Car mags... do you bother now?

[bramz7]

Is it the mags annoying you or just having to go to Braintree?

Neither thankfully...more of an issue where they're going to go

[lesapandre]

We live in strange times. We want what we want and we want it for nothing. Magazines have to cater to the popular demands to stay afloat - yes this is understandable, the most popular (and profitable) YouTube channels are the ones that cater to the largest audience. You can get articles that tantalise your own peccadillos on the internet for free. What’s the problem?

Well, what you get is an ever powerful circle of conformation bias. By only getting what you’re interested in, you miss out on a whole world of information on subjects you wouldn’t dream about reading. Your opinions become unchallenged, your mind becomes set in its ways. Take the mgb for example. They are popular so they appear heavily in the classic car press. They appear heavily in the press so remain popular. Round and round it goes leaving many a creditable alternative forgotten and unloved barring the occasional “ man restores rare and unknown car”.

Well how do you combat it? Well you’ve got this site, haven’t you? Well yes and no. Autoshite caters for, dare we say, the fringes of motoring culture but don’t we fall into the same trap with conformation bias don’t we? Think this way, or buy this rotten shit heap or piss off to piston heads. Same thing just a different subject matter.

The only way to counter this is proper old school journalism. Articles that are well written, takes you on a journey, entertains, informs but most importantly is allowed to challenge the status quo. But this doesn’t come cheap. People have to eat, printers have to be paid and you can’t rely on popularity to pay the bills if you’re going to say “ you know what you honk about a subject? Well you’re possibly wrong. And here’s why I think you’re wrong”

I don’t blame anyone who currently writes for this situation - it’s a tough job to continually churn out piece after piece, research, check, rewrite etc. It’s a full time job to do that and do it well. The depth of knowledge of those can only be gained through doing this day in, day out. But they have to pay the bills, they have to eat, hey have to have a roof over their heads. This is what you pay for. This depth of knowledge, this craft, this skill.

So you all have a choice. Pay money to people who are willing to provide you with something of quality or get tons of popular, same old same old stuff for little or even free?

There is still a place for quality journalism. Economist etc. Some of the decline in general 'motoring' mags may be the change in attitude to cars (disposable white goods for a lot of people) and that there is so much more going on or attracting attention so circulations are not what they were?

 

I first bought Thoroughbred and Classic Car Magazine in 1976 - very good at the time. Jonathan Wood wrote for them. 

 

Nice thread this thanks.

[PiperCub]

Now and for the last few years I only bother with Plactical Crassics & Car  Maniacs.

 

The former I bought since 1987 and while I agree with some of the above comments, it's still a very readable mag and IMO the best of the bunch, they seem to steer clear of 'Investment' talk which is refreshing. Someone commented about the stuff they featured being too modern, I'd disagree, you need to move with the times, you can't keep babbling on about Minors, Mini's and MGB's forever, things move on, so do peoples tastes. I think they do a good mix of the old, the slightly unusual and the more modern (15-20 y/old) so I'm fairly happy with the mag on the whole. (Still have all of them).

 

The latter (CM) I've bought for a similar time but here I'm less happy, again, you need to move with the times but I often find I have little interest in many of the cars they feature as they are too new for me. The projects tend to be interesting on the whole but it'd be nice if they could feature really cheap mini-project cars like they used to do occasionally (fave was the Ren 4 they did). I've toyed with the idea of binning this mag off, only buying it if there's something I want to read in it. Not sure at the moment.

 

Bought Practical Performance Car for a few years too, quite good at the start, a bit like a modern CCC, kind of got a bit silly eventually (V8's in everything) so stopped. Retro cars was good at the start too but went downhill similarly with really stupid mods to old cars.

 

I used to buy several others on occasion (for the same reason - flicked thro' and saw something worth reading), CCC - when it was still about, The Automobile, Classic motorcycle mechanics (that used to be good in the 90's & early 2000's), Classic van & pick-up amongst others but seldom bother now. 

 

I miss Jalopy & the old UMG! Bought every one of them & still have them. 

[forddeliveryboy]

I also bought a few copies of Fast Lane - what happened to this?

Was it absorbed into Performance Car? I bought a couple of copies of FL, it was very 80s indeed, complete with that Clark son character istr.

[artdjones]

Restoring Classic Cars started as an offshoot of Car Mechanics called Classic Car Mechanics which was published quarterly.The original title was better because the ideas and talent were spread across 4 issues a year instead of 12.But the publishers at the time, which was the late 80s classic boom,saw an opportunity to make more money.When the boom folded,so did the mag.

[dollywobbler]

I think one of the biggest problems is that classic car buyers have changed, just as modern car buyers have. No one would buy a new car magazine written by someone like Setright today, because the engineering doesn't bother them in the slightest. Frankly all folk seem to care about is looks and whether their i-phone will connect to it. Even practicality seems way down the list of desirables. Toilet motoring.

 

But I think classic cars are going the same way. While some buy them for the engineering, some buy them simply because they remind them of yesteryear, or they think it's pretty. MGBs don't particularly excite engineers, but they excite plenty of people who just want a rorty exhaust note and a driving experience that isn't too horrible (I know stories of people buying T-Type Midget projects, then being horrified when they actually drove it for the first time). No-one busy a bleedin' Ford for the engineering. It has become more about the experience of owning said car. The memories they evoke. 

 

It allows clueless oiks such as myself to write for a living. I can do history, I can do experience, but I can't do a detailed technical analysis, and you wouldn't want to rebuild an engine the way I would. 

[Bren]

Car mechanics I have bought for 25 years. Say not the same since Ted Connolly passed, plus as cars become for difficult to work on I am finding there is less in the mag of relavance to me.

[Tadhg Tiogar]

.....Bought Practical Performance Car for a few years too, quite good at the start, a bit like a modern CCC, kind of got a bit silly eventually (V8's in everything) so stopped. Retro cars was good at the start too but went downhill similarly with really stupid mods to old cars....

The WH Smith branches that I go into have long stopped stocking Retro Cars to the point that I wonder if the magazine is still alive, although some have Retro Fords on the shelf. Retro BMW had a fairly long life, but that also seems to have died a death - I suppose there's a limit to how many E30s and E36s the readership can take.

 

Performance French disappeared from shelves here last year, being very heavy on the moderns and very light on the really old stuff.

 

I'd be interested in PPC if I could find a back issue from the 1990s featuring a CX.....

[PiperCub]

Restoring Classic Cars started as an offshoot of Car Mechanics called Classic Car Mechanics which was published quarterly.The original title was better because the ideas and talent were spread across 4 issues a year instead of 12.But the publishers at the time, which was the late 80s classic boom,saw an opportunity to make more money.When the boom folded,so did the mag.

 

I remember this RCC mag! 've still got a fair few issues. It was quite glossy but interesting. Think it folded in the early 90's.

[dollywobbler]

The WH Smith branches that I go into have long stopped stocking Retro Cars to the point that I wonder if the magazine is still alive, although some have Retro Fords on the shelf. Retro BMW had a fairly long life, but that also seems to have died a death - I suppose there's a limit to how many E30s and E36s the readership can take.

 

Performance French disappeared from shelves here last year, being very heavy on the moderns and very light on the really old stuff.

 

I'd be interested in PPC if I could find a back issue from the 1990s featuring a CX.....

Retailers are making life very hard for the smaller magazines. Costs a ton of money to acquire shelf space, and many retailers are reducing the amount of space on offer.

[panhard65]

I have had classic and sportscar on subscription for the last few years as reading material whilst I am waiting at the mot station. I find it takes me about 3 mot's to read it all, even with all the ads for expensive shit I could never afford there is plenty to read. They also have some decent writers (Andrew Roberts gets a bit repetative mind) and cover interesting cars that most of us could never afford. I tried practical classics but that will last maybe one mot so is poor value and it tends to go on about cars that have been written about so many times it gets boring. The technical stuff isn't even interesting as it is so basic and the same old crap all the time. C&SC now tend to write more about the history of the cars in the features which to me is far more interesting than how bad the understeer was when new compared to a Cortina. Oh and another reason I don't like PC is they never did pay my fuel costs when I took my old Renault Fregate for a photo shoot and don't get me started on the promise of lunch (Bacon sarnie, can of coke and a kit kat). 

[dollywobbler]

Oh and another reason I don't like PC is they never did pay my fuel costs when I took my old Renault Fregate for a photo shoot and don't get me started on the promise of lunch (Bacon sarnie, can of coke and a kit kat). 

 

I can honestly say that I have never paid fuel costs for people bringing cars to shoots. We entirely rely on the goodwill of those involved. Is that wrong? Probably, but then budgets have always been tight the entire time I've been in the industry. There are times I didn't get paid for my fuel, and I was a staffer! Used to drive me mad that one publisher would insist on us using pool cars or even hire cars rather than pay us to drive our own cars. So, instead of turning up at a dealer in my 2CV or Austin Westminster, I'd be in a Peugeot 3008 or something else entirely awful. The BMW X5 sticks out as one of the most unpleasant experiences.

[brownnova]

Another ‘former magazine reader’ here...

 

I used to be an avid Top Gear magazine teenager back in the 90s, before a friend gave me Practical Classics and Car Restorer back issues and I was hooked! I subscribed to Craptical Plastics for a few years and bought it regularly for a few more...

 

But i drifted away from it due to increased advertising and lower quality content. It does seem to have raised its game a little again of late, but then again I haven’t bought a copy for months. Maybe I’ll pick one up...

 

I tried Retro cars briefly it was entertaining, Modern classics I bought two and it was one of a few magazines I didn’t like. Retro Japanese I enjoy when I can get hold of it (not arse kissing Ian, I genuinely do), and I think that’s the thing I always enjoy reading magazines but the time I would have spent reading magazines now goes elsewhere.

 

Partly that’s career/life taking over, but partly that’s because I prefer reading Autoshite to reading mags. The time I would have spent on PC in the past now goes on AS. It’s more entertaining, more real, better sagas (staff cars was always my favourite bits on the magazines) and also... free and no ads!

 

I’ll continue buying mags irregularly, usually during holidays from work, but not as much as I used to much as I do enjoy them. Maybe when I retire in thirty something years if magazines still exist I’ll read them again!

[lesapandre]

I have had classic and sportscar on subscription for the last few years as reading material whilst I am waiting at the mot station. I find it takes me about 3 mot's to read it all, even with all the ads for expensive shit I could never afford there is plenty to read. They also have some decent writers (Andrew Roberts gets a bit repetative mind) and cover interesting cars that most of us could never afford. I tried practical classics but that will last maybe one mot so is poor value and it tends to go on about cars that have been written about so many times it gets boring. The technical stuff isn't even interesting as it is so basic and the same old crap all the time. C&SC now tend to write more about the history of the cars in the features which to me is far more interesting than how bad the understeer was when new compared to a Cortina. Oh and another reason I don't like PC is they never did pay my fuel costs when I took my old Renault Fregate for a photo shoot and don't get me started on the promise of lunch (Bacon sarnie, can of coke and a kit kat). 

I agree. I have a few copies of C&SC. Its nice to read really well written and researched articles on diverse cars and the history of them. I think there is a place for that still and some really outstanding photographs. Cars you'd never see otherwise. It's a bit full of dealer tat but that pays for the journalists I suppose. Overall good stuff. I would not want it regularly and my current copies were 20p from our local charity shop.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

At least with C&SC, there's plenty of it. Buckley's stuff is always pretty good and he says what needs to be said. Mick Walsh has the pre war stuff pretty much sewn up and knows his stuff. C&SC has been dragged up by Octane to appeal to the exalted level of the seriously moneyed and that's spoilt it for me. It used to be neck and neck with Thoroughbred and Classic Cars but I think they've both gone in slightly the wrong direction. For me, anyway.

 

Nobody ever pays owners fuel money for turning up - owners do it for the glory, simple as that. 

[SierraMikeHotel]

Last time I was in France I bought an issue of Auto Plus Classiques (I usually get a Gazoline when I'm over there but didn't see one) and I really liked it.  It's not in-depth at all, no engine rebuilds, but it was imaginative and fun with the sort of writing that DW describes, to evoke the memories rather than the technical details.

 

 

The hatchback feature was silly and fun, with people dressed up in '70s clothes testing how good each car is at a family picnic, but the 403 v DS feature was much more serious, a really interesting read about the merits of two very different contemporaneous cabriolets.

 

I remember it featuring a short graphic novella about a Jag XJS or similar, something that I've never seen over here (but then graphic novels are more popular in France).

 

Look at that too - 10+ pages of classified ads!  The French internet is laughably crap but at least it means that local papers and classified ads survive.

[iainrcz]

I used to buy loads of magazines.

Sadly not bought any for a few years, I tend to use t'internet.

 

What was the newspaper type classic car mag?

I can't remember the name, used to get that one a fair bit.

 

Sent from my VFD 710 using Tapatalk

[lesapandre]

The weekly La Vie de l' AUTO is also pretty good. And still with classified ads. Ditto your comments about the French internet.

[lesapandre]

The weekly La Vie de l' AUTO is also pretty good. And still with classified ads. Ditto your comments about the French internet.

One is Classic Car Weekly. I gave up on it - just so dull and badly written. There is Classic Car Buyer which is better by quite a bit - but again I don't bother. La Vie de l'Auto is the French equivalent- much better with pretty diverse coverage and a good 'what's on' listing. Usually a lot on but pretty spread out geographically. So a lot of travel given the size of France.

[Tadhg Tiogar]

Retailers are making life very hard for the smaller magazines. Costs a ton of money to acquire shelf space, and many retailers are reducing the amount of space on offer.

 

Doesn't seem to have affected the model railway magazines, which arguably are a smaller industry than cars of an age....

[Tadhg Tiogar]

At least with C&SC, there's plenty of it. Buckley's stuff is always pretty good ....

Martin Buckley, who from certain angles starts to look a bit like that actor fella Martin Shaw, will always have a place here at the back of my mind, purely because he isn't afraid to own and run a Ro80 (he's had two) and because he likes getting stuck into unfashionable, but actually quite elegant, big cars - see Fiat 130 and Lancia Gamma coupes.

 

Nobody ever pays owners fuel money for turning up - owners do it for the glory, simple as that.

Besides, imagine how much fuel was burnt for the 6-Series rolling road test in Retro BMW. No magazine could ever have afforded to pay out of petty cash for that!

[lesapandre]

Buying mags here in S. London is more difficult these days. Our Tesco went from one long aisle (both sides) to a smaller zone by the tills. Our local Smiths closed - and most 'newsagents' have very little range these days.

[barrett]

 The economics of a magazine about obscure stuff don't really stack up - I'd be amazed if The Automobile is really that profitable, but I applaud the fact it exists. It feels more like a magazine put together by people who care about the content, and not a lot else. It exists in its own beautiful niche. (albeit stuff usually too old or valuable for us lot).

 

It wouldn't be published if it wasn't profitable. I would say it's probably more profitable, comparatively, than Octane, which I'm pretty sure is subsidised by the publishers, although obviously the turnover is much, much higher at Octane. It's relatively easy to make money if everything is done on a shoestring...

[oldcars]

I get some from time to time. I like Practical classics, the two weekly papers are good. I tend to get one if i have attended a show or something and there is bits in. I got a Mechanics one free at the NEC last November. That was brilliant, but i can't see it in any of the local shops.

[artdjones]

I may be repeating myself,but magazines edited by Peter Simpson have usually gone downhill after he's left.You could say that he's the Sam Allardyce of the classic motoring scene.

[stonedagain]

I don't buy mags these days, I just download them from a well-known file sharing website.

[GrumpiusMaximus]

As someone who works in publishing, this thread is a very interesting, and rather painful discussion. Can't really argue with people's findings. As profit margins get squashed, advertising departments end up wielding too much influence.

 

But, there is simple economics at work with the front page stuff too. LRO has a Defender on pretty much every front cover, because sales drop if they don't. I imagine it's the same for PC and Moggies/MGBs. You end up chasing volume and the majority, and the majority sadly like the mainstream icons. The economics of a magazine about obscure stuff don't really stack up - I'd be amazed if The Automobile is really that profitable, but I applaud the fact it exists. It feels more like a magazine put together by people who care about the content, and not a lot else. It exists in its own beautiful niche. (albeit stuff usually too old or valuable for us lot).

 

Tricky times for published media. Personally, I don't buy magazines anymore. Heck, I don't even read the 2CV club mag that often. The time I used to fill with reading doesn't seem to exist anymore.

 

 

If you want to see a really sorry state of affairs, try looking at music magazines.  Modern Drummer used to be the marquee title that everybody raved about.  It was imported from the US for years and you could pick it up at a decent-sized supermarket for a while back when I was first playing around about 2002.  Then something clearly happened because the advertising pages became more and more intrusive to the point where around about 50% of the magazine is now full-page adverts or similar.  It disappeared in the UK about 8 years ago and I haven't seen it since.  Despite huge complaints from readers, nothing has changed.

 

Now I hear from some US people that I know that it's not worth buying at all - and some of them had been subscribers for 30 years.

 

The main exception to that is Sound on Sound magazine, which is independently published and absolutely rammed full of information.  There are adverts but they are all relevant and the proportion is relatively small.  It's the gold standard of any magazine in my view and has a rabidly loyal fanbase to the point where any other music technology and recording magazine has to either be niche or doesn't survive long, purely because Sound on Sound is so good.

[dollywobbler]

Doesn't seem to have affected the model railway magazines, which arguably are a smaller industry than cars of an age....

 

I think the main difference there is model railways are supported by an industry making new stuff, so there's probably good advertising budget. 

[Asimo]

I bought an "Automobile" magazine today. First magazine purchase for a long time and a mag. I've never bought before.

So much classic-car type writing in magazines got to be of the lazy third hand sort, repeating previously published errors and cliches.

If I want a marque or model history the internet does a better job than magazines often did. If I want entertainment or fix-it info, Autoshite wins over magazines.

[barrett]

So, what was the verdict? Not much in there you can find online (which is sort of the point) and hopefully not much lazy repetition (with the possible exception of one feature written by a notorious copier)