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It is just so Super (Sentinel).


JimH

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  • 2 weeks later...

A quick update from the last couple of weeks' work.

 

One of the front axle swivels being fitted up. The big bit in the middle is the axle which turns in the plain bronze bushes. Lubrication of the axle is by grease which is fed down the top of the "king pin" via a copper pipe from a screw down greaser in the cab. Give each grease pot a turn every few miles.

 

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Another view. The taper takes the front hub and then there is a jolly big nut which is rattled up with a very butch impact driver to keep it all together.

 

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The bronze bush is stepped so you have a decent face to take the thrust. Normally these would be cast but when you aren't making many it is more cost efficient just to use cored bar. However, there are still a lot of cuttings. Non-ferrous cuttings get collected and weighed in. This is what the engine and front axle has yielded so far.

 

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Slight change of plan. The was to get rivetted in but we had no confidence that we could weedle white hot rivets into the holes from underneath without making a mess of them or killing ourselves. I suspect in the factory they turned the frames on their sides. We can't do that so the stiffening plate has been bolted in. It's not as if we are going to be towing anything, anyway. The two bits of channel are also bolted down. That is what the water tank is suspended from.

 

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The ash bend is getting there. It's taken a fair bit of bending, cutting, welding and grinding to get it to this stage.

 

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Slowly it starts to look like the piece of 1" thick ash it is meant to be. There is a lot more fettling to go yet but you can only do so much of this before you get bored and do something else for a bit.

 

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After a lot of cutting, grinding, measuring, grinding, trial fitting, grinding, grinding and grinding the boiler is in. Now it starts to look like a steamer. The stub at the top is the chimney base.

 

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And from the rear. The chequer plate is pretty much the area of the cab so you start to get a feel for how much of the cab is filled with a very large, very hot boiler. It tends to dominate the interior almost as much as the centre console does in a Panamera. The red box is the feed heater. I know it looks like it is just sitting there but the footplate has been cut to take the varius tappings and fixings on the bottom. The large piece of channel at the rear is temporary. That will be replaced with a large piece of oak.

 

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All neat and tidy round the footplate. Bottom angle is on to stay on hopefully. When these things were built production engineering was in its infancy and companies like Sentinel struggled to engineer their way out of a paper bag at times. This means that fits and tolerances tend to be a little wouldn't hold small coal. Historically inaccurate possibly but the thought of having gapping holes around the boiler mounts offended me. The boiler will need to come out once everything is piped up so it can be lagged.

 

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The wood for the cab has been ordered. That was pretty painful.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Another update. First some revision. This is the engine suspension plate - what used to pass for an engine mount was a large slab of 3/8" plate stamped to shape. We don't have a very large press and nor do we have the wherewithal to make the dies for the sake of two bits so they need to be fabricated. Get some 3/8 plate waterjet cut to the right shape and then fold some 1/2" flat bar around the edge. Now sit down and burn some rods into it to keep things in place. Then get some half round section and weld these in place to replicate the stiffening ribs that were pressed into it. Once you have done this then do it again because you need two of them. What you end up with is something like this...

 

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Which is pretty close but not there yet. Now lay them to one side because you are bored of welding and grinding and do something else instead. Allow job to mature for a few months and then go back to it. Now you sit down with a range of grindning discs, cutting dics, burrs, stones and flapwheels and you make it look pretty. Finally finish of with as thin as you can manage filler to take out any minor imperfections. And then you end up with this. It doesn't look it in this photo but that filler is near non-existent. Irritatingly it looks like we're some sort of back street bodgers.

 

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And then you do it again because there are two of them. Now the suspension plates are done you probably noticed that it is possible to fit the engine. And that is the other big advance over the last couple of weeks. It now has an engine partially installed. It should now be a lot more clear about how it is set out. There is a sprocket on each end of the crankshaft that drives each back wheel on a dead axle. Note empty coffee mug. There is no heating in the big shed and it was brass monkeys this weekend.

 

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When the chassis rails were drilled they were welded together and drilled as a pair so everything slipped in just spot on. This is very handy because moving a ton of engine around is best avoided. It is only partially installed because the front end is sitting on blocks. The sprockets are on just as a sanity check to allow us to stike a line down the chassis to super double check everything was lying square.

 

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The front engine mount is a bit involved so that is on the jobs to do list. The bit of 4" channel you see sitting above the engine in the picture up the page is part of it. There are also gusset plates to make and stiffening bars to bend up for it. Then the whole lot hangs on two 1/2" bolts.

 

And from the rear. See the two bits of bar sticking up? That was this weekend's effort.

 

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The cab is constructed along very similar lines to any of the great coachbuilders using techniques learned over generations of coach design for road and rail. Few realise that the cab of the Super Sentinel is very close in design and quality to the Gold State Coach. Oh no, my mistake. You know those sheds that B&Q try to sell you? The ex-demo models that were nailed together by the work experience kid? Yeah, well that kid would think the Super's cab was a bit jerry built.

 

We've done the footplate and ash bend so now we need to join them together and we do this with three bits of 1/4" flat bar. First get them bent in a press brake to the right angle. Then get them done again because the company you trusted with the work couldn't read a drawing. Now you have the uprights you need to fit them so start heating and hitting things to get the right shape. The sides are relatively easy so twist out the bottom of the upright unitil it is straight again. Now bolt the upright to the bottom angle. Sentinel considered this mess to be an acceptable method of construction.

 

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There is five feet of bar above that joint. Quality, eh? And yes I know all the bolts are too long. This is a first fit.

 

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The front is harder because there is a dog-leg in it half way up. In period these would have been forged but we had to resort to cutting and welding. The countersunk set screws are temporary. They will be replaced with rivets as soon as they arrive.

 

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Once you have cut and welded and ground and twisted it int the right shape you need to do it again because there is a second section at the back to stiffen it up.

 

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By now it is Saturday evening and just before you knock off you mount all three uprights only to find that in the morning you picked up the wrong upright to work on so what you have done is made some very pretty things to go in the scrap bucket. This means that tomorrow you are going to have to do it all again. This is very depressing. The pictures above are of the right ones rather than the wrong ones. There's nothing like wasting a day to put you in a happy place. Check twice, cut once eh?

 

The next thing to do is work out how to square everything up and then balance the ash bend up there while it gets fitted. None of this is going to be easy.

 

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In other news large mounts of swarf get produced. It should be on its front wheels in the not too distant future.

 

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With a bit more luck we should need to traipse down to Staffordshire this week to pick up large amounts of oak, poplar and ash to make the cab and roof. Then it will really look like a Super.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Been having to do some work and stuff of late so been a couple of weeks since the last update.

 

Firstly, here is the front support for the engine. 22 off 5/8" bolts, some 4" channel, 5/16" thick gusset plates and a couple of bits of 1/2" thick plate cut to form the stiffeners. All to hang the engine from 2 1/2" whit studs. It is not difficult to see why Sentinel kept going bust. 

 

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And from the front. It's a lot of metal to do not very much.

 

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Work on the front axle continues. Near side...

 

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And offside. There is a bit of an update which you can't see that replaces the large bronze thrust face for the swivel with a modern ball thrust race. When they changed from solids to pneumatics it sent the geometry to cock and made the steering much heavier. A ball thrust race on the swivel helps lighten things up a little.

 

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We were lent a pattern for the steam brake cylinder so this will get taken to the foundry.

 

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And we picked up the last few bits for the fire grates and a clack valve body casting.

 

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And the front apron got cut and fitted. Two words. Fucking and nightmare. This took a couple of days to do and it isn't there yet. Also note ash bend lifted into place. That wasn't easy either. Sorry about the odd angle but there was something in the way.

 

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Once the ash bend is in place you can start finalising things like the top of the uprights.

 

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And then comes the bogey job. This is something that has exercised us for about 25 years. The last time we did one of these we had a tin basher who knew his stuff do this bit but in the spirit of self-improvement we'll have to do it ourselves this time. I need to get better at tinbashing anyway. I'll labour this bit because it is probably about the only thing relevant to AS.

 

What you have is a curved front plate and a windscreen that is a straight line bewteen the uprights. This leaves you a very odd shape to fill in. My spacial awareness is less than good and it makes my head hurt to look at it. Fill that gap in there. Ignore the bits of angle and studding. That's just form work to allow me to get stuff square.

 

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The shape of the cheek plates is critical to make these things look right. But is is OK because we have a drawing from the Sentinel archive. This should tell us everything we need to know.

 

 

 

Well, we'll see...

 

So you look at the job and you think and you look and then your head hurts so you just decide to make a start. Job one. Make a development as shown in the drawing. Only I'll do it in a bit of scrap 0.6mm ali sheet to test the theory. Then you come up against the first problem. You see that development drawing? Well it's bollocks. This leaves you looking at a bit of rolled up aluminium wondering where to go. Then in a flash of inspiration it dawns on you that it can be treated as three separate sections so you grab the tinsnips and start bending things over your knee to help you visualise stuff and you end up with this.

 

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Yes I know it is a mess but that's not really the point. It got it straight in my head where I was going with it. So we need three bits of steel biffed and bashed and welded together. Off we go. First bit of 18 gauge.

 

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And you roll and you hammer and you hammer some moreuntil the metal starts to go in the right direction. This is the stage that you look at what you have done and weep because it looks for all the world like some maniac has attacked a bit of sheet steel with a ball pein hammer. There is probably a reason for that. However, keep the faith because with a lot more biffing it will start to look alright. I hope. It is a bit hard to see in this picture but there is a curve on the apron which is why I was trying to stretch the metal to match it. 

 

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That's one side so now do the other end to seeif you are going in the right direction. Now we're getting somewhere. That just leaves the bit in the middle.

 

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Now the one thing I thought could be trusted on the drawings was the 9" radius. That's what I had been working to.So you leather hell out of a bit of sheet to beat a compound curve into it with a 9" radius. This is what I ended up with. The middle section has already had a fair bit of working so it looked reasonably right. The bottom edge is all over the place because there is plenty of spare on it.

 

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So now you have three bits you break out the gas welder and start butting things together. I find this a bit of a struggle because I am not blessed with the steadiest hands in the world. I was only tacking it at this point.

 

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To the untrained (and my) eye this looks not bad at all so you are feeling pretty good to have made this progress and you take a step back to admire your work and see how things look.

 

The answer was that it looked complete shite. Not even a little bit right. The drawing further up the page is a complete work of fiction. There is then a clang as two days' work lands in the scrap pile. Bollocks.

 

A few days' later we manage to get hold of a very dog eared one to copy. At least I've had some practice now. Fortunately the curves are much more shallow than I had been making so things won't need to be hit as much.

 

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We wasted a day this week to drive down south to pick up the wood for the cab. As discussed elsewhere on here there is some oak for the bearers and frame, ash for the roof beams (we're going to need to learn how to steam bend it) and a large pile of poplar for the back, sides and roof. Not going to be stuck for something to do for a while.

 

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Lastly a couple of semi-insteresting S bits. After taking it out for a run a couple of weeks ago we became suspicious that not everything was tickety boo in the transmission case (which is actually just another bit of the crankcase. The boring answer was that there was insufficient float in the bottom gear layshaft. A two minute job to sort out. Pop the end cover off, set the float, pop it back on. But first remove the flywheel. That involves removing the propshaft and that involves shifting the rear axle back by three inches. *Bangs head*

 

This is the propshaft. Those who know their lorries might appreciate the torque it has been specced for. That is a five ton bottle jack sitting next to it which should gie an idea of scale. One person cannot lift it.

 

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And a quick look insode what used to pass for a gearbox. The lever you see at the back is the linkage for the variable valve timing.

 

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Hopefully the next update will have some slightly more positive news.

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We wasted a day this week to drive down south to pick up the wood for the cab. As discussed elsewhere on here there is some oak for the bearers and frame, ash for the roof beams (we're going to need to learn how to steam bend it) and a large pile of poplar for the back, sides and roof. Not going to be stuck for something to do for a while.

 

Wear gloves, or grow asbestos skin. :D
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Didn't one of our boat building members steam some planks for a rowboat recently? Squirrel2 I think it was. Somewhere in the boatshite thread anyway, they made a steamer out of a wallpaper stripper I think.

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That seems to be a deal. Make a former so you have something to clamp your bendy bit of wood to then make a steamer using a wallpaper stripper and a length of 4" uPVC drain pipe. Leave the wood in the steamer to stew for a couple of hours then whip it out, clamp it to the former and leave it for three days to sort itself out.

 

Simplicity itself. What could possibly go wrong?

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  • 4 weeks later...

Things are a bit slow at present. The S took a while to finally sort out and I am not the most confident woodworker - particularly when it comes to doing actual things to expensive bits of proper wood. So a bit of an update...

 

Some 24" rimz that have come back from the blasters. Those who know there stuff will sneer because the hole pattern is far too late. These will go on the rear where they aren't too noticeable and there will be a pair of two hole rims for the front. However, these will do as a starting point. This type of rim has the bead held in place with a separate spring ring which I really don't like working with. It's probably down to watching Bert Tilsley blowing himself up all those years ago.

 

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And to go with the wheelsthere is now a pair of 40x8s. These have been a massive problem for years and everyone has been scratching around with whatever could be found. A while back BF Goodrich started remanufacturing 40x8s in the US but by the time these have been bought through the sole UK distributor the costs are eye watering. Around about £1200 each with a tube and flap. Then some chap got them remanufactured in China and went to the effort of getting them type approved for sale in the EU. The cost including a tube and flap is very much lower then the BF tyre. They don't look as good but we will cope with that.

 

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Close up of the tread. A bit fifties but never mind. They are also spoiled by needing the modern day warnings written on them for type approval. Come the revolution etc etc.

 

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The bronze bushes for the front swivels getting a final fitting before being glued in place. The modern  ball thrust bearing is our modification in an attempt to lighted the steering a fraction but you can't see it once it's all been assembled.

 

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These arrived from Vintage Wings and Radiators this morning. It's one of a pair of the front wings. These are made to the Sentinel pattern and (although it is hard to make out in the picture) a flattened off leading edge and the trailing edge it straight rather than radiused. V W and R are recommended as someone to speak to if you want something like this at a very reasonable price. 

 

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I have no idea what I am doing with this shit.

 

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I've even got a marking knife with Japanese writing on it because that is what people who know what they are doing have. Despite this I still have no idea what I am up to.

 

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But first an ash bend lifted back into place. One of the things that's been done since the last update is that this was lifted down and finished off. This involved a lot more welding, grinding, sanding and stress relieving to get it looking the part. Just as I was about to refit the thing I had a recollection of balancing on a ladder trying to wrestle a very long length of D beading when we built the last one. It occurred to me that a repeat of this trauma could be avoided if the D beading was fitted now. This was a painfully slow task but it was easier doing it with both feet on the ground. 

 

Looking up at the finished D section. Yes you can see screwheads. The beading needs to come off to allow the cloth covering the roof to be tucked under it then the heads will be ground flush and filled.

 

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And at the side upright. This all seems to have come tegether all neat and tidy.Once this is painted you won't know it's steel. Should hang together somewhat better than the original design, however.

 

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When you are doing these jobs you never, ever have enough clamps.

 

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Starting to build up the frame at the back of the cab. As far as I can make out the joints are just meant to be lap joints which is good because if it were anything more difficult then I'd be buggered. The top rail isn't in this picture because it is a lump of 6x2 oak which has a 17 foot radius cut on the top face to give the roof the right curve, We only have a band saw for cutting wood and the chance of getting it looking better than crap was non-existent. Since everything is going to be painted we can live with some water staining so the beam went off to Jet Cut to be water jet cut. At least that was it will be right if a little blackened in places. Hopefully this will be picked up this very afternoon. Aye, water jet cutting oak. I can hear the proper chippies pissing themselves laughing from here.

 

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Another bright idea was to make the sides of the ash bend hollow so the boards have their ends rebated so they slip inside while the outer faces are flush. This approach worked well on the last one so it should be OK this time. The channel on top is just pulling a slight bend out. The ash bend is also too long. Once I am happy everything is right I'll cut it to length.

 

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Come on. Be a bit impressed with this. For a woodwroking divot I was reasonably happy with it. The plan was to glue the lap joints with Cascamite and fit a few screws. There are then various fillets, gussets and brackets to try to keep things together. 

 

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And that will do for now. A lot more chiselling and swearing to go.

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This type of rim has the bead held in place with a separate spring ring which I really don't like working with. It's probably down to watching Bert Tilsley blowing himself up all those years ago.

I'll just let Bruce here ramble about them, get interrupted by a cute dog, then explain why you never want to go near them.

 

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This type of rim has the bead held in place with a separate spring ring which I really don't like working with. It's probably down to watching Bert Tilsley blowing himself up all those years ago.

I'll just let Bruce here ramble about them, get interrupted by a cute dog, then explain why you never want to go near them.

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Lost a couple of weekends but gained a few evenings. However, for a number of reasons progress has been a little slow. On the up side it is starting to look a lot like a Super now.

 

More bronze for front axle bushes. Start with a big lump of bronze and keep turning it down to make a bush with a nice large thrust face. This is both expensive and time consuming but it is cheaper than making patterns for them and getting them cast. The front axle bushes are massive so they are made in three pieces.

 

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So you turn and turn and turn and you end up with something that is pretty close to the mark. However, the fit on these has to be pretty good so you then devote many hours to fitting them to the shaft. Plenty of blueing and scraping to get them just so.

 

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And you end up with something that looks like this. This one is the centre bush.

 

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Once they are all done they are then glued into the swivel. Once upon a time these would be shrunk in and then finish bored but that is old hat (and ideally you need a supply of liquid nitrogen) so modern adhesives make things so much easier. 

 

A pair of wheels ready for some tyres. These aren't massively pretty but they are the inside rears. We just need something now to set the front axle up.

 

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Meanwhile I've been doing woodwork which is not my favourite thing and I find rather stressful. My valued life partner whose opinion I cherish has asked "why the fuck do you do it then" and it is very difficult to argue with that.

 

When we last saw the cab it was a series of bits of oak with various dry joints to make the frame. At that point it became necessary to break out the glue and start joining things in a permananent try not to ruin it sort of way. I assembled the frame on the floor, took a deep breath and glued it together. Then I took all that poplar and started screwing it to the frame. Then I realised I hadn't taken many pictures so there has been a bit of a jump.

 

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Normally these were made with a rear window that was used for tipping coal into the bunker but this is getting a large van body on it so there is no need for the window. Once the back was made there was then the distressing job of trying to get everything in the right place. Having a clue would help but in abscence of that I just spent hours on it measuring and fretting. The curve at the top is a 17 foot radius. It is also absolutely spot on. I know this because we cheated and had the oak water jet cut. The chippies in the audience can stop laughing now. The only downside of this (apart from a complete loss of face) is that the oak gets stained which is why it looks a funny colour. This doesn't matter because it is all being painted.

 

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Then it was time to make the side (or wing as Sentinel called it) and with much chiselling and fretting and measuring it looked like this. It has taken a few weeks to get it to this point.

 

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That beading around the cut out took an age to do because you have to bend it hot around a former. We had a former lying around from the last one so that got dug out, tidied up, pull up a bead and find out that it is the wrong size. You then need to find sone 1/4" plate and burn out a 24" semi circle to make a former of the correct size. Now pull up two beads to the right size. Put them back to back and drill and tap them. This takes forever. Once the side is in place, fit the bead and use it as a guide to cut out the "window". Quick to say, painfully slow to do because they have to be spot on. Any cock up here would be very noticeable.

 

The ash bend to wing joint doesn't look too bad. There is one little trim piece left to go in where you see the gap at the top which is why the top of the bead isn't screwed in place. The holes in the beads will be filled in with longer screws which are caulked over and then filed flush. The socket head set screws around the top bead are temporary which is why they look rubbish. The boards are rebated and slip inside the ash bend to keep things in place a little better. Can you see my plugged holes on the back board? I hope not.

 

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And from inside - the plate at the top fixes the ash bend to the side. There are no bolts in it yet because the plate is welded to the ash bend. I used this plate to pull a slight bow out of the bend. It's quite pretty wood this poplar. It's almost a shame to paint it.

 

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Close up of the beadings on the outside. The thing is covered in this stuff trying to finish off rough edges. There must be a good hundredweight of D beading on the thing in total.

 

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And that is it. Not a lot to show for a fair few man hours. Next is the offside wing, put the floor boards in and then build the seats.

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It is and the stuff we bought is lovely but we really aren't equipped with the kit to cut a 17 foot radius on something seven feet long. It's that curve which shapes the whole roof and we were not confident we could get it spot on.

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  • 1 month later...

It's been a while since the last update mainly because of stuff and sailing and other stuff and shit. Firstly the LDV sort of died and needed replaced so a Mk7 Transit tipper was purchased. The RSG tail lift was taken off the LDV and the tipper body was removed from the Transit so the tail lift can go on it. Tail lifts are about the handiest things known to man kind and the RSG one is very flash. God bless the Home Office (or MOD) for speccing them in the first place. Here's the tail lift finally on the Transit. It took quite a bit of effort to manufacture and fit new mountings suitable for the somewhat different Transit. The platform is off getting blasted at the moment so this will be back soon. Once that is on the new flat bed can be fitted.

 

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And then there was this thing here. I know I may be treading on some people's toes here but when I rule the World I am going to have every last one of these crushed. It really is time to close the book on them.

 

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Hmmm.

 

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Double hmmmm.

 

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So apart from Transits and Series 3s with engines they really shouldn't have what has been done? Finally the front axle bushes were fitted and the axles have gone off for nitriding. First dry fit of the swivels on the beam.

 

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And the other side...

 

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Now the steering arms can be bent to the right shape and then drilled for the track rod ends. This will finally allow the track rod ends to be finished. The fittings on the top of the swivel are a modification to allow automatic greasers to be installed somewhere discrete. Keeping the front axles lubricated over long distances is a bit hit and miss using the original set up so some modern grease pots should do the trick.

 

A few things have happened to the cab but it is painfully slow going. A combination of being fiddly and me being a woodworking benny means that things take forever.

 

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And the offside has grown a side. Things get really depressing now because stuff is supposed to be symetrical and when it isn't you start getting upset and depressed. Note the use of the body jack holding things in the right place while other things are built.

 

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A stoker's seat with non-standard emergency seat at the rear. The battery and front axle greasers will live under this. The more I see it the prettier the poplar looks. It's going to be a bit sad to paint it all a dull beige colour. The plugs haven't been sanded down yet with is why they are still a little noticeable. The countersunk screws holding the D beading in place are ground down and filled so you don't see them either.

 

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There is a leather clad seat cushion to be made for the seats. Looks cosy, yeah?

 

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The driver's seat under construction. This is much wider then the stoker's one because the drive sits inboard by quite a way. That is because the handbrake and reversing lever sit bewteen the driver and the door. That is the quadrant for the levers sitting in about the right place.

 

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I cut the final shape of the side of the seat once everything is in place. That makes it easier to make things up as I go along. You might also note that the driver's seat sits back a little further. This is also to clear the control levers.

 

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Slowly slowly things start looking tidier. Note oak floor boards now in place.

 

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And that is about it. To make matters worse the sun has come out now so there is less excuse not to do stuff on houses. We'll get there.

 

Oh yeah, there was one other thing. Found out that the valve seats on the S were suffering from pitting that bloody well shouldn't be happening. Take the heads off, re-cut the seats, lap things back in and put it back together. All good but it all takes time. A crap photo of a headless S engine.

 

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It's all back together now so threw a fire in it yesterday to test it. Find out that the engine is spot on but the auxilliary unit (the one with the lubricator, generator and tyre pump) still isn't right so there is something else to do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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