Sold Sold

[nigel bickle]

It’s probably the flexis dying internally, allowing fluid through under pressure, but not returning subsequently.

 

Or I’d suggest the servo too, but I don’t think it has one.

 

Short term, release the bleed nipple on the hot wheel, to allow a little fluid to escape. Then clamp that flexi closed with mole grips, cable tie out of the way.

 

Go for a drive ( brakes will pull, but not seize on)

[phil_lihp]

Excellent advice, thanks Nigel.  The flexi pipes could well be original so wouldn't hurt to change them - I hadn't thought of that.  There is indeed no servo, one of several reasons why the brakes are quite exciting after driving a modern.  Once funds allow, she'll get a full brake overhaul front and rear, should make it a bit less terrifying to drive!

[nigel bickle]

Replace them all, if ( as I suspect) 1 is dying, they are all terminal.

 

It’s quite a common problem on cars of this era, often leading owners to spend fortunes on callipers, pads, discs etc.

 

It’s a cheap fix, and eliminates the cheapest possible.

[phil_lihp]

A quick bit of Googling suggest the dealer is long defunct, there's a number of used car dealers on London Road in Hook but no SEAT dealer any more.

[phil_lihp]

Replace them all, if ( as I suspect) 1 is dying, they are all terminal.

 

It’s quite a common problem on cars of this era, often leading owners to spend fortunes on callipers, pads, discs etc.

 

It’s a cheap fix, and eliminates the cheapest possible.

 

Thank you, yes I've been there with my Jag XJ40, same issue with collapsed flexi pipes which looked fine from the outside but were causing some quite terrifyingly wayward braking habits.  They will all get replaced once monies allow.

[nigel bickle]

T’aint dear. Mk1 Panda ones will be the same, and cheap on thiefbay

[uk_senator]

You can do a full brake rebuild for under a ton, including calipers & master, nothing mechanical is expensive on them, it sounds like it`d be a worthwhile investment on yours now.

Drum-wise, the handbrake levers are a problem, they rust & seize, solid sometimes. You can take them out, attack the mating surfaces with a wire wheel, rotating them as you go, & smear them with copper grease after. Expect to do this every 2-4 years. Shoes make a huge difference to braking effort too, do them when you do the slave cylinders, as, despite yours looking new, the brake fluid will be well soaked in by now. They`re only about a tenner off the bay, as are a pair of slaves, & hoses can be had for about £15-20 a set (check the length of the fronts, they vary). Handbrake turns will then be a piece of cake.

This is one of my Mk2 Uno`s, the same setup, most small Fiats/ pre VW Seats of the last 30 years have been virtually identical:



The handbrake lever pivot:

[phil_lihp]

Thanks, that's very helpful. Brake shoes are high on the list as the current ones are completely soaked in fluid. They'll be changed at the same time as the cylinders.

[phil_lihp]

Today's progress was limited to a wash, polish and a liberal smearing of this on the perforated exhaust:

 

 

I guessed at £4 it was worth a shot, the system looks fine otherwise so seems mad to bin the whole pipe and silencer for the sake of a hole smaller than a 5p.  We'll see if it makes a difference - I think it might benefit from being reinforced with some exhaust repair bandage but my local Halfords didn't have any in stock.

 

The other day I also took the sunroof apart and cleaned up the hinges and rubber seal with some WD40.  It looks like an aftermarket job, made by Webasto, I'd be a bit surprised if these came with one as standard.  The screws holding the hinges on were loose when I took them out, it certainly looks like it's sitting flatter now and it's been a week since with quite a lot of rain and so far the interior has remained dry so I'm calling that fixed.  It was a much easier job than it's going to be to remove all the duct tape residue from the roof which is from a previous 'repair'.  Why don't people just fix these things properly in the first place, it would have taken nearly as long to tape it up as it did to sort the actual problem.

 

Last but not least, a very quick wipe over with some Super Resin Polish has restored the paintwork a little, it really needs a proper cut and wax but it certainly looks better (and blue-er) now.  Stanky will also be pleased to note that I oiled the door hinges so the driver's door no longer sounds like a prop from the Addams family.

 

Next job: brakes.  Watch this space.

[Stanky]

Stanky will also be pleased to note that I oiled the door hinges so the driver's door no longer sounds like a prop from the Addams family.

 

 

You could have recorded the noise and sold it to Hammer Films as a new 'stock' sound for coffins opening! 

 

Edit to add - I know its cliched, but a beer can with the top and bottom cut off, a good slather of gun gum and two jubilee clips really does make a very effective repair for exhaust pipes. Where is the hole? Is it on straight pipe or a joint?

[phil_lihp]

Unfortunately it's right where the rearmost hanger is welded on so I can't sleeve it, otherwise I would.  I'm hopeful that the gum and a bit of bandaging will at least quieten it down a bit, it sounds like it has no exhaust at all at the moment.

 

Also just noticed that the MOT is up on 2nd November so I'd better pull my finger out and get on with those brakes...

[phil_lihp]

Right, not much success on this at the weekend.  Managed to change the passenger front brake flexi easily enough but the driver's side one that's causing the main issue isn't playing ball as it's seized onto the brake pipe union.  Several different attempts at removal have merely resulted in the union going from a nut to a smooth lump and I've had to accept that it's knackered and not coming off by itself.  

 

However, seeing as the brake pipe itself is very short, being that the master cylinder is more or less right next to it behind the wheelarch, I'd have a much easier time of it just changing the brake line as well - I'm pretty much resigned to this anyway seeing as the flexi union's knackered.  

 

This is unknown territory for me but something I'd like to learn, I think subconsciously I've always filed brake pipe flaring under 'complicated witchcraft' but in reality how hard can it be?  I can pick up a Sealey flaring kit and some pipe and unions for £30 as a bundle off eBay, plus I'll need a brake pipe spanner as I suspect using standard spanners on these fittings is not helping my situation.  I think from memory the pipe/flexi union was 8mm but I might be wrong there, this doesn't seem to fit with most pipe spanners I've found which seem to be 10/11mm.

 

Seized brake pipe unions and bleed nipples on the rear drums also stopped play as far as getting the wheel cylinder out before rain dampened my limited enthusiasm further so I've doused it in WD40 and will have another crack at it next weekend if I get time.

 

Those of you who are experienced pipe flarers, any suggestions or advice?  

[Stanky]

I am by no means experienced, but the general consensus is to buy a decent flaring tool and then its really easy. Dantthecapriman very kindly lent me his flaring tool and some cunifer pipe when I had to redo one of the lines in the Geep and I went from having never done anything like this before to making consistently good adequate flares in the space of two evenings.

 

I'm not sure what brand his one is, but with the attachment thing you could make all three types of flare reliably and easily, even in situ.

 

Maybe try some heat on the rear drums to see if you can brake the bleed nipples have on the drum?Be careful in this weather though, the cold will make them more likely to shear I suspect.

 

Also I used normal spanners because I'm an idiot. The bleed nipples and brake pipe unions all survived my hamfistedness.

[phil_lihp]

Cheers, although I'm now realising as usual that I have no spare weekends left to work on this for the foreseeable future so it may end up being sorted by my tame mechanic as usual!

[wuvvum]

Yep, flaring isn't really difficult at all as long as you have half decent kit.  I've made up several brake pipes now and no nuns or kittens have yet died as a result - if I can do it anyone can.

[Kringle]

Sadly I have no experience of mk1 Pandas/ Marbellas but I've had great pleasure following your thread. Don't forget the photos!

[trabant]

Hi any chance you could take me a photo of how the front bull bar is fitted ?

i have one but no brackets

thanks

[StefanD]

Braking Performance

Many (nearly 400) moons ago, I had a similar problem with a Visa. Try replacing the front pads but make sure they are intended for non-servo cars. The pads will probably fit a number of different vehicles, most of which will probably have a brake servo. I believe the lining material can be harder for cars with a servo. My Visa 1124 cc did not have a servo while the Pug 104/Samba/Citroen LN which were mechanically similar all had a servo. The Visa was 3 year old with newly fitted pads, but after much nagging by my girlfriend, who had recently passed her test, I fitted dealer sourced pads, ensuring they were intended for a non-servo car, which transformed the braking response and reduced the effort needed.

I drove a hired Marbella around Tenerife a similar number of eons ago. Fantastic little car to chuck around the twisty, narrow mountain roads of the island. You will need to rev the bearings off the little beggar to get it moving.

[phil_lihp]

Oh dear.  Not looking so good on the rot front...J921 RTF

 

https://www.check-mot.service.gov.uk/

 

Brake and indicators are due to a blown fuse caused by a brake switch wiring short which happened on the drive down to the test centre, easily fixed.  I was unable to get anything much done on the brakes myself in the end so my mechanic agreed to fit the bits and fight with the multitude of rusty/rounded-off bolts but she's a bit crispier than I was expecting.

 

I'll await the quote with trepidation.

[Stanky]

OMFG you made me drive this deathtrap, i could have DEID to death becos of these problems.

 

I'm contacting Dominic Littlewood RITE NAOW M8.

 

</compoface>

 

in all seriousness though, thats not hideous considering what it is and how old it is. I reckon the last MOT was generous because of the (now late) giffer owner and very limited miles it did each year. The speed hole in the floor was a known known (to misquote Dick Cheney) and if you were going to fix that, it really needed an entire new sill on that side, the other needing doing is annoying, but probably worth doing in one hit (he says, not having to pay for the work) - the other bits are just 'old car thats not done many miles' stuff.

 

Didn't you get the new exhaust anyway, and we knew the handbrake was more ornamental than functional.

 

Looks a bit grim on first glance, but I reckon a day with a welder, some brake fettling which was probably due anyway and a stern look at the electrics would see a ticket for 12 more months. Well done saving it!

[phil_lihp]

Don't get me wrong, it's 26 years old and they weren't known for being robust to start with so I'm not really surprised - only that there's a few more rotten bits underneath than I knew about.  I did strongly suspect previous tests were a tad generous, there's a flipping great hole in the floor which was merely an advisory for years!  

 

I have a friend who can do welding for mates' rates so I think it might be going to see him for those bits.  Brakes and fuse are simple enough to sort.  I guess my exhaust bodging didn't work but again, it can be welded.

 

Could be a lot worse!

[tooSavvy]

I read that fail sheet and thought....

 

 

Jeasusss :/

[trabant]

Thats a big list .. good luck ..

is it home now being sorted ?

If so any pics of the bull bar fittings please

[phil_lihp]

The Apology

 

Sorry chaps, particularly to Stanky and Slartibartfast who put so much effort into the collection of the little Spanish donkey.  I know some of you will be disappointed but it will not be getting repaired and is now off the road.  I have spoken to my mechanic today and we've established beyond any doubt that it is beyond economical repair.  He stopped counting when he hit £600 in labour estimate alone.

 

Unfortunately, the thick coating of underseal is hiding a lot of rot.  Previous MOTs have probably been somewhat generous but additionally without poking it it was hard to tell which bits were soft.  He has given it a good prodding and the driver's sill and floor as well as various bits around the suspension mounts are very crispy, plus he reckons it will get "at least 20% worse" once he starts digging under the underseal.

 

It therefore needs a new home, either to be repaired by someone who can do their own welding or as a good source of spare parts. 

 

The Sales Pitch

 

It is now for sale, £150 takes it as-is, the engine is superb and the tyres are excellent, the interior is very tidy in the main and most of the bodywork is pretty good on it, plus it has that awesome bull-bar.  Unfortunately, the brakes are useless, one front brake is binding and the rears are soaked in fluid.

 

It comes with new front flexis, rear shoes and cylinders.  All four original hupcaps are supplied and are in the boot.  The tyres have loads of tread on them, including the spare.  The engine leaks oil from the rocker gasket but starts and runs very well and it drove very nicely from Hampshire to North Devon.

 

It does drive but is not roadworthy, the MOT is out and the front brakes bind so will need to be trailered away.

 

I will not break it, it must go very soon as I have enough space issues here now with the Hiace awaiting a sale and its replacement being picked up on Friday.  I will be putting it back on eBay shortly but would like to see if anyone on here would like to take it on.

 

 

 

 

[BorniteIdentity]

At times like this, I always turn to my good friend Kenny Rogers for sage advice.

 

“You gotta know when to hold ‘em - know when to fold ‘em - know when to walk away - know when to RUN.”

 

Someone will take this on, so no need for the apologies. Good on you for giving it a stab.

[phil_lihp]

Thanks, I do seem to have a habit of doing this, I had assumed the brakes would be a simple job at home and then a dab of weld for the MOT but the brake fittings were fighting my limited tools, skills and patience and frankly as always I just do not have the time to work on it, even without the discovery that the underside is mostly cornflakes and fresh air.  With the van issues on top and other non-car things needing my attention, this was falling further and further down the priority list.

 

It is a real shame, it's a cute little car with bags of character and I hope it lives again but if not, it may at least help keep some other Marbellas or Pandas on the road.

[holbeck]

We're all with you Phil.

[trabant]

I would take it if you were closer but the transport cost to get it to Shropshire will double the purchase price

good luck on ebay

[purplebargeken]

Might be worth taking a proper look and take some clear photos of the crusty bits and post them up. Just so folk can get a better idea of what is what?

[purplebargeken]

Meant to add that it looks bloody ace otherwise.