo generic Chinese 10" job off eBay as recommended on the owner's club Facebook page, seemed to be pretty well made and it's a much more compact item than the original.

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Fitting it to the original shroud was a bit tricky, fortunately I have several tubs of bolts and random odds and ends that might be useful one day - today was that day for a pair of interior trim mounts off my Granvia which when trimmed down and given appropriate mounting holes in the original shroud did the job perfectly.

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Old fan removed from shroud...

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New fan installed...

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A quick test with some jumper cables to the battery showed that it works a treat - proof here if you feel you need it: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1KHCV7gFiOZQI6OWti4uIkw6tFljvlKjJ/view?usp=sharing.  It's nice and quiet and doesn't catch on the frame so hopefully this is a decent fix.  It's a bit bodgy but if it works, who's complaining? 

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Speaking of which, I think I'll find a generic washer pump to replace this one, it powers on and makes all sorts of exciting washer pump noises but not a drop comes out of it - the pipes are clear and I have tried dismantling it but it is quite corroded inside as well so I don't intend to waste any more time on it.  Weirdly the pump is riveted to what looks like a bit of fuel or heater hose, I thought that was a bodge from many years ago but it's factory.  

So next job is a refurb of the alternator, refurb/replace the radiator and fit my new front exhaust section when it turns up.  That might* finally mean it's actually properly driveable by next weekend.

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Nothing much to report this weekend as my new radiator's yet to turn up.  The alternator turned out to be completely shot, the bearings were knackered and it doesn't charge but the rebuild shop had a brand new one on the shelf for £70 which seemed fair enough, he said it's good quality and everything they've done for me in the past has lasted.  Only thing is their opening hours seem a bit erratic at the moment so I've yet to actually get my hands on it.

My new exhaust turned up, it spent a jolly week outside a house down the other end of my road due to the seller putting a completely random house number on the address, pure luck they left it outside and I spotted it when I was out for a walk.  Once the alternator and radiator are back on, I'll get it back on the ramps and get that fitted.

With the radiator out of the way I'll probably take the opportunity to clean out 40 years of cack from the front of the valance and maybe even slap a bit of paint on the steel coolant pipes, they're solid but all the original paint's falling off, I don't really fancy those rotting through.  I've got another NOS bit of radiator hose to replace the crusty old bottom elbow bit which had to be freed with a hacksaw - the only original hose left then will be the long thin one leading to the heater pipe, none of those on eBay but it's a straight bit of hose so will measure it up and order a generic bit.  With everything else being refreshed it'd be annoying if that let go, it doesn't look too robust any more. 

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On 6/14/2020 at 5:11 PM, phil_lihp said:

 

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It's a bit bodgy but if it works, who's complaining? 

I think it's a neat job actually, far less of a bodge than those zip tie style clips which pierce the radiator - which I used for around 5 years until I got round to welding on bosses and doing the job properly on the Stellar!

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Thanks - I tend to agree with whoever said "it's not stupid if it works" - it came with all manner of clips and things but this seemed like the most obvious solution as the original frame it came in didn't really fit and there were no decent mounting points on the car for it, this will look more original too, insofar as that matters.

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Today I received a care package from a fellow Princess sufferer. 

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@vulgalour was kind enough to send me a package of spares he had knocking around so I now have some rear window trims, a spare indicator stalk, an Allegro hubcap (Princess ones are hard to find and Allegro ones are similar enough to get away with)  and an Ambassador spare wheel - mine's missing its spare so I will get one of the new but mismatched front tyres mounted to that and match up the other tyre.

I had a free hour this evening so decided to sort the wheeltrims - the car came with a full set of trim rings in the boot and 3 original hubcaps, all heavily corroded with rust stains and a greenish tint.  They really let the car down so now I have one shiny Allegro hubcap I reckoned it was only right to bring the others up to a similar standard.  I attacked the caps and rings with a wire soap pad and a bucket of water, followed up with a quick wipe over with Brasso (the foulest smelling substance in my garage, I'd say).  I'm pretty pleased with the results - they're far from perfect but are hugely improved and plenty good enough against the car's shoddy paintwork.

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To finish off I attacked the very faded and sad looking dashboard with a can of tyre shine I had lying around to see if it'd help - I would have tried linseed oil but I seem to have run out.  I don't know if it will last but it looks a lot better without making it obnoxiously shiny.

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A 50/50 with the top of the dash shows how much it's improved - smells nice too.

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I have a plan for replacing the knackered vinyl on top of the dash.

I also refitted the brand new alternator the other night - just waiting on my new radiator now and hopefully if the weather behaves it'll all go back together this weekend.

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Small but satisfying update - the windscreen washer pump was knackered, it made pumping noises but didn't actually do anything and turned out to be somewhat fossilised when I tried to dismantle it.  A new Lucas pump was procured for under a tenner on eBay and now I can wash my windscreen as much as I like.

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The old one was riveted to this bit of rubber pipe which in turn is riveted to the panel - I gently removed the old pump by yanking on it and pulling the rivets neatly out of the pipe, then applied a sophisticated zip tie to attach the new one.  I will probably* fix this properly in the future but, in keeping with the true spirit of BL, it'll do for now.

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@dollywobbler should approve, there is no triangle of doom (I think?), helped by adjusting the wipers correctly as they were a) parking on the windscreen seal and b) bolted down finger tight.  The washer jets are a bit reluctant but there's plenty of pressure and scooshing action, I poked out the jets and have a spare roll of washer hose if I chose to deploy it in the future.   

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On 6/6/2020 at 5:20 PM, somewhatfoolish said:

You've left the air filter off, so it will be lean and need a little choke to run worth a damn. Don't adjust mixture or idle until the airfilter is back on.

On 6/7/2020 at 8:56 PM, spartacus said:

I don't think this is right, if the an air filter is impeding airflow at idle to that extent then it's either too small, or so filthy it needs chucking. It would literally strangle the engine at 5000rpm, when the requirement for air is roughly 5x what it is at idle.

"back in the day" you were always told in the manuals to adjust an SU with filter off

with a combination of using the push pin and keeping an eye on tail pipe colour i got my mini from 28* mpg to over 35

 

*aparently not too bad for 17yo knob in first car! ?

 

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A busy day of Princessing today - a mate popped round to lend a socially distant hand and we ended up spending 7 hours on the car.  First job was reattaching many things that had been taken off in the previous couple of weeks.

One new alternator.

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Next job was my new old stock radiator, listed specifically as suitable for an 1800 Princess and it looked correct on the listing.  That proved to be 95% correct - it's ever so slightly different.

Old:

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New:

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Spot the differences?  They're actually upside down in these photos, the top hose connector is on the side rather than the back and the header tank feed is in a different place and is a different shape.  That unfortunately meant that neither of the correct hoses would fit.

Fortunately I had a radiator hose section which I bought in error which had a wider bit on one end.  It turned out to be suitable for this comical affair of bodgery: 

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Yes, those are zip ties as the jubilee clips I had weren't big enough and I had to cut one of the original hose clamps off.  The header tank joint was provided by a piece of fuel line which was a tight fit but did the job.  Would you believe that the only leak from this ridiculous setup was from the coolant temperature sensor (bottom left with the green wire going into it) which evidently needs a bit of sealant around it.  The original top pipe is attached to the radiator and the slightly brownish weird-shaped pipe is the one I had hanging around as a spare.

I should point out, this was done only to allow it to be backed off the driveway and driven up on to the ramps.  I will never drive it like this, next job is to order some more hoses and a set of hose clamps and clips to do the job properly. 

Right then, that's done and it has some water in it - time to get it up in the air.  The battery died again so I will get a better, bigger one next time I'm near the scrapyard which sells them.  Luckily with my mate in attendance he was able to help push it back off the slightly sloped driveway enough to give it a jump from my long-suffering Octavia, which is getting jealous of all the attention the Princess is getting.

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With some extra volts the Princess started right up, we got it on the ramps (I will never enjoy that process!) so the farty exhaust could be replaced.  The bolts on the manifold clamp sheared off - which was actually fine, as we had good replacements ready to go - and the rest were easily removed, it probably only took us about 10 minutes to get the old one off and find out why it was so loud.

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As I suspected, the flexi joint had broken in several places.  Time to fit my new old stock one, which fortunately fitted a treat.

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Getting the manifold joint aligned was a bit of a mission, I realised afterwards that we should have fitted it to the manifold before attaching the rear section, it would have made it a lot easier.  It's a bit messy with exhaust paste but it has sealed nicely.

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The first start proved that it's now a lot quieter which was fantastic - however it's not quite there yet, annoyingly the centre joint which I 'repaired' before with a dollop of exhaust paste and a bit of tin can is blowing again but it's good enough for now.  When it does finally make it to the garage for suspension and tuning work, I'll get him to sort the blowing joint while it's up on his ramp.

So a few steps forward and one back, the cooling system still isn't quite there yet but we're making progress, I've also found someone locally to fit the windscreen seal for a sensible price so as soon as it's driveable it'll go over to them for that to be done too.

Stay tuned for further exciting updates in a future episode.

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Looking at the problem with the radiator fitment again, I think it might actually be for a 1700.  Reason being, this style of top hose looks like the right shape and direction:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Austin-Princess-2-1-7-2-0-1979-82-Quinton-Hazell-Radiator-Top-Hose/283842418255?hash=item421653964f:g:SGkAAOSwnXRej3xl

The only issue is whether it'd be long enough.  I've bought it anyway, worth a shot,

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The hoses I've seen on 1700s, mine included, are normally much longer than that, like so.

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I've found a few examples of 1700/2000 Princess engines and they all have this longer hose.  However, looking at parts listed, they're all the shorter looking one like the one you bought.  Bit odd.  Anyway, that new radiator is definitely an O series one with the outlets where they are, doesn't really make any difference to performance, seems a bit of an odd revision really, you'd think making a batch of different pipes would make more sense than reworking the radiators.

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