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A Very Brown (Broken) Senator


RobT

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Rob and me met up again today. Overall, not our most successful effort, so let's focus on the positives.

New wing mirror glass actually correct from eBay...and the electric mirrors sort of work!

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A good clean of the screen/scuttle and removal of incorrect knackered wipers was also pleasing...

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I've not been about much due to life but I'm on containers tonight so lots of sitting about.

May I be the umpteenth to say FUCK ME THAT IS GLORIOUS! 112%/10 chaps.

My Senator 24v's back arches looked like that and it turned out on investigation that the rot finished about half way along the front doors.

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49 minutes ago, cms206 said:

I've not been about much due to life but I'm on containers tonight so lots of sitting about.

May I be the umpteenth to say FUCK ME THAT IS GLORIOUS! 112%/10 chaps.

My Senator 24v's back arches looked like that and it turned out on investigation that the rot finished about half way along the front doors.

Cheers m8.

Peering under the sill covers was the first thing I did before buying, and it looks OK from what I could see.  Won't be taking the covers off though, ignorance is bliss.

As egg said, not the best of days as it still won't start, despite having done so previously.  Fuel relay replaced but the pump is still doing nothing, so we're wondering if the pump is blocked.  I've bought a cheap 15 quid replacement to test the theory, and will also put an additional filter inbetween the tank feed pipe to the pump, just in case there's loads of crap coming through.

If it's not that, then we're on to electrical what the fuckery.  My knowledge is scant on how to diagnose such things, so some learning is needed I think.

Also, the day ended with me showering my face with pez from the pump.  Eyes stang massively but once washed that subsided, but my ear is still sore as I managed to get a load in there too.  OK I'm not the most gifted mechanic, but I'm normally a safe one.  That was just idiotic behaviour caused by rushing!

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These don't have a fuel trip switch.

They have a tachometric (or something sounding  like that) relay that briefly powers the pump up when you switch the ignition on then when you crank over the relay is powered up from a signal from the ignition system to keep the pump running.

If you stall or cut out the feed to the relay is ended and stops the pump running.

The idea is thay if you have an accident the engine stops and cuts the fuel system even if the ignition is still switched on.

These relays and their wiring do give problems.

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That’s interesting about the tachometric fuel pump relay.

Failure of that would explain the weird symptoms on my Lancia as well - the fuel pump primes and the injectors spit out a tiny bit of fuel that makes the engine cough but then no more. Hmm, I wonder....

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1 hour ago, Joey spud said:

They have a tachometric (or something sounding  like that) relay that briefly powers the pump up when you switch the ignition on then when you crank over the relay is powered up from a signal from the ignition system to keep the pump running.

Thanks Joey - interesting info, so this could also be an ECU fault if those messages aren't 'getting through'.

@sierraman - thanks for the magazine pics, mentions the leaky footwells. It is still wet on ours, we are hoping it is due to the scuttle and drain holes being blocked with debris and not the heater matrix!

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My old senator had a rust hole on the bulkhead seen above the pedals. You had to stick your head right above the pedals and look up that gusset to see, but it definitely came in through there. Common place to rot, and hard as fuck to rectify. I filled mine with expandable foam to slow it down. 

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4 hours ago, Joey spud said:

They have a tachometric (or something sounding  like that) relay that briefly powers the pump up when you switch the ignition on then when you crank over the relay is powered up from a signal from the ignition system to keep the pump running.....

These relays and their wiring do give problems.

Thanks!  Initially I was led to believe the fuel relay was in the fuse box by the driver's foot, but turns out it's in a box in the engine bay.  At least we've got a spare now...

I'm just wondering if the ECU is harbouring damp, as that's hidden behind a panel to the right of the fuse box.  Seeing as the footwells were sodden it could be a possibility, although it's packed in there tight.

Edit: previously when it did run you could hear the pump kicking in and running when cranked, albeit noisily to my ears, so I'm hoping it's something simple such as a blocked pump or something due to crap from the tank.  I'll find out soon enough when I get a chance to try the new one.

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4 hours ago, sutty2006 said:

My old senator had a rust hole on the bulkhead seen above the pedals. You had to stick your head right above the pedals and look up that gusset to see, but it definitely came in through there. Common place to rot, and hard as fuck to rectify. I filled mine with expandable foam to slow it down. 

Without stripping much of the engine bay out and the interior that’s a terminal issue. 

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I can't understand how, despite logging  on to Autoshite every day to have a look for exciting new stuff I keep missing awesome threads like this one, and GarethJ's Celica thread until they are several weeks old and several pages long. I think I have to accept that I'm struggling with the new Autoshite layout.

 

Anyway, nice job Egg & Rob. Brown over brown shows you made all the right life choices. The exterior brown and the interior brown don't really complaint each other to my (brown) eye, but I think it's all the better for it.

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Tinkering rather than any real progress today.

The previous owner replaced the fuel pump a few weeks ago, but it's gunked up already so must have given up the ghost.

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I rigged up this effort, thinking I could get an idea of how much crap is still in the tank.

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But I need to get a new feed pipe from the tank to the inline filter, which then leads on to the pump.

Rudimentary outline of the current feed pipe, plus what the new one needs to be.20190908_150618.thumb.jpg.d1dfa782e48900fc02b28efe6818eea2.jpg

I bought some 12mm bore diameter hose, but to get those kinks would need something like this unicoil (something I'd never heard of until now)

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Of course, all this is creating complication where the simplest* thing would be to remove and clean the tank.  It's just one more thing I wanted to avoid though...

Also, the new pump isn't making any sort of noise, same as the old one.  So it could still be problems elsewhere.  Ho hum, the delights of a shite old project!

It'll have to wait a few more weeks now, as my Swedish road trip kicks off next Saturday, and if the tank does have to come out some proper time and energy levels will be required there.

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I also cut out the sodden floor foam, and we can replace that at a later date.  It's in an easy to replicate shape, and I've left the complicated foot rest bit in there, which isn't too soaked anyway.

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Just before packing up I sat in the driver's seat for a rest, to remind myself why we're here.  Things like the design of the gear selector panel

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Plus the dual air vent arrangement on the door.

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I love this car, but am desperate for it to WORK!

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Thanks to Rob for his efforts today!

I think this car is generally suffering from lack of use disease, where it has sat around a lot (hence the low miles), and if we can get it up and running - I'm sure other problems will present themselves - but it will get better in other ways.

Any views about whether we* could clean the tank while in situ?

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Worth bearing in mind that they've started putting ethanol in all the fuels (around here at least) over the last month or so.  Shell V-Power always used to be ethanol free - but even that's gained the dreaded E-5 label on the pump recently.
 

Sure I've heard more than one person report ethanol fuels washing all kinds of gunk out of an old system...

 

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