vulgalour Posted May 27, 2020 Share Posted May 27, 2020 Liked for you being a Real Man (tm), not for the failure. RobT and LightBulbFun 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobT Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 I've been trying to fix running issues on this for a month now, but despite spending several hours on it each week I've made no progress at all, so I think it's time to give up and focus on other things. The choke rod fell off whilst driving it (see previous page) so I took the carb off and replaced the rod. Rough running and stalling ensued, so I bought a used Weber 32 DRT carb off eBay for £70, but that ran even worse. So I put the old one back on, then checked for vacuum leaks with a leak detector gadget kindly provided by Skizzer. Everything seemed fine on that front, but it still ran poorly. I've since made up some gaskets for the base plates from gasket paper - the metal sandwich plate thing with the outlets for the coolant pipes, and the plastic plate between the carb and the inlet - and it does seem to idle better. But it'll only drive for about 300 yards from cold before it then dies and needs the choke balancing to keep it running (but even then it conks out all too easily). Apparently the plastic base plate can warp over time meaning when the carb is removed it rarely runs correctly again. This is based on internet opinion. The cheapest way I've found to source a new base plate is via a £38 service kit. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Weber-32-DRT-carburettor-service-kit-Renault-5-Super-1-4-9-21-1-4/191627478085?hash=item2c9de34445:g:eRoAAOSw3ydVn4Bb However, that might not work anyway seeing how the vacuum checks didn't show leaking from the base of the carb. Of course that assumes I was using the leak detector correctly, but it's an easy piece of kit to use. To add further insult, the auto 'box warning light came on after the first re-install of the carb. I think that's just electrical though, as when it does run it goes through the gears fine and the same as before. I did some checks on that front, including making sure the fluid was at the correct level, more vacuum leak detection, and cleaning up connectors in some random act of optimism. In the end I've fixed* it by just disconnecting the wire. Seems a coincidence it should happen now but there you go. In summary, it could be an easy fix or an absolute ballache to sort. It's entirely possible someone who knows what they're doing will make light work of it, but either way I'm done. Prior to all this it was an MoTd runner with 48,000ish miles (8th December with the extension applied next week), original and relatively rust free. Only notable bits are by the front door check straps. I was poised to try and sell it for hopefully around £1,200 before all these issues came up, and I'll find out soon enough if £750 is aspirational for a poorly running but essentially nice old Frenchie. Location is Beckenham, BR3, and in the event anyone does want it bring a trailer (with a winch preferably) as I can't guarantee it'll run long enough to load up! Dick Longbridge, scdan4, Fabergé Greggs and 2 others 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabergé Greggs Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Oh my god I LOVE this thing but sadly can't handle a project at the mo. GLWS. RobT 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobT Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 Neither can I... Edit: although I have tried. inconsistant 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabergé Greggs Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Let's have some fresh pics anyway to rejoice in that colour, those wheels and those seats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobT Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 This month, I've been mostly doing this. I'll get some other pics when I'm less annoyed with it. Dick Longbridge, scdan4 and somewhatfoolish 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Split_Pin Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 That's a real shame about the 11. It's such a lovely looking example too RobT 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Shame to hear about the poor 11 running, Rob. It does rather sound like something that @Renault18 might be interested in?! If you'd like, I could call the guy I know who lives locally and is big into French cars and has an 11 automatic, which he somehow manages to keep going in NZ! He may well have some useful info, if you did fancy a final reprise fettle. Good luck with the sale though and I really hope it stays in forum hands. Renault18 and RobT 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobT Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 Yes please Jon, ask away. Despite the for sale ad, I don't feel ready to quit just yet. @Renault18 has his hands full at the moment, but he's also been helpful in offering advice and sympathy! Jon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hairnet Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 this is july for Dr @Kiltox surely? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandeth Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Is this a twin-choke carb? If so I have to wonder if the warping issue of the base plate could cause a leak between the barrels...I imagine it's the usual sort of Weber-esque setup where the second choke only opens up under heavy throttle. If that was the case I imagine you wouldn't pick up anything with a leak detector as the leak would essentially be internal to the carb. LightBulbFun 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobT Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 Yes it's twin choke, and that's a very good point Zel. Maybe I will buy that £38 service kit and have one last go at it. 14 minutes ago, hairnet said: this is july for Dr @Kiltox surely? I sold him that fucked Clio last September, so not sure he'd fancy another one of my Renault automatic cast offs... Kiltox 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatylight Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 this is july for Dr [mention=17393]Kiltox[/mention] surely? What, after he's been desperately trying to offload to broken Renners Sent from my SM-A505FN using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hairnet Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 yeah but theyre modern Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobT Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 Actually, looking at the kit it doesn't appear to have the base plate after all. I give up, as the carb specialists I've contacted can't source them either. Therefore that doesn't bode well for a new owner, unless they have a stash of them. Or for me selling it anytime soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorpunk Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 14 minutes ago, RobT said: Actually, looking at the kit it doesn't appear to have the base plate after all. I give up, as the carb specialists I've contacted can't source them either. Therefore that doesn't bode well for a new owner, unless they have a stash of them. Or for me selling it anytime soon. Good luck. I’d love this but am told that buying another car will result in castration/legal-action/DeathByIKEA says the missus. paulplom 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tickman Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 14 minutes ago, RobT said: Actually, looking at the kit it doesn't appear to have the base plate after all. I give up, as the carb specialists I've contacted can't source them either. Therefore that doesn't bode well for a new owner, unless they have a stash of them. Or for me selling it anytime soon. What is the spacer made of? Would it be possible to do a Dave numbers with the glass and sandpaper to the relevant faces? LightBulbFun, Kringle, The Moog and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrett Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Definitely worth giving Paul Cunningham a ring and seeing if he can shed any light on the matter! purplebargeken, RobT and Jifflemon 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandeth Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Get a straight edge in there and see if there's anything visible. If it was mine, the next thing I would try would be a good thick gasket on both sides of the aforementioned base plate and see if that helps. I know you say you've made one from gasket paper, but how thick? Alternatively, can you provide us with some photos of the offending item with some dimensions? Someone may well be able to say "hey, vehicle <insert here> has something exactly like that..." Was the Weber carb you got a known quantity, or a pull from a vehicle that's long gone off the road and been sitting on somebody's garage shelf for the last two decades? If it's the latter is may well need nothing more than a really thorough clean. Also not wanting to sound like I'm being condescending...but you have checked that you've not accidentally disturbed something completely unrelated while in the engine bay haven't you? Symptoms feeling astonishingly like fuel starvation can be caused by a poor spark I discovered (at the cost of about a month and a half worth of evenings of my time!) back on my Saab once. ...I figured out it was an ignition system after I'd completely disassembled and rebuilt about 95% of the fuel injection system and spent well over £300 on parts. Worth just making sure that nothing has been dislodged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Is it possible that suppliers are pulling nothing up for Renault 11, but if you asked for Renault 5 the answer might be different? Having run Renaults in the past I found parts for the Renault 9 were often unavailable but R5 parts were on the shelf. Few people realised how similar they were mechanically egg and wuvvum 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulplom Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 5 hours ago, motorpunk said: Good luck. I’d love this but am told that buying another car will result in castration/legal-action/DeathByIKEA says the missus. To be fair you could write an article on the collection and write off the purchase money as expenses. Tell your lass it's a job for a magazine. The kids need new shoes etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 4 hours ago, Parky said: Is it possible that suppliers are pulling nothing up for Renault 11, but if you asked for Renault 5 the answer might be different? Trying to help Rob out by googling around this issue last night brought up a lot of R5 stuff - so I think you might be right. Also did the AMC built ones use the same Carb set up (I know they used a 1.4)? @PhilA might have an idea about that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobT Posted July 1, 2020 Author Share Posted July 1, 2020 Thanks for all the replies. It does seem like a case of trying to adapt what I've got, so I'll follow Zelandeth's suggestion of making up some thicker gaskets for the base plate. The ones I made up were of similar thickness to the old ones, around 0.4mm. The plate itself is made of plastic, and has a bakelite feel to it. I'll pop up a photo in due course. If that doesn't work and I'm feeling brave, I may try the dave numbers method so thanks for the reminder @Tickman. I'd forgotten he'd done that. 320touring, LightBulbFun, Tickman and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Assume the 1.7 base is different? Otherwise it wouldn't be for a 1.7! https://www.ebay.fr/itm/GENUINE-RENAULT-SUPER-5-R9-R11-1-7-F2N-MODIFIED-CARB-BASE-7701031716-NOT-KIT/264721839333?hash=item3da2a6b4e5:g:Qs8AAOSwymtesaFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorRetro Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 If anyone else does take this on, I've still got this Matchbox one waiting for someone who wants it... LightBulbFun 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tadhg Tiogar Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 11 hours ago, RobT said: Yes it's twin choke, ...... What model Weber is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 French Renner 9/11 club provide some documentation to download here https://www.renault-9-11.fr/technique/documentation.html Including a weber carb guide (in French) https://www.renault-9-11.fr/images/Documentation/MRWeber.pdf RobT 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 is it part number 3 here? From above site. Part numbers don't reveal anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandeth Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Additional to my previous post (which I apparently thought at the time but failed to write). What does the carb base itself look like? Is it simply a smooth or smoothish block that butts up against the plastic block or does it have a bunch of drillings/passages exposed (which would also make a good deal here more critical)? If there's nothing aside from the throttle barrels and possibly nice chunky through drillings for any vacuum take offs, there wouldn't probably be any harm in using a sparing smear of a petrol compatible instant gasket product. Obviously if it's open to the carb innards itself don't even think about it as any bits that escape would inevitably find their way into jets and cause headaches for years to come. I got away with that on a car (think it was my first Metro) which had a tiny crack on the carb base from where someone had dropped it somewhere in the past which made it impossible to seal dry. Obviously it's not an ideal solution, but sometimes the term "needs must" when faced with persistent problems. Additional additional...you have checked that the carb itself is flat haven't you? It wouldn't be the first time I've seen a carb (especially where it's fastened to a softish mounting block) that's been overtightened leaving the carb base itself shaped like a banana. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobT Posted July 1, 2020 Author Share Posted July 1, 2020 No it's this bit. Poor photo but you get the idea. The shit gasket on the right was from a cornflakes packet. I realise now that was a waste of time, particularly as proper gasket paper is only a few quid for several sheets of different grades. LightBulbFun and egg 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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