James Brown: Kiltox’s 1998 Rover 216 Cabriolet!

[Kiltox]

8 minutes ago, Six-cylinder said:

So you sell me a great fully working 216 cab and you buy one with HGF!!!!!!

You understand this is not a criticism just an observation.

Yeah that’s how it goes, it seems

If I’d had access to a garage then I would never have sold it!

[Kiltox]

Started thinking about the repair.

Whats the general consensus on K series HG repair? There are a myriad of options. 

Is the new super mega N Series gasket the one, coupled with the updated oil rail and head bolts? Priciest option but people seem to say it fixes it for good. 

Anyone want to lend a hand (or a workshop within kettling distance of Gloucester) ? Haven’t spannered for a while but fancy taking it on. My currently available work space isn’t ideal mind. 

[320touring]

Sorry m9 am washing my hair;)

[Steve79]

My opinion of kettle-series repair is steelseal! Never let me down, apart from in the 2.2 back safrane I had but there was no saving that anyways.

Probably not the answer some people would like but out there is a hi-jet van a friend sold with hgf a few years ago that is currently on over 5k with steelseal and no issues. 

[Kiltox]

Not keen on the spanner in a bottle approach. Fine on an old scrapper to get you to work in the morning but this isn’t really that. 

[chompy_snake]

If you have a failed head gasket on these K's its most likely cheaper to get a complete engine tbh and swap.

I have an engine hoist that I don't mind loaning to forum members in need. 

Hgf is a little involved to do but I do know MikeKnight is great at it (Mike Lester in Stockton).

Always fancied an R8 floppy top, not sure why but there is a charm about them.

Plus if you use k-seal you will be flushing it for years to get rid lol

[Kiltox]

Surely fixing the original engine is better than chucking in an unknown used one? I’m guessing a reconditioned engine is ££££. 

[chompy_snake]

Well a used one can be had for under £200. It just depends if you want to take the gamble on an unknown really 

[hairnet]

have it fixed for 200

another engine - with the same problem..................

[AnthonyG]

I am Cheltenham based so happy to lend a hand. 

My mechanical skills* on anything made after about 1982 are reasonably limited though! 

I believe (it’s been quite a while since I read about K series engines) that once the head is off you get a good idea of whether the fix will be long lasting if not from the state of the ‘two halves’. If the head has ‘moved around’ the block in any way, even by a couple of mm, it’s best to look for another. This ‘moving’ was possible with the plastic dowels, as they weakened with the heat of a HGF. 

 

[twosmoke300]

MLS gasket with head saver , metal dowels and a very light head skim .

Done loads with that approach and no issues . Never done an oil rail replacement .

[clayts450]

I trust Mat at Discount MG Rover Spares : have a read of this which is the current thinking

https://www.dmgrs.co.uk/pages/choosing-the-correct-k-series-head-gasket-kit

[Kiltox]

2 hours ago, clayts450 said:

I trust Mat at Discount MG Rover Spares : have a read of this which is the current thinking

https://www.dmgrs.co.uk/pages/choosing-the-correct-k-series-head-gasket-kit

Thanks for that, I’d found the N Series kits on that site but not the write up. Guess I’ll be best to strip it down first and see what’s what. 

[SiC]

Interesting that they don't recommend a skim. I always thought that these K-Series needed it after a HGF. 

[chompy_snake]

Skim the bugger. Alloy head alloy block (well a weird sandwich block arrangement).

Clean the top of the block well (I heard somewhere not to disturb liner tops).

Every K series I have seen kettle has warped the head. 4 in total so far ... At least have it checked for level. Choose head gasket carefully as some of the MLS one are pooh

 

It's just luck that it will be warped and you do all the work without the skim immediately noticing when it starts that it has took a turd in the coolant haha

[twosmoke300]

I think they reckon the head has a surface hardened sealing surface that once you machine it will allow the liners to hammer into the head . But I’m pretty sure the mls kit and head saver shim will stop this

[BorniteIdentity]

Personally I would just get someone like Mike at MJS to come and do it on your drive. When I looked into it on my Raver 75 it was £350. I think he carries heads around with him so he takes yours and gives you a nice freshly rebuilt one, but that might be fake news and I’d hate to misrepresent him. 

I bought my lovely Launch Model from him in 2017 - he’s a lovely bloke and knows them inside out, back to front and upside down. He will travel. 

[pauldoubleyou]

So these are mega easy to do. An afternoons work but the price can creep up with the extras.

Buy the cheapest MLS gasket set with new bolts on eBay. Don’t worry about the headsaver unless when you get the head off it’s not totally flat. Use a torch and an engineers rule, any issues that can’t be seen by eye should be swept up by the mls gasket. Bolts are essential as they stretch.

Thermostat. Change the bloody thermostat while the head and inlet is off otherwise they’re a complete mare. What’s that, £5?

Oil and coolant. Not water, coolant.

My tips are:

Don’t drop the bolts into the holes when putting the head on. They bolt into the oil rail in the sump which is kind of floating. It can break off and fall in the sump and it’s a right howdoyoudo. Place gently.

Bolts will ping when you’re torquing them up. It’s scary but fine. That’s them stretching.

Take the expansion bottle out and fill it full of fishtank gravel and a washing tablet and shake the shit out of it until it’s clean.

Inspect the timing belt. If it’s not mega shiny or cracked I’d just reuse it.

You’ll need a torque wrench, cam locking tool, and an angled socket extension. If the exhaust manifold bolts are rusted in place they will just pull the whole stud out. Replace or refit in the exact hole it came from.

Cam gaskets you get in the sets (big flat thing) are crap. Use hylomar blue.

Bring it round mine near Glasgow with the bits and I’ll do it in an afternoon just for the fun of them




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[Kiltox]

I think this little honey is coming out of hibernation shortly, watch this space 

[Kiltox]

RIGHT THEN. 

This sexy bastard has been clogging up my unit for a while now. Here’s how we left things:

It’s sat in that stripped down state for FUCKING AGES now. 
 

Today I collected all of the parts and fasteners together and cleaned up the puddle of oil and coolant under the car.  Assembled all of the new parts (head set, thermostat, timing kit etc). 
 

Over a fairly long period of time I’ll be putting this bastard back together! 
 

[Kiltox]

Stumbling block #1 - whilst going through the new parts I bought ages ago I realise I have the wrong timing kit.
 

It has a manual tensioner, not automatic, and the belt is shorter as a result so the one supplied won’t fit. Fucksticks. 

[dave j]

9 hours ago, Kiltox said:

Stumbling block #1 - whilst going through the new parts I bought ages ago I realise I have the wrong timing kit.
 

It has a manual tensioner, not automatic, and the belt is shorter as a result so the one supplied won’t fit. Fucksticks. 

Not a good start! And as you bought the parts a while ago theres probably no chance of a refund/exchange

[Kiltox]

45 minutes ago, dave j said:

Not a good start! And as you bought the parts a while ago theres probably no chance of a refund/exchange

Yeah exactly. Bastard. My own fault of course for not checking at the time. 

Ebay seller a little to blame too - I notice they’re still advertising the same set (head gasket + timing kit etc all in one) for 1994> cars when in fact it’s only the late late ones they use the automatic tensioner aparrently 🙄

[Kiltox]

Spent some time with this bastard tonight. The thermostat placement is just plain evil. It’s out though, and I’ve got a new one ready to go on. 

Head is in the parts washer. It probably wants a light skim just to clean it up properly but I’m going to risk it - I was going to scrap this car because I hadn’t done anything with it so I’m going super-budget with this. 

Correct timing belt and a water pump are on their way, delivery on Friday. Tomorrow evening I’ll hopefully fit the new thermostat, fit the head, inlet manifold etc and get it to the point where the next step is to fit the new water pump and then the timing belt!

 

[loserone]

Sheet of glass and some 2000 grit wet and dry?

[Kiltox]

1 hour ago, loserone said:

Sheet of glass and some 2000 grit wet and dry?

Scotchbrite and ignorance is the approach I’m going for 😂 

[Six-cylinder]

3 hours ago, Kiltox said:

Scotchbrite and ignorance is the approach I’m going for 😂 

It is worth the £35 skim to save you doing the job again.

[Kiltox]

2 minutes ago, Six-cylinder said:

It is worth the £35 skim to save you doing the job again.

£35?! Where? 

[Six-cylinder]

3 minutes ago, Kiltox said:

£35?! Where? 

http://www.headlinemk.co.uk/

This is the Carlton that had to be welded in 3 places, £80 cash.

[Isaac Hunt]

8 hours ago, loserone said:

Sheet of glass and some 2000 grit wet and dry?

I’d go at 600 grade with plenty of wd40 wrapped round said piece of glass, that is how I did mine.  

Checked it with a straight edge and used an elastomer gasket.  

Grind the tip of the stretch bolts so they don’t bottom out.  It is a bit nerve racking when you do them up (using the old stretch bolts) because you don’t know how many times they have been run again.  

Ours has been fine for 50k miles. I used an elastomer gasket, new inlet manifold gasket and a new exhaust manifold gasket, that was it.  A proper £30 quid fix it was