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LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...


LightBulbFun

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Just now, Dobloseven said:

Aldi have got 12volt tyre pumps with a preset function and digital display for 20 quid this week. Their stuff is usually ok, I've found, certainly for amateur use. 

Ooh thats good to know But I do, do wonder how accurate they are!

Tyre Pressures on the Model 70 are 22 rear and 17 front, and being so low means each PSI matters!

although I am a bit reluctant to get tools powered off the cars 12V because although they are convenient and labour saving, I dont want to flatten REV's battery as I dont have any means of charging it externally currently and the charging setup on a Model 70 Dynamo based so not exactly the most powerful thing in the world!

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now this is interesting,

I always thought you checked the engine oil on the Model 70's Steyr puch engine by unscrewing and pulling out the dip stick wiping it clean putting it back in, screwing it down then un screwing and pulling it back out and checking the level

but after carefully reading the workshop manual it turns out your only supposed to put it in but not screw it all the way home when simply checking the level

178210904_MessagesImage(2145696807).thumb.png.a800730650f0c71dcaceeda3194aa5b7.png

it is worth noting however, I did check the oil level this way a couple times back early today (just incase perhaps this is how Adam did it and maybe thats why I was reading an overfull level?) but it still read way above maximum so I know that its not just me checking the oil incorrectly sadly

but I do wonder now if I have accidentally drained off a bit too much oil, ill have to check in the morning/afternoon of course

but I think ill order some 20W50 to be safe incase I need to top her back up (in-fact giving her another oil change in general probably would not be a bad idea!)

(I also wonder how everyone else has been doing it! is this a common mistake to make with Steyr puch engines or was/is it just me LOL)

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alright report for today

oil level is still good when checked correctly (about half way between min and max) and she does build oil pressure (at least the oil pressure light goes out!) when cranking over so thats good :) 

I noticed Adam put the warning lights back to their factory configuration, previously in REV's life at some point they had been altered as to which light indicated what, so thats good to know, I mean I personally preferred it the non-factory way since I think having green as a Low oil pressure warning light is a bit daft but I digress LOL

however she sadly refused to fire, and then the battery decided it had enough, however just before packing up shop tho I did quickly check and the horn and all the indicators are working now tho which is good :)

I did noticed that the inline fuel filter installed at the FoD is looking quite empty wonder if she is struggling to draw fuel through or if it just empties itself out once you stop cranking (wish I had a 2nd set of eyes/hands so I could have seen what was going while she was turning over)

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I did try the neighbour with the SD1 but no signs of life there sadly, wonder if they are away for the weekend!

so now Im going to have to figure out how im going to put some more juice into the battery when I dont have a jump pack or any way to charge it up!

(I mean have a DC bench top power supply I could charge it from, but I dont think I have the strength/ability to drag her battery all the way up to the flat!)

guess ill have to get a Jump pack ASAP, if anyone has any good recommendations do let me know :) 

(oh and for good messure the door fell off again so that was "fun" its in dire need of some TLC/adjustment I think!)

I also noticed the wrong type of fuel sender has been fitted, so the fuel gauge does not work sadly (but I did manually check and she has petrol!)

there are 3 different types of Gauge and Sender unit depending on which Age of Model 70 you have fitted or if its been fitted with a post production Veglia fuel gauge

and she has a later production Smiths fuel gauge but Adam fitted her with a Veglia Fuel sender unit... (but I think at least the fuel sender unit that is with her original  holed fuel tank did still work so hopefully that can be fitted to the new tank at some point, the mountings are the same thankfully!)

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Lidl are going to have jump packs, jump leads and chargers in from the 14th (if that's any use).

Jump packs are excellent, but worth noting they aren't really the best thing for older engines with carbs etc that take a bit more cranking, they're better suited to a big short sharp jolt on a modern fuel injected engine. But i'm sure it wouldn't have much bother turning an engine that small over for a bit longer.

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Just ordered myself a cheap n cheerful jump pack from Amazon which should hopefully be here tomorrow, should hopefully be good enough for a 493cc engine and Dynastart LOL

battery is new according to Adam so thats good, just a bit flat clearly! (perhaps due to the aforementioned charging fault REV apparently developed on her last test drive up in york, but I have still yet to get the full details on that)

but apparently she also developed a sized choke cable which was then disconnected from the carb, which I was not told about! so that hopefully explains why she would not start (and why I could not seem to find a choke cable going to carb!)

but not sure what im going to do about said sized and disconnected choke, wonder if I can temporarily bodge something with a pice of string or such that I can pull on from inside the cabin LOL

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3 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

I did try the neighbour with the SD1 but no signs of life there sadly, wonder if they are away for the weekend!

He's probably hiding.  Sensible fellow.....🙂

Seriously though, it's very good to hear of your progress.  "If you do nothing in life, nothing happens." 

Re. choke cable, it has an accelerator pump, so you should be able to get it going by pumping the throttle repeatedly while you crank it.  As it is air cooled it should warm up fairly quickly.

Long extension cable out of the window for the charger? 

 

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Too many years ago, I had a Morris Ital. One day, whilst driving it, the accelerator pedal locked solid. A look under the bonnet revealed a "siezed"cable. Was very close to home, and there was an Austin Rover dealer also nearby, so went in and bought a new cable. Found the engine wasn't earthing properly and current was running along the cable, melting the plastic lining of the outer. Could that be food for thought, particularly as there's other electrical problems? Best of luck. I think this is a baptism of fire into the world of dubious motoring! 

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1 hour ago, Mr Pastry said:

He's probably hiding.  Sensible fellow.....🙂

Seriously though, it's very good to hear of your progress.  "If you do nothing in life, nothing happens." 

Re. choke cable, it has an accelerator pump, so you should be able to get it going by pumping the throttle repeatedly while you crank it.  As it is air cooled it should warm up fairly quickly.

Long extension cable out of the window for the charger? 

 

haha yeah I did wonder LOL

and thanks despite the fact that everything has gone a bit pete tong, im still very pleased to have her home etc at long last :) (although to be honest, had I known she still these issues, id of probably had her taken back to FoD to await further fettling!)

yeah that is one of the things that still concerns me about the non starting, as I did pump the throttle while turning her over just incase something was up with the choke etc and I still got nothing

she would turn over, but no signs of life otherwise no spluttering or attempting to start which I would of thought there would of been even with no choke applied...

(indeed back when I drove her around the FoD, I found she warmed up pretty quickly, I did not have to have the choke applied for long, which is good as your not really supposed to drive a Model 70 with the choke applied, not unless you want involuntary cruise control!)

 

this does remind me I should give her fuses a fiddle, I remember once at the FoD she would crank but refuse to start showing no spark, fiddling with her fuses got her to fire up so perhaps that issue has come back!

it was a strange issue, as everything goes through those 2 fuses so if theres a bad connection there a Model 70 wont even turn over, but im guessing in this case the connection was good enough to allow it to turn over (or more precisely activate the starter solenoid) but still dodgy enough that the voltage dropped enough to stop the ignition firing

 

(as a side note is anyone good at giving full body massages? I could really do with one after the last couple days!)

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58 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

it was a strange issue, as everything goes through those 2 fuses

Just had a look, and yes the ignition switch is fed through a fuse which seems very odd.  I would be tempted to modify that in due course.  You could well have a situation where the battery is a bit low and the starter takes all the available current, so there is nothing left for the ignition and of course a bad connection at the fuse won't help.

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3 hours ago, Dobloseven said:

Too many years ago, I had a Morris Ital. One day, whilst driving it, the accelerator pedal locked solid. A look under the bonnet revealed a "siezed"cable. Was very close to home, and there was an Austin Rover dealer also nearby, so went in and bought a new cable. Found the engine wasn't earthing properly and current was running along the cable, melting the plastic lining of the outer. Could that be food for thought, particularly as there's other electrical problems? Best of luck. I think this is a baptism of fire into the world of dubious motoring! 

Had that in a Marina coupe where the radio earthed to the choke. Smoke ensured.

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For the oil I'd be checking if it strongly smells of petrol.  If the diaphragm in the fuel pump has failed it will allow fuel to drain into the sump.  It is very easy to overfill though, so basically keep a close eye on the level.  If it seems to increase over time that'll be why.  Service kit for the pump was available when I last looked.  Having switched to the electric pump I never bothered sorting mine though.  Far better starting performance was one of the reasons I stuck with the electric pump.  Means I can just give the throttle a couple of pumps and she will go.  TPA usually only has the choke on literally for about a minute - though the disclaimer there is that she does live in a relatively warm garage.

If it's been overfilled to the point oil may have got into the cylinders she may have fouled plugs that will need to be cleaned or replaced.  Unlikely that any permanent damage has been done though.  Definitely will be wanting a few oil changes in pretty quick succession though judging from how dark that oil is.

There should be clamps on the door runner tubes to stop the doors being able to roll all the way off the end. 

As far as the battery is concerned, I did find that on TPA I have had to charge it a couple of times as the charging system only really wakes up fully when you're at speed, so if you're driving around town a lot, especially after dark that's something you'll need to keep an eye on.  Also disclaimer, I've never looked at whether there's any scope for adjustment of the voltage regulator.

 

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56 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

For the oil I'd be checking if it strongly smells of petrol.  If the diaphragm in the fuel pump has failed it will allow fuel to drain into the sump.  It is very easy to overfill though, so basically keep a close eye on the level.  If it seems to increase over time that'll be why.  Service kit for the pump was available when I last looked.  Having switched to the electric pump I never bothered sorting mine though.  Far better starting performance was one of the reasons I stuck with the electric pump.  Means I can just give the throttle a couple of pumps and she will go.  TPA usually only has the choke on literally for about a minute - though the disclaimer there is that she does live in a relatively warm garage.

Yeah Adam also wondered the same about the fuel pump and oil, however I dont recall the oil smelling strongly of petrol, but ill do a comparison next time im there

but if It did turn out I had a knackered fuel pump then yeah id probably look at just duplicating your electric setup as I know it clearly works well :) (and I think would be easier to fit then faff about trying to remove then rebuild/replace the mechanical pump, but thats not something I have looked that deeply into)

56 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

If it's been overfilled to the point oil may have got into the cylinders she may have fouled plugs that will need to be cleaned or replaced.  Unlikely that any permanent damage has been done though.  Definitely will be wanting a few oil changes in pretty quick succession though judging from how dark that oil is.

Yeah its very much on the list of things to do, (and drop the oil strainer somehow...) I placed an order for a 5L bottle of 20W50 the other night which is saying will be here by Tuesday hopefully :)  

but on that subject of the things that concerns me a little bit is the oil filter that was installed recently, I noticed is a Mann W712/43, but the Steyr puch engine of this age calls for a W712 (no suffix numbers) so id like to know exactly what this /43 means compared to a regular W712...

56 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

As far as the battery is concerned, I did find that on TPA I have had to charge it a couple of times as the charging system only really wakes up fully when you're at speed, so if you're driving around town a lot, especially after dark that's something you'll need to keep an eye on.  Also disclaimer, I've never looked at whether there's any scope for adjustment of the voltage regulator

Yeah I have realised I really need to figure something out to keep her battery topped up...

anyone got any spare solar panels? LOL

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Hard wiring in one of those solar battery maintainer devices might be a good bet.  Or adding a cigarette lighter socket, which they usually plug in to.  Adding one of those sockets has been on my to do list for ages, mainly so I can charge devices like my phone on long runs where I'm using it as a satnav.

Removing/installing the fuel pump is pretty simple, just a bit fiddly as the oil filler/vapour separator is a bit in the way.  Biggest thing you need to remember is to block off the fuel line first as otherwise the tank will immediately start emptying itself as soon as you disconnect it.

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51 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

Hard wiring in one of those solar battery maintainer devices might be a good bet.  Or adding a cigarette lighter socket, which they usually plug in to.  Adding one of those sockets has been on my to do list for ages, mainly so I can charge devices like my phone on long runs where I'm using it as a satnav.

Removing/installing the fuel pump is pretty simple, just a bit fiddly as the oil filler/vapour separator is a bit in the way.  Biggest thing you need to remember is to block off the fuel line first as otherwise the tank will immediately start emptying itself as soon as you disconnect it.

Yeah I have somewhere If I can find it a 12V Volt meter and USB outlet gauge, bought it for REV a couple years ago and now i cant find it typically LOL (as I knew even back then that Id need to keep an eye on system voltage given the relative weedy-ness of the charging system)

2 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

There should be clamps on the door runner tubes to stop the doors being able to roll all the way off the end. 

thats the odd thing, the clamps are there (and doing their job)  the door is not sliding off the end, its just falling off the rail for some reason

in-fact it fell of when I was going to close the door not open it, I think because its a bit sticky when I pull on the grab handle to close the door, the front of the door latterly moves up and outward and this pulls it off the rail tube

even tho I dont think the tube should not be able to pass between the gap between the upper and lower rollers, but if things are worn I guess the gap may have opened up,, thats how I re-attached the door, by getting on the ground and picking the door up and hooking it back by passing the gap between the rollers through the tube and dropping the door back onto the top roller

if you compare these 2 pictures you can see the door had a lot more travel to before it would of run off the end then compared to where it fell off

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image.thumb.png.4fd3117b3388d84998c2e917ed4dda3c.png

 

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@LightBulbFun Comparing the doors manual pic and the "fell off" pic, could it be that one of the rollers ends has worn away, making it almost a tube shape instead of a cotton reel shape. So it will keep on  falling off. A temporary fix could be to put it on the other way around, so that the largest diameter is towards the inside of the car, over the tubular rail, away from the door. As in the pic. Also, make sure it is not stuck and turns on the mounting screw.  That one and probably all will have to be replaced because of wear.

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16 hours ago, bobdisk said:

@LightBulbFun Comparing the doors manual pic and the "fell off" pic, could it be that one of the rollers ends has worn away, making it almost a tube shape instead of a cotton reel shape. So it will keep on  falling off. A temporary fix could be to put it on the other way around, so that the largest diameter is towards the inside of the car, over the tubular rail, away from the door. As in the pic. Also, make sure it is not stuck and turns on the mounting screw.  That one and probably all will have to be replaced because of wear.

indeed Im pretty sure thats whats happened although I still recall the roller looking pretty roller shaped, but the gap only has to open up a bit for it to fall off I think

15 hours ago, dave j said:

As a temporary "workaround" can you use the door on the other side instead? Good to see it home, but not so good that you haven't been able to go for a drive yet 

I would, in fact the other door is the one id prefer to use as not only does it just work much better then the door that keeps falling off (it rolls easier and is easier to close) but its also the nearside door, so would allow to me get in and out of the car without having to go into moving traffic and thats generally the door the Ministry recommended people use (if you notice all single door Villiers machines only had a door on the nearside generally)

but the problem with that door is the door handle is not very secure, one of its screws has gone missing and I think the other one is not far behind, so im reluctant to use that door in fear of pulling the door handle completely out of the door!

 

Amazon is saying the Jump pack will be here between 2:45-5:45, hopefully the former while I still have some daylight to do things!

I also ordered an oil filter since it was only £5.86 figured would be good to have on hand for when I do a full oil change (I mean I do know I have a pile of the things but there about 50 miles away from me LOL)

but speaking of service items @Zelandeth do you have a link to the windscreen wiper you got for TPA? I notice REV still has her utterly knackered one installed so id obviously like to replace that! and I know the one you got works well and is shiny and chrome :) 

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1 hour ago, Zelandeth said:

Afraid I don't have a direct link to it any more, but it was advertised as being for a classic Mini, so just searching for that is where I'd probably start.

ah cool good to know :) , I know its 10 inches and flat so I dont think its a Mini item, but maybe something shared with Land Rovers?

I have my eye on this

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/322910956720

which looks suitable, but I have never had to replace a windscreen wiper before so Im not sure if it will clip right in place of the old knackered blade or do I need additional hardware to adapt my wiper stalk or something?

(im probably overthinking things once more!)

EDIT: cheap and cheerful jump pack arrived, nothing but the finest Chinglish!

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(the included USB charger is so hilariously light weight and cheap feeling, I should send it to BigClive for a teardown LOL I certianlly wont be using it as I doubt it complies with any standards or has any sort of actual proper electrical isolation between the mains and low voltage sides)

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daylights fading now sadly so will have to wait till tomorrow to give it a go

(and my body could do with the day off to be fair!)

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52 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

ah cool good to know :) , I know its 10 inches and flat so I dont think its a Mini item, but maybe something shared with Land Rovers?

I have my eye on this

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/322910956720

which looks suitable, but I have never had to replace a windscreen wiper before so Im not sure if it will clip right in place of the old knackered blade or do I need additional hardware to adapt my wiper stalk or something?!

(im probably overthinking things once more!)

There are different width wiper arms where the blade clips on so you will need to measure yours to check it is 5mm.  Most wiper blades of that period clip on with a pip on the arm and a spring plate on the blade, but you need to check yours as there are a few other types.

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Wow, I'm well behind here. Exciting times! Really pleased for you.

Wiper blades - you can indeed buy Mini 10" blades online. I did recently for my 2CV. Pretty sure TWC is running a larger blade than that. 11 maybe?

Another tip I'll give is that blind spot mirrors are a massive help. Rearward visibility, especially over the shoulder, is hopeless in an Invacar. Try these. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/164805129077 

I've got one on the interior mirror and another on the external mirror. I feel so much more confident that I know what's about me now. (did 130 miles in TWC yesterday!).

As others have said, I doubt the over-filled oil has done any damage. If it was run at speed and chucked around a bit then yes, the crank could have hit the oil and frothed it up a treat, but I doubt that happened. Good luck getting it started again - TWC likes a lot of choke to get started, though I have to then back it off a bit once she's caught.

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