Rustproofing surface corrosion

[sierraman]

I’ve had nothing but success with Waxoyl. Wouldn’t use Hammerite anywhere near a car though. It chips off to readily and isn’t anywhere near as flexible as stone chip.

 

Whatever you do it needs to be completely dry, putting anything over damp crusty metal won’t work.

 

As I see it £20 a tin for 5 litres of Waxoyl is money well spent.

[steveo3002]

dont buy into "its covered in thick black stuff .ive done well"   often its just hiding the rust until too late 

 

needs keen prep and regular checks /touch ups 

[bolognasal spray]

Can we also mention how best apply preferred unguents? As in, brush - or spray via some kind of compressor with gun thingy. If the latter, what kinds. Cheers in advance for the slight derailurementisation.

[steveo3002]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Professional-Rust-Proofing-Wax-Injection-Gun-for-Underseal-Waxoyl-etc-WS1/121506217427?_trkparms=aid%3D555017%26algo%3DPL.CASSINI%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20151005190540%26meid%3Db3d0609be7d54af89734c757b210a132%26pid%3D100505%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D1%26%26itm%3D121506217427&_trksid=p2045573.c100505.m3226

 

these are rather nice if you have the coin

[sierraman]

Paste it on with an old brush. Either that or thin it with some white spirits and spray through one of those garden sprayers from Poundland.

[garbaldy]

I've just done three this weekend with compressor and stove,

I stand tins in boiling water on a camping stove until hot then spray the vehicle, took 4 litres to do the patrol, I'm pretty sure when the wax is waterlike in consistency the compressor will be blowing it into all the nooks and crevesis.

 

I'm not a fan of waxoil but it's cheep and better than nothing.

[Rocket88]

Friend of mine used to coat the chassis of his boat trailer in fibreglass resin........which seemed to work, he did say that he added a magic ingredient which allowed it to flex.

[Vince70]

Thanks for all the info and a bought the Dynax ub in a can rather than aerosol and bought 2 litres of the stuff and picked some brushes and this small handheld pressure sprayer from Poundland.

I wondered do I need to mix white spirit to the dynax for spraying.

[steveo3002]

be surprised if that sprays it , they struggle with anything thicker than water

[sierraman]

No they work really well thinned with 20% white spirits.

[The_Equalizer]

I've moved on from Waxoyl to Dinitrol which seemed to have given better protection although it is correspondingly more expensive. Prep is the key and you need to ensure all loose rust has been removed whatever you use. For spraying Waxoyl I would always heat the tin by placing it in a bucket of hot water and also thin it down a bit more with white spirit.

 

Dinitrol comes in rattle cans and tins for spraying with a compressor. I've only tried it with the former. Dinitrol has various products depending what you need. It's thin enough that it doesn't look like you've just covered a load of nasties and it also means you can see what's going on with it over time.

 

As observed by others I have learnt that Hammerite isn't a good idea. Nor are any of the thick, cheap and cheerful tar like products. I would strongly suggest carrying out any work in the summer of a hot day to try and ensure everything is dry and what you are using goes on with minimum of fuss.

 

The trouble with rust protection is if you ask five people you'll get five different opinions. The bottom line is that the best protection is a dry garage combined with keeping the car clean underneath as well as any rust protection. Trouble is a garage can be a luxury.

[lesapandre]

EP90  may be worth checking out for its corrosive properties

 

years ago I had a Fiat and I wanted to top up the gearbox ...

 

EP was not to be used as the Extreme Pressure additives would de-solve soft bearing metals from what I could find out ..

 

only ordinary 90 was to be used

You are right there. I have an 80's Landcruiser with bronze parts in the gearbox. The EP additive strips the surface leading to prematurely failing box. Its a common problem. I bought some non-EP gearbox oil from Morris Oils who supply specialist stuff.

[bolognasal spray]

be surprised if that sprays it , they struggle with anything thicker than water

 

Agree - I have one that I fill w/ a mixture of 90% paraffin and 10% old 10w40. It worked for about a week - then it just stopped. Nothing will revive it. Third one I've bought that's failed.

[bolognasal spray]

You are right there. I have an 80's Landcruiser with bronze parts in the gearbox. The EP additive strips the surface leading to prematurely failing box. Its a common problem. I bought some non-EP gearbox oil from Morris Oils who supply specialist stuff.

 

Whoah that's mad! I had no idea.

[lexi]

You can get EP 90 that is friendly to bronze and brass. It may be GL4?  I used it in old Landy's. It is later spec that does the damage to yellow metal. You do need EP in diffs.

        

     Tight wad here.  Rusty metal. You wont "rust proof" it. You only hold it back.  I get a gallon of Phosphoric Acid from a chemical supplier for £25. Clean metal with wire brush, apply acid with paint brush,cover eyes and skin. Don't let it drop on mono block or good concrete.  Leave 48 hrs. Rub metal quickly with scotch pad. Prime and paint or use your Dinatrol over top.

[dome]

Timely thread, I'm going to get under the S4 and get it protected before winter, it's needing it. Also might do the MR2(s) too while I'm at it. 

 

I'm not sure whether to get some aerosol cans or the litre tin to do it, I don't have a compressor. Maybe a mixture of both?

[lesapandre]

You can get EP 90 that is friendly to bronze and brass. It may be GL4?  I used it in old Landy's. It is later spec that does the damage to yellow metal. You do need EP in diffs.

        

     Tight wad here.  Rusty metal. You wont "rust proof" it. You only hold it back.  I get a gallon of Phosphoric Acid from a chemical supplier for £25. Clean metal with wire brush, apply acid with paint brush,cover eyes and skin. Don't let it drop on mono block or good concrete.  Leave 48 hrs. Rub metal quickly with scotch pad. Prime and paint or use your Dinatrol over top.

Thanks for that. I used a non EP of the recommend viscosity - Morris Oils were really helpful they are one of the few suppliers of non-EP. Gearbox failure on the HJ60 Landcruiser is something I want to avoid so is worth a try. When I got it the change into 1st was a bit rough - see if this halts deterioration  Morris sell a lot to Vintage car people so seemed good. I will look at the GL4. I've not done the diffs yet but yes will look for something EP.

[chodweaver]

Dodge/Chrysler had the brilliant idea of putting phosphor bronze bushes in the manual transmissions of Voyagers (Mk III/IV iirc) and then had to use AT fluid as the gearbox oil. Top up or refill with regular gear oil and the gearbox lunches itself before too long.

 

#threaddriftismyspeciality

 

As you were.

[lesapandre]

This is the Morris works in Shrewsbury- a proper 'works'. Nice to deal with - a proper company. 

[sierraman]

Under seal with added Waxoyl is good. Remains flexible.

[loserone]

For when the rust is bubbling underneath?

[forddeliveryboy]

It depends on the sort of rust and where it is. Penetrating corrosion is obviously best cut out to prevent more spread, but then I've seen so many poor repairs (and complete lack of treatment of the inside of the new steel and what it's been welded to) that 'treating' it may work for as long, safely.

 

Too often I've seen corrosion sealed in, this is perhaps the last week of the year we can safely spray inside box sections without trapping in moisture, if the rain stays away and it's done in the heat of the day. The thicker or stronger the covering, the worse things'll be once the signs reappear.

 

I've seen rust reappear through the most expensive underseal mixes within weeks, panels held together by a couple of layers of 2k, a car put away in a garage for winter reappear the next Spring extensively rotted through, to the owner's disbelief.

 

If you're unsure, two or three thin coats of red oxide followed by a smear of grease if it's unlikely to be washed away, or a spray over of schutz just thick enough to hide the paint. If corrosion is in a seam, then if it's not soaked with oily stuff, unless it's really heavy gauge steel, treating externally is largely a waste of time.

 

That reminds me, the S2 V70 has a couple of pretty rusty areas on the inside (vertical) faces of the rear chassis sections - rotary wire brush then I'll decide what's best. I've seen cars like this rotted through in stressed areas like strut tops, looks like the steel used was poor/variable under Ford. In contrast, our older 90s model with more miles is free of any corrosion underneath on its structure. Better steel and assembly quality.

[sierraman]

For when the rust is bubbling underneath?

Wire brush it back, rust converter on, coat of red oxide then 2 costs of the underseal with Waxoyl in it. It’s really thick heavy stuff that doesn’t completely set. Can’t see a problem with that.

 

All this depends what it’s on. You obviously wouldn’t do this on a £100,000 E type restoration but on an older car it will probably outlast the car.

[forddeliveryboy]

I once had a customer who proofed his whole car, deliberately, with vegoil. It did as good a job as anything else, forming a thin but waterproof polymerised skin but I'd be worried about too many squeaks in winter, hunting the corners of trapped liquid oil.

[Honey Badger]

The spray cans are worth the extra coin as they cover better and are at a much higher pressure so give a better atomisation when spraying, by buying a tin of Dynax then applying it with a shit sprayer you have all the cost and none of the benefits. You will just be using more than you need as it will have a poor spray pattern, if it sprays at all.

 

Dinitrol or Bilthambler are so much better applied through an aerosol I can't see why you wouldn't use one

[sierraman]

I like to use the pressure sprayers as with the nozzle adjusted just right and enough spirits in it, it goes on really good and runny into all the seams.

[Axplug]

I learnt about milkstone remover from the Internet it's about 30 per cent phosphoric acid and available from farm suppliers as its used for descaling pipes.....my local mole valley suppliers has it for £25 for 20 litres. This is enough to use in a small tank.....for small items I throw them in and next day sometimes with a bit of wire brushing all the rust goes and you're left with a grey surface which I think is phosphate which can then be painted ...on surface rust a few sloshings over the day and a bit of wire wool, scraping etc with an old hacksaw blade has the same effect and If you are anal you find the rust patches can be entirely removed if the metals not too far gone , if you're lazy it will turn the rust black with an iron phosphate top layer which will still last reasonably well.....basically it's a higher strength of jenolite type of rust remover, I use it under the car then a couple of coats epoxymastic and then stonechip or waxoyl.... You might need to wipe the remaining acid off with water or thinners before painting. Don't get it in your eyes or on alloy but it doesn't eat your metal away....for inside sills I am afraid I like to spray with a machine mart spray thing with a long nozzle and compressor a satisfying mix of old engine oil or new if I have some cheap, slightly thinned with white spirit and recently I've thrown in some linseed oil too I spray it in odd corners too. I used to get the odd thing sand blasted but use milkstone only now. Thought I'd share my experience!

[sierraman]

Linseed oil is incredibly flammable. I’d be wary unless I was convinced it was absolutely rust free inside the sills. Otherwise the welder won’t thank you when his unit burns down.

[richardthestag]

+1 vactan, scrape worst of rust off, spray on to neutralise rust, overcoat if you must or repeat annually.

 

spray it on, thin with water I have heard but with a big nozzle spray gun I had no issues applying it. Under car after 24h is now black converted rust with white blotches, will monitor progress but reviews are good.

 

spraying anything over rust that doesnt neutralise or convert rust is like setting fire to money in my opinion.

 

have lots of cavity products from rustbuster for box sections. BUT didnt stop sills rotting out on Range Rover over next couple of years. BUT they were original steel sills nearly 25 years old on a daily all year round driver. so I would say successage

[Uncle Jimmy]

Wtf all that nonsense about using old engine oil is about is beyond me, you'd be smothering the bottom of your car in a mixture of steel particles, carbon and sulphur compounds. Better off slobbering it in grease or olive oil if it's a Fiat.