martc Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Saab freewheel, largely pointless! Not pointless if it's a two stroke SAAB, it stops the engine seizing on long downhill runs. Without a freewheel the engine turns over at 'driving wheel' speed with no throttle and very little lubrication. The freewheel allows the engine to run at idling speed and hence receives enough oil to stay alive. Other two-stroke cars also had freewheels eg the Wartburg. Freewheels on four stroke SAAB's are largely pointless though. Lacquer Peel, Barry Cade, NorfolkNWeigh and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeordieInExile Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Serpentine belt on Saabs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cros Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 The Rodley miniature people carrier (for carrying very small people) was a pretty little thing. Like the RHD Amc Pacer, the steering system used a chain, presumably because a normal system would not be shit enough. cobblers, Skut, Aston Martin and 4 others 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cros Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Freewheels on four stroke SAAB's are largely pointless though.My P4's freewheel isn't completely pointless as it allows you to change gear without using the clutch.I use it quite often if the loss of engine braking isn't a disadvantage, (hills) and there is also the benefit of a small saving in fuel. However I would have much preferred Rover not to have lumbered these cars with an awful gearchange; the lever is adjustable and situated clear of passenger's hooves, but the linkage needed to achieve this makes it unpleasant. The Morris Commercial has an odd mechanical feature in that the company opted to keep the headlamp switch under the bonnet with the engine, and it is operated by a long rod on the steering column. To keep things nice and symmetrical there is a matching lever on the other side for advancing the ignition timing. Sadly I can't use this any more since dizzlifying it. PS. previous owner did that stupid lining on the wheel, not me... One more thing, the headlamp switch also has a 'half charge' position just in case you don't want to fry the battery- no current regulator for the dynamo in 1933. Asimo and martc 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talbot Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Land Rover TD5 engines that ran part of the engine loom through the oily bits. Very common on PD-type engines. VW did this a lot. Ny nomination is the pedal box on a Fiat X1/9. Designed such that the master cylinders for both clutch and brake are completely inaccessable, so to work on either, you have to disconnect (at a specially-fitted junction block) both the brake circuits and the clutch circuit and remove the pedal box complete, and then bleed all three circuits on refitting, which in the case of the clutch circuit is a complete bastard. Genius* design. Also.. Citroen C-Matic gearboxes. Dafuq? Manual shift, torque converter and a ludicrously complex automatically-engaged friction clutch. Combine that with completely unique gear oil/fluid, microswitches that go out of alignment when you sneeze, a "park" position which was just engaging two gears simultaneously which you can accidentally engage on the move, and hey presto! Similar arrangement was available on 1500cc Beetles for a while, but was quickly dropped and barely any survive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tadhg Tiogar Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 .... Citroen C-Matic gearboxes. Dafuq? Manual shift, torque converter and a ludicrously complex automatically-engaged friction clutch. Combine that with completely unique gear oil/fluid, microswitches that go out of alignment when you sneeze, a "park" position which was just engaging two gears simultaneously which you can accidentally engage on the move, and hey presto! Similar arrangement was available on 1500cc Beetles for a while, but was quickly dropped and barely any survive. You made me smile there because automatic workshop boss admitted to me that he owned a Series 1 C-Matic. As he was and is a gearbox specialist, the gearbox was never a problem for him, but he said his CX had the habit of going a certain distance (usually a long way giving no hint of trouble) before cutting out and refusing to restart. That was the only reason why he eventually sold it. Maybe the more elegant solution was the Saxomat clutchless 3-range manual with the clutch actuated by a gearshift trigger switch and vacuum servo, as used in the Ro80, so two-pedal motoring. Very easy to use, but could have done with a 4th gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSdriver Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Peugeot spark extenders, why not use a longer cable?Ooh, those look simpler than the bloody insulation tubes on the DS head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omegod Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Mitsubishi splitter gearbox, so you get to pretend you're driving a lorry I was looking at one of those in a scrappy last week and wondering WTF ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davehedgehog31 Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Instead of your tried and tested ball and socket design lower ball joint, Peugeot came up with this disaster for the 407; The hub has a stub which locates into the middle of this strange upturned bearing, water penetrates it and the whole gubbins ends up fucked in short order. When you remove it the inner race will always remain stuck to the hub and you'll be greeted with this disaster. Junkman, Sir Snipes, Squirrel2 and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tadhg Tiogar Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Instead of your tried and tested ball and socket design lower ball joint, Peugeot came up with this disaster for the 407; ... 'tis the hind foot of a frog! Lacquer Peel, Aston Martin and pshome 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willswitchengage Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Thanks guys, this thread has been so interesting my dinner burnt in the oven as I was reading it. Thanks. Lacquer Peel, Junkman, Stanky and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandeth Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Never made production obviously, but how about the DeLorean swash plate engine? That's got to be worth a mention just in terms of downright odd ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Ny nomination is the pedal box on a Fiat X1/9. Designed such that the master cylinders for both clutch and brake are completely inaccessable, so to work on either, you have to disconnect (at a specially-fitted junction block) both the brake circuits and the clutch circuit and remove the pedal box complete, and then bleed all three circuits on refitting, which in the case of the clutch circuit is a complete bastard. Genius* design. You don't HAVE to remove the pedal box, you can replace either one on it's own, of you take the roof off, and lie upside down below the dash. Done it many times,but it is far easier to just take out the whole lot. The X1/9 had quite a few quirks. Bonded windscreen , bolt on access panel for the distributor, spare wheel behind 1 seat, fuel tank behind the other, discs all round,targa roof,pop up lights and fibre optic switch illumination- all in 1972.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardmorris Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 You don't HAVE to remove the pedal box, you can replace either one on it's own, of you take the roof off, and lie upside down below the dash. Done it many times,but it is far easier to just take out the whole lot. The X1/9 had quite a few quirks. Bonded windscreen , bolt on access panel for the distributor, spare wheel behind 1 seat, fuel tank behind the other, discs all round,targa roof,pop up lights and fibre optic switch illumination- all in 1972..Yes, this is my clutch master being removed without touching the brake cylinder last month. 2hours start to finish! Barry Cade, Aston Martin and Skizzer 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Drop the steering collumn, 5 bolts and gives a hell of a lot more room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardmorris Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Drop the steering collumn, 5 bolts and gives a hell of a lot more room.I suggested that ( following club advice) but rick was keen to not dismantle the car more than necessary. The spring was the big headache! Barry Cade 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cort16 Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Lightening Rods? Skizzer, mercrocker, Aston Martin and 4 others 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delux Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I nominate the little plastic adaptor that used to attach the clutch pedal to the cable on pug 405s and zantias. Being the skinniest in the workshop I changed a lot! I still start rocking back and forward crying if I sit quietly too long. Or the little rubber bit that held the speedo cable in on some pug 205s. If you have never had the joy of fitting one, its like trying to do birthday sex after 12 pints! Alfa sodding selespeed gearboxes! They can design a robotic box thingy to change gear for you but they put them on a gearbox that breaks the bit off the casing and immobilises it. I couldnt bring myself to nick a pic of one as I still have nightmares! Any VW/Audi/Seat/Skoda you need to take the sodding front off to do a timing belt! Well done guys! I dont care how easy it is, I dont have to take the front off other cars to do a belt, why should they get special attention? Oh, and take the 20v engine out a FIAT coupe to do the belt? I'll drive it to the factory and make the designer sodding do it! LDV rear brakes? Whats wrong with 2 shoes, a couple of springs and an adjuster? This is why you are all out of a job now! Finally, who decided the oil filter on Vauxhall Insignia, SAAB etc. diesels should be tucked away above the driveshaft? Great idea guys! My only guess is the designer has shares in the company that makes brake cleaner or blue roll! cobblers, cros and louiepj 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrcento Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I nominate the little plastic adaptor that used to attach the clutch pedal to the cable on pug 405s and zantias. Being the skinniest in the workshop I changed a lot! I still start rocking back and forward crying if I sit quietly too long. Oh, and take the 20v engine out a FIAT coupe to do the belt? I'll drive it to the factory and make the designer sodding do it!Cinquecento's have plastic adaptors as well for clutch cables, little bastards to do. And also the 20v belt job engine out thing is 100% false. That was the Fiat official way of doing it (to milk more money at the stealers), but it can be done in situ with one engine mount off and the engine tilted. Lacquer Peel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forddeliveryboy Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Also.. Citroen C-Matic gearboxes. Logically (though the company had become carried away with ludicrously over-perfect engineering like the rear curly brake pipes wrapped around the antiroll bar inside the axle tube, let alone an Escort rival at near Escort price but with magic suspension, a sublime alloy flat four good for 250k and 8,000rpm), the efficiencies of a regular set of pinions rather than epicyclics, with the benefits of a fluid flywheel and no clutch pedal. It worked well with the smooth, revvy boxer but only 3 gears (they were being lazy not using four) in a CX connected to a slightly wheezy but venerable inline four which had seen service since 1933 (albeit re-jigged in 1965) was less good. I've had C-matics and they were as reliable as the suspension (totally) and utterly superb in cities. Talbot and Lacquer Peel 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrel2 Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Here’s one that I grew up with on father Squirrel’s MG PB midget: An overhead camshaft driven via a three-brush dynamo mounted vertically at the front of the engine. I think only pre-war cars had this arrangement? Squirrel2 Asimo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delux Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Cinquecento's have plastic adaptors as well for clutch cables, little bastards to do. Not had the joy of doing a cinque one. Always wondered why FIAT forgot to fit a proper brake adjuster to them?! 'How do you adjust these shoes?' 'Get me the MIG welder and I'll show you!' We used to service them a lot when they were new as I worked at Arnies and he was practically giving them away. We were told to use special FIAT oil or they would sound like a skeleton having a wa*k in a tin bucket. Few years later, working on Alfas, you had to use special oil in the Mitos or it broke the vvt or something. (I wasnt the Alfa guy there and I struggle to be interested in what others are doing at the best of times!) And also the 20v belt job engine out thing is 100% false. That was the Fiat official way of doing it (to milk more money at the stealers), but it can be done in situ with one engine mount off and the engine tilted. All the same, if its the top jobcard on the pile, I'll be having a sit down pee until I see someone else driving it in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timewaster Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 "Cars with strange mechanics" You should meet my mechanic..... He is very strange. Tadhg Tiogar, Aston Martin and LightBulbFun 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I suggested that ( following club advice) but rick was keen to not dismantle the car more than necessary. The spring was the big headache!LOL, I was tech advisor for the club for a time, probably got more phonecalls about THAT spring than anything else! I had a way of doing it with vice grips that I found easy, but it's impossible to describe... Some people use 2p's! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandeth Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Yes, this is my clutch master being removed without touching the brake cylinder last month. 2hours start to finish!Was that car at the Brill Show a year or so back? Was an X1/9 there in exactly that colour with that interior there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tadhg Tiogar Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Logically (though the company had become carried away with ludicrously over-perfect engineering like the rear curly brake pipes wrapped around the antiroll bar inside the axle tube, let alone an Escort rival at near Escort price but with magic suspension, a sublime alloy flat four good for 250k and 8,000rpm), the efficiencies of a regular set of pinions rather than epicyclics, with the benefits of a fluid flywheel and no clutch pedal. It worked well with the smooth, revvy boxer but only 3 gears (they were being lazy not using four) in a CX connected to a slightly wheezy but venerable inline four which had seen service since 1933 (albeit re-jigged in 1965) was less good. ....Maybe it might have been better with the 2.5litre, but agree that a 4th/overdrive would have been useful. It's certainly needed on the ZF auto. Apparently it's not always compulsory to use Fluide-T - there is an alternative auto trans fluid* that will work, but the C-matic box must be thoroughly flushed out before putting in the new fluid. *Transmax Type F Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quicksilver Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Lightening Rods? I've read and watched videos about this and I still can't fathom outA: How the hell it worksB: What on earth the point of it is Anyone care to elaborate in simple terms? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrcento Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Not had the joy of doing a cinque one. Always wondered why FIAT forgot to fit a proper brake adjuster to them?! 'How do you adjust these shoes?' 'Get me the MIG welder and I'll show you!' We used to service them a lot when they were new as I worked at Arnies and he was practically giving them away. We were told to use special FIAT oil or they would sound like a skeleton having a wa*k in a tin bucket. Few years later, working on Alfas, you had to use special oil in the Mitos or it broke the vvt or something. (I wasnt the Alfa guy there and I struggle to be interested in what others are doing at the best of times!) And also the 20v belt job engine out thing is 100% false. That was the Fiat official way of doing it (to milk more money at the stealers), but it can be done in situ with one engine mount off and the engine tilted. All the same, if its the top jobcard on the pile, I'll be having a sit down pee until I see someone else driving it in! Well that sums up Arnies. Shoes easy enough to do (well as far as shoes go), they are friction adjusted, take the drum off and lever them out. Can be a bit of an arse to get the drum back on if you go a bit ott though!, And they really aren't fussy on oil, the 899's could get a bit tappety when cold because their hydraulics could get a bit gummy. the sportings would run on anything even remotely close to the right spec. I don't have the best history with Arnies and Fiats, i had a sei in for them to look at the petrol tank (trying to get Fiat to pay for it), was gone at the seam, was leaving puddles of petrol on the ground parked on hills, Their tech wouldn't even put it on the ramp, said he had a look underneath sat outside and it was fine, he then told me "even the fuel line is fine"...whilst pointing at brake pipes. delux 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delux Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 'I don't have the best history with Arnies' Neither do I, LOL! 'he then told me "even the fuel line is fine"...whilst pointing at brake pipes.' Think I work with him now! Strange mechanics indeed! I've read and watched videos about this and I still can't fathom outA: How the hell it worksB: What on earth the point of it is Anyone care to elaborate in simple terms? Yeah, couldnt get my head round that on either! Mrcento 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rml2345 Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 http://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk/standrivetransmission.htm mercrocker and Supernaut 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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