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LightBulbFun

wanted an invacar AC Model 70 and general ramble thread, index on page 1, 2 Potential Model 70's located, pictures on page 53 and "Turn ya bastard!"

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40 minutes ago, Dick Longbridge said:

 

Shame he's thrown the toys out of the pram. He seemed a fountain of knowledge on your favourite subject,. 

Not a clue how to do it, but can't you do some screenshots of cached pages of your thread from say 48 hours ago, if there were useful mk11 stats or facts? Sounds like he wont be in a rush to share them again...

indeed it seems like he has delated a few more of his posts too :( sadly google does not seemed to have cached anything

(apparently if you stick "cache:" in front of the URL in chrome at least, it will try and bring up a cache version of the page your on)

 

 

41 minutes ago, Snipes said:

What was the "Whitehall whitewash" the magazine headline alluded to?

 

im not 100% sure tbh, but I do know in the early mid 70s was when the whole anti-Invacar thing hit fever pitch, and then the tone changed suddenly when people found out they where going to lose their invacars and just be given an allowance for a regular car...

(all Invacars where supposed to be withdrawn by 1981 originally!)

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On ‎5‎/‎20‎/‎2019 at 11:23 AM, LightBulbFun said:

but how does it work with cars that have sat for a long time and are not on the DVLA Database

if someone wanted to get WOI654 or SOI7570 back on the road for example?

(and how would it work if someone dragged one of those back to the UK, would it be re-issued with a UK reg or would the car be allowed to keep its NI reg?)

I'm guessing a bit here, but since everything transferred over to DVLA HQ in Swansea from the old DVA in Northern Ireland, the process of recommissioning should still be the same as for the rest of GB.

As with other old knackers that have been off the road since God was a nipper and have dropped off the DVLA database, unless the original number plate's been reallocated (which, seemingly, hasn't happened with WOI) then it should be theoretically possible to reinstate it so long as there's enough documentary evidence in terms of chassis number, VIN etc - just as happened with MPH lately.

As Swansea now hold all the files and records that were moved out of County Hall in Coleraine, I think the principal difference is just that no-one sees any value in uploading the historic NI records onto the public-facing database - possibly because they're on some old legacy storage format, or even in hard-copy. They should still be able to refer to them, though.

Because the number of NI-plated cars coming back to life after an extended period off the road is probably teeny-tiny, I can see their logic there (though it's annoying for minority interest groups like the fine folks here) - but AFAIK there should be no extra hurdles, and no need to reregister an NI car with a GB registration, since they're all now administered through the same channels.

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ah cool stuff yeah sounds reasonable :)

I was just wondering, because here, if the car still shows up on the DVLA checker, you can more often then not, just fill out a V62 and get its V5, its how I went about sorting out MPH759P :)

but Eggs Mk12 XWC468F, since the DVLA dont actually have any records of it, Egg has to claim the reg from the DVLA and effectively register it as a new vehicle. (although I do wonder what would happen if @egg tried a V62 again now he knows the reg)

so I was not sure since none of the NI Model 70,s show up on the DVLA, but do show up on 3rd party sites, if it was the first case or the second case.

I wonder if the museum have any documents to go with WOI654 like a V5?

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The museum should hold documentation for its exhibits, but I'm really not sure how this Model 70 might be positioned owing to its odd status as a not-quite-private vehicle.

Most of the cars in the collection seem to have either been bought at auction, donated by families or manufacturers, or are there on long-term loan. I did ask the curatorial staff in my last email if they could provide any history on WOI, but I've not yet heard anything back - so maybe time for another rattle.

I'm guessing that what probably happened was the original owner died, or became infirm to the point they could no longer use WOI (c.1994) and the car was returned to the DHSS workshops (which I think were located at Musgrave Park Hospital in South Belfast). Quite likely the procedure at that point was for trikes to be scrapped/destroyed on return, as the policy of the time dictated they couldn't be issued to a new user.

Possibly the Transport Museum had put in a request with the workshop to hold over a returned car for their collection, or maybe someone in the workshop made a phonecall to the museum when it came in - but I'd guess it was probably done on a pretty ad-hoc and unofficial basis (like a lot of things related to Northern Ireland governance). As National Museums NI are an arms-length body of the Department for Communities (though set up as a charitable organisation in their own right), then technically I think WOI is still in government ownership.

Maybe WOI was marked as scrapped, with the green logbook sent back to Coleraine and the number plates removed - because it's not like anyone was ever going to care enough to start asking awkward questions, hey? 😀

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50 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

but Eggs Mk12 XWC468F, since the DVLA dont actually have any records of it, Egg has to claim the reg from the DVLA and effectively register it as a new vehicle. (although I do wonder what would happen if @egg tried a V62 again now he knows the reg)

I guess priority  of events re: attempting to re-register:

1. Ask for help from invalid carriage register

2. try again myself with a V62

3. Try Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs help

4. Register it with any old age appropriate plate as a new vehicle

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Yeah, I imagine after the owner either gave it up or died, it would been sent back to an invacar garage, where it was probably scrapped soon after

but im not 100% sure on what exactly happened after an Invacar was given up by its user

ROO978M does not even show up on the checker at all, maybe that was the person that won the event? :)

also for @OliD-E an N Reg AC Model 70 on 10 inch wheels, so probably means KPL would of indeed been on 10 inch wheels as well (also lends credence that Model 70,s jumped from 12 to 10 inch wheels around about 1973)

_20190523_061845.JPG

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I wish I could say this morning has been good on account of the fresh Model 70 spotings

but I got a letter from the government rejecting my appeal once more :(

its awfully depressing :(

and there still both saying im perfectly fit for work and at the same time recommending I get a wheel chair...

(anyone who has been to my house knows just how unsuitable a wheel chair would be for me sadly)

I think the place I sort of shot myself in the foot in so to speak

is during the assessment, i said in a couple questions that yes I can said thing, but it causes me a lot of pain and will end up disabling me for quite some time and I cant do it repeatedly

I should of just said "no i cant do that" 

(but that would of technically been lying, but im too good for my own good it seems 😕 )

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3 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

I wish I could say this morning has been good on account of the fresh Model 70 spotings

but I got a letter from the government rejecting my appeal once more :(

its awfully depressing :(

and there still both saying im perfectly fit for work and at the same time recommending I get a wheel chair...

(anyone who has been to my house knows just how unsuitable a wheel chair would be for me sadly)

I think the place I sort of shot myself in the foot in so to speak

is during the assessment, i said in a couple questions that yes I can said thing, but it causes me a lot of pain and will end up disabling me for quite some time and I cant do it repeatedly

I should of just said "no i cant do that" 

(but that would of technically been lying, but im too good for my own good it seems 😕 )

Shit.

Can you have a word with Citizen's Advice, assuming you haven't already?

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I have briefly looked into it in the past but not currently met with anyone there, it may be something I need pursue once more

but im very thankful that Zel has been helping me a hell of a lot with this whole thing, and for that im eternally thankful to him :)

(according to the letter iv just got, my next step of appeal would be an independent tribunal which sounds like fun*, so im currently looking into whats involved with that)

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12 minutes ago, mrbenn said:

I suspect they're hoping people won't take it as far as the tribunal.

This. I'm afraid it can be necessary these days. I've had similar experiences with education (which I won't go into here) an in the end we have had to escalate through several layers of complaint which has worked.

Also, please consider speaking to your MP if you haven't already. You may not believe it, but sometimes this has direct results.

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7 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

I wish I could say this morning has been good on account of the fresh Model 70 spotings

but I got a letter from the government rejecting my appeal once more :(

its awfully depressing :(

and there still both saying im perfectly fit for work and at the same time recommending I get a wheel chair...

(anyone who has been to my house knows just how unsuitable a wheel chair would be for me sadly)

I think the place I sort of shot myself in the foot in so to speak

is during the assessment, i said in a couple questions that yes I can said thing, but it causes me a lot of pain and will end up disabling me for quite some time and I cant do it repeatedly

I should of just said "no i cant do that" 

(but that would of technically been lying, but im too good for my own good it seems 😕

Exactly what happened to my mum. "Can you stand at the sink and wash pots "?

"Yea, I have to I live on my own"

"Tough shit, you're fit".

You need a good quack to write a letter including the classic phrase "you have failed in your duty of care towards me". Those words generally strike fear into most people who have any form of responsibility as 'Injury lawyers for you etc' start rubbing their hands. 

 

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how did it work out for your mum in the end there if you dont mind me asking?

 

on the Invacar front, if anyone recalls, on the early days of invacars on AS, it was thought that one of the differences between AC and Invacar Model 70,s was ACs had a roof gasket where as Invacars dont, (Because TPA has one but TWC does not)

however outside of 2 other Invacar Model 70,s from the field, all other Invacar Model 70,s I have seen have had roof gaskets, including SPU870K an Invacar Model 70 older then TWC, so that finally rules out it being a thing that maybe changed mid production (because up until now all other Invacar Model 70,s I have seen where newer then TWC)

_20190523_061430.JPG

 

im guessing then TWC was taken apart at some point in her life, and then whoever put her back together again forgot to put the roof gasket back on

 

(this also tallies up with some other inconstancies iv noticed with TWC)

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My mother's quack wrote a very strongly worded letter to them. A week or so later she got everything back, no apology or anything. I understand that the whole system is now designed so you fail.

 

Make sure if asked to attend you ask them how?, are you providing a taxi, is it at ground floor level (as I cannot climb stairs), will you be able to help me in / out of transport etc. You need to lay it on thick. 

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In terms of what happened to Invacars, when my grandfather died in the mid 60's my parents told the relevant department and they sent a man around who simply collected it and took it back to the local depot.

 

In terms of the missing posts, this site is backed up, talk to the mods, they may* be able to help.

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it seems like it sadly :( im happy your mum was able to sort things out in the end tho :)

(examinations I have been called to, we always claim the taxi expense so they know that much, or should in theory at least! )

I wonder what invacar your grandfather drove, being mid 1960s or older, could of been any number of different makes and models of invalid carriage :)

and good idea on asking the mods, I was thinking about that as well.

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LBF, have you been in contact with Fightback? they are a legal team who specialise in cases like yours. They are a chaity with real lawyers who guide and also represent you at tribunals or even simply filling the form out. get in touch, they may be able to help you.  https://www.facebook.com/FightBack4Justice/

 

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9 hours ago, bloobloo said:

LBF, have you been in contact with Fightback? they are a legal team who specialise in cases like yours. They are a chaity with real lawyers who guide and also represent you at tribunals or even simply filling the form out. get in touch, they may be able to help you.  https://www.facebook.com/FightBack4Justice/

 

Thanks for the tip, looks to be subscription based or something?

all this government crap have been quite sudden and overwhelming, especially as I have never dealt with anything like it before, (not helped by the fact they only give you a month to respond to things) it just makes you want to curl up into a ball and give up on life :( 

 

4 minutes ago, trigger said:

I just spotted some type of Invacar thing in the background of this photo from the late 70's.

148.thumb.jpg.dd98a5df25217d47ab4252faf064809e.jpg

 

ohh nice! not going to lie, pretty much the first thing that popped into my head when you made your post about those slides was

"Yay this is going to be an opportunity for some prime Invacar spotting!" :mrgreen:

as egg says, looks like its a Invacar Mk12c-Mk12e :)

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1 hour ago, LightBulbFun said:

Thanks for the tip, looks to be subscription based or something?

all this government crap have been quite sudden and overwhelming, especially as I have never dealt with anything like it before, (not helped by the fact they only give you a month to respond to things) it just makes you want to curl up into a ball and give up on life :(

No, no subscription as far as I'm aware. Give them a ring after the bank holiday and chat to her. I'm positive they will be able to help.

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I wonder what the reddish brown invalid carriage is here? im thinking some sort of Harper but im not 100% sure...

 

image.thumb.png.623319c461bd81cbf9788b808999f68d.png

on the note of football, I wonder when was the last football match featuring invacars on the pitch side? :)

(or when did they stop allowing people with invacars onto the pitch, if you where still using one in 2003, could you still drive onto the pitch?)

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I just watching a video by coventry transport museum about exhibits that are being brought out for motofest next weekend. At the end is a very shiny invacar, just thought I'd highlight it incase it's one you were unaware off. Reg is tjn352r

https://www.facebook.com/CovTM/videos/2344723408926822/UzpfSTc0MjE4Nzk4MjoxMDE1NjYyOTU2ODcyMjk4Mw/?q=coventry transport museum&epa=SEARCH_BOX

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For once someone gets their facts right! (in reference to the "they are however still road legal" )

indeed I am aware of TJN352R, but I appreciate you letting me know just incase I was not aware of it :)

TJN352R reportedly, was the Last Model 70 in DHSS service, surviving until April 2004 IIRC, "owned" by Mrs webb.

im glad to see its in running order, if sadly the wrong shade of blue!

edit: I see they gave it an MOT in march :)

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