Jump to content

LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...


LightBulbFun

Recommended Posts

11 minutes ago, Mr Pastry said:

Re. washer.    You can cut a slit in the washer to pass it over the inner cable, and the washer will then fit over the shouldered end of the outer cable, which I take it is the requirement.  Just needs a saw cut. 

ah thats a good idea! not sure I have anything meaty enough to cut through the washer (i really need to get a hack saw or Dremel!) but im sure I could figure something out if I end up needing to try again

12 minutes ago, Mr Pastry said:

Then what happens at the carb end?  How does the inner cable attach to the throttle lever? It looks like it just wants pulling through a bit further. 

the way it works at the carb end is the throttle cable out has (or had...) a ferrule on the end that is threaded which screws into the manifold, then from there the inner comes out and just goes to a screw clamp on the throttle lever of the carb

whats happened as per the picture is the outer has pulled out of the ferrule that was attached to its end

IMG_0106 2.JPG

 

I have been informed by big al that entire inner and outer throttle cable assembly with twist grip that I bought off him has finally been dispatched :) (which im pleased about as I was expecting to still be chasing this up 6 months later!)

the only slightly worrying thing is I noticed, on the carb end it doesn't seem to have a threaded section so im not sure how it attaches to the manifold bracket? 

image.thumb.png.bd92ac5e097b87e6bb689b39103ce56e.png

hopefully things will be a bit more clear when it arrives hopefully!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The threaded part that is on the manifold bracket is not crimped to the cable, the outer just sits in it loosely via inner cable tension,this is because the outer has to be allowed to rotate as it flexes, and some adjusters adjust in a threaded hole so have to turn independently of the outer cable when adjusted, where some are adjusted via nuts either side of a thin plate and therefore crimped to the cable. 

In the pic of underneath it looks like where the cable is bent and stained with corrosion has let in water which ruins the action of the cable, I reckon the routing isn't that bad tbh 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Jikovron said:

In the pic of underneath it looks like where the cable is bent and stained with corrosion has let in water which ruins the action of the cable, I reckon the routing isn't that bad tbh 

the thing is the green cable, inner and out where Brand new NOS and in good condition at least outwardly, when fitted but have been problematic since day 1...

its just a bit grubby from running around the FoD/being under a 45 year old car, but its only done about 25 miles (around the FoD) but note how the inner is already showing signs of strain, from how stiff it is/how much force it takes to actuate the twist grip

so I dont think its a worn cable issue which makes it all the more puzzling! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You need a junior hacksaw, and a little metalwork vice with a clamp fitting to attach to your desk/dining table/even part of the car.  Very useful.

As Jikovron says, once the inner cable is pulled through and in tension (though with a tiny bit of free play) it will hold everything in place.  At least the cable is free and not seized.  TBH just looks like it has been badly assembled, although I appreciate it's not easy doing these things in a field.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As per Mr Pastry's comment, I can put slits in a few washers and bung them in the post if you like?  I should be able to get them out to you tomorrow, just let me know which size that washer is (I'm guessing that it was in one of the bags I posted you last week).

@Mr Pastry is this what you were thinking of? (Microsoft Paint FTW)

2027339057_washerwithslit.png.f83a02c8504dc670bfe600d96937aadd.png

Thinking back to brake cables on bicycles, they are usually run straight and any curves are taken as gently as possible.   The loop/bend under the car and the slack near the carb end won't be helping things.  It might be prudent to trim down the outer cable, this comes with a few obstacles challenges; chiefly getting access to cut the outer at the carb end (as that is the only end that can be trimmed).  The cable could be disconnected from the carb and pulled out from under the car.  IIRC the handgrip end is easyish to undo, meaning that the whole assembly could be trimmed off the car.  I reckon that I could find a bench mounted vice at work that I could 'borrow'.  A few minutes with a junior hacksaw would give a better fitting cable.  The inner could also be removed at that time and lubed and inspected.

I'm wondering if I can get up to help again during the Christmas period if you are free?  Once the pre-Christmas madness at work calms down, I should be able to escape for a bit.  It depends on Mrs Boom looking after the kids, but it could be done if you would like a pair of hands.

Also, is the choke cable AWOL?  If the run is straightforward it could be done at the same time.  Not sure where your choke controls are (they vary on Invacars don't they?)

You're on the cusp of that chip shop run now!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, CaptainBoom said:

is this what you were thinking of? (Microsoft Paint FTW)

2027339057_washerwithslit.png.f83a02c8504dc670bfe600d96937aadd.png

Exactly that.  I would hesitate to shorten the cable unless absolutely necessary and would want to have a good look at it first, as it was made that length for a reason, and the designers presumably knew what they were doing. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, CaptainBoom said:

As per Mr Pastry's comment, I can put slits in a few washers and bung them in the post if you like?  I should be able to get them out to you tomorrow, just let me know which size that washer is (I'm guessing that it was in one of the bags I posted you last week).

@Mr Pastry is this what you were thinking of? (Microsoft Paint FTW)

ah that would be much appreciated! :) indeed the washer was from the bag of washers you sent, its the largest of the M6 washers with an OD of about 20Mm according to my callipers (although Its worth noting dont actually know if it will or wont fit over the smaller part of the ferrule, I forgot to bring my callipers down with me to measure that!)

1 hour ago, CaptainBoom said:

hinking back to brake cables on bicycles, they are usually run straight and any curves are taken as gently as possible.   The loop/bend under the car and the slack near the carb end won't be helping things.  It might be prudent to trim down the outer cable, this comes with a few obstacles challenges; chiefly getting access to cut the outer at the carb end (as that is the only end that can be trimmed).  The cable could be disconnected from the carb and pulled out from under the car.  IIRC the handgrip end is easyish to undo, meaning that the whole assembly could be trimmed off the car.  I reckon that I could find a bench mounted vice at work that I could 'borrow'.  A few minutes with a junior hacksaw would give a better fitting cable.  The inner could also be removed at that time and lubed and inspected.

the problem I see there is refitting it, its the problem I have with the hopefully good second hand cable I have coming is im not sure how im going to go about fitting it! (assuming it is indeed good id like to fit it if possible!) 

its easy to just pull the throttle cable out of the car, but I can see trying to thread it back under the car being a right PITA (unless you have a Jack, 4 axel stands and dont mind the slight risk of being crushed by 413.2Kg of Invacar? LOL)

as an aside it should be possible to trim the throttle cable from the twist grip end if you first remove the inner, IIRC the outer ferrule is just a push fit on the twist grip end IIRC (originally the outer way way over length so it was trimmed down to match the original black outer cable that was FUBAR, the new inner was already the correct length IIRC)

1 hour ago, CaptainBoom said:

I'm wondering if I can get up to help again during the Christmas period if you are free?  Once the pre-Christmas madness at work calms down, I should be able to escape for a bit.  It depends on Mrs Boom looking after the kids, but it could be done if you would like a pair of hands.

Also, is the choke cable AWOL?  If the run is straightforward it could be done at the same time.  Not sure where your choke controls are (they vary on Invacars don't they?)

You're on the cusp of that chip shop run now!

ah that would be much appreciated! im free as always, :) 

the choke cable is present but I understand it to be FUBAR so I dont think theres much that can be done with it sadly

and yeah I know! its so frustrating so close but so far away! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Is there some sort of basic car maintenance course you could go on at the local college? Running this daily is going to require constant maintenance tweeking and modification to keep it going, you really need to be confident in what you are doing a course would help give you a boost as to what you can do.

Making cables is cheap and easy I've been doing them since I was 12 and got into motorbikes. A universal throttle cable kit is only about £6.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, DodgeRover said:

Is there some sort of basic car maintenance course you could go on at the local college? Running this daily is going to require constant maintenance tweeking and modification to keep it going, you really need to be confident in what you are doing a course would help give you a boost as to what you can do.

Making cables is cheap and easy I've been doing them since I was 12 and got into motorbikes. A universal throttle cable kit is only about £6.

I was thinking this the other day too.

 

I don’t want to dishearten you LBF but this will never be plain sailing. As soon as you rectify the throttle cable you’ll discover more issues especially after a couple of journeys in it. My only fear for your own sake is that you won’t be able to rely on help for everything as this is going to be constant. 
 

A college course would be a fantastic thing and even severely disabled folk take courses. I obviously don’t know (or need to know) the depths of disabilities but to make this car a viable mode of transport its going to take a lot of regular work!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, DodgeRover said:

Is there some sort of basic car maintenance course you could go on at the local college? Running this daily is going to require constant maintenance tweeking and modification to keep it going, you really need to be confident in what you are doing a course would help give you a boost as to what you can do.

Making cables is cheap and easy I've been doing them since I was 12 and got into motorbikes. A universal throttle cable kit is only about £6.

 

13 minutes ago, JJ0063 said:

I was thinking this the other day too.

 

I don’t want to dishearten you LBF but this will never be plain sailing. As soon as you rectify the throttle cable you’ll discover more issues especially after a couple of journeys in it. My only fear for your own sake is that you won’t be able to rely on help for everything as this is going to be constant. 
 

A college course would be a fantastic thing and even severely disabled folk take courses. I obviously don’t know (or need to know) the depths of disabilities but to make this car a viable mode of transport its going to take a lot of regular work!

now im obviously not going to claim im a car mechanic expert far from it! LOL

but the issues im facing here is for the most part not a lack of know how, its as @High Jetter said an annoying and really frustrating  physical disability problem

and I know being a 45 year old car to expect there to be issues over time!, its just I was not expecting so many so quickly

she was brought home under the impression that all the major/critical jobs she needed doing had been done, it turns out while a fair few major jobs where very kindly done, there where a fair few things that where not done, which I was sadly not told about

dont get me wrong I still very much appreciate the work that was done on her! I just really wish I was told that she still needed work like this doing, so I could of had her taken back to the FoD or such to await further tinkering, instead of having her brought home where hard core tinkering is a lot harder!

and some of those issues did require simply 2 people like the diagnosing of the failed mechanical fuel pump, thats not something that could of been done alone as you need someone in the cabin to crank the engine over while someone else watches in the engine bay to see if fuel is flowing or not,

(unless of course you install a remote engine start in the engine bay which I was planning on doing before help was kindly volunteered)

and the Throttle cable issue has been an issue since getting REV and has baffled pretty much everyone at the FoD and then some! its that one bastard of a problem that should be simple in theory but is not being simple in practice sadly!

if I could get the car up in the air id be fairly confident I could attempt to fit a replacement cable, but as she is on the ground Im not sure I have the physical ability to go rolling around under the car to fit a new one

at least if I could get her mobile I could then take her to a garage if any further issues I cant solve on my own crop up etc, but she is not even drivable so kinda fallen over at the first hurdle there LOL

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

unless you have a Jack, 4 axel stands

You only need one axle stand, as the car keeps two wheels on the ground and is lifted up and secured with that axle stand at a third point. There is room enough for someone to slide underneath under a Model 70 to access the cable for routing it, with it jacked up in this way.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@LightBulbFunThe best way of getting underneath for this job is by putting the rear wheels up on ramps.  The cable needs to be supported at short regular intervals, as per @Mrs6C suggestion. Cable ties would probable do. That would do away with where it hangs down in the pic. 

If you wish REV to be transported back to the FOD, I might be able to arrange this. Perhaps in the new year, more people will look at her and be able to sort the worst of the problems.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Mrs6C said:

You only need one axle stand, as the car keeps two wheels on the ground and is lifted up and secured with that axle stand at a third point. There is room enough for someone to slide underneath under a Model 70 to access the cable for routing it, with it jacked up in this way.

yeah I was just thinking incase someone ends up needing to get the entire car up off the ground but as you say if you only need to lift the front end, you dont need as many :) 

10 hours ago, mitsisigma01 said:

Do you have a close up picture of the current hand control showing where the cable enters the hand control ?

Also on the manifold end can you show in better detail how the cable attaches to the throttle linkage not just the brass threaded adjuster.🤞🤞

I dont have a close up picture of everything assembled but on the twist grip end this is how it goes together

this 

2085659615_IMG_01111.thumb.JPG.e23dbd65a4c44df1c08cb355da51fd88.JPG

goes into this on on the twist grip into the smaller hole on the left (which is unusual, every other twist grip I have seen has only had the larger hole on the right hence me trying to fit a washer so the unusually skinny throttle cable can work with the larger hole on the other twist grip I have)

image.thumb.png.655c9fe3d0005c5f0f5e94da2d769b8c.png

from what I understand this end is supposed to be just like any other old motorcycle twist grip setup, I sadly dont have any other pictures of the carb end, ill have to try and grab some next time :) 

5 hours ago, bobdisk said:

@LightBulbFunThe best way of getting underneath for this job is by putting the rear wheels up on ramps.  The cable needs to be supported at short regular intervals, as per @Mrs6C suggestion. Cable ties would probable do. That would do away with where it hangs down in the pic. 

If you wish REV to be transported back to the FOD, I might be able to arrange this. Perhaps in the new year, more people will look at her and be able to sort the worst of the problems.

ah thats good to know and much appreciated! im hoping once her throttle cable woes are solved that she will be mobile enough that I can drive her about myself but its good to know the option is there if it comes to it! :) 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

the Throttle cable and twist grip assembly from Big al arrived just now :) 

image.thumb.png.78dd749d8a16dc7d59f6404168c8503e.png

it looks a bit crusty

image.thumb.png.546a969fe4715ab6cba13e5ce0b48184.png

but inside the grease/oiler point looks ok, and when its un coiled into a vaguely straight line along the floor I am able to pretty easily retract the inner cable in with the twist grip so ill take that as a good sign!

image.thumb.png.4710149e81f5d57a261d5278101030e9.png

hopefully this fits and solves me problems!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

the Throttle cable and twist grip assembly from Big al arrived just now :) 

Fantastic! May I suggest you contact him and let him know it has arrived safely and ask him at the same time, if he can describe and/or send you a sketch of where it should run on a handle-bar Model 70, so you can get it installed correctly, as your installation was a temporary fix and not necessarily in the right place?

Also, perhaps @adam1db could advise further? He has a few Model 70s with the handlebars and may even have photos of the routing of the cable on the latest restoration, that he could share with you?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • LightBulbFun changed the title to LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, Chips got! :)
1 hour ago, 500tops said:

Chip shop achieved!!  This has cheered me up no end; knowing how long you have waited for this moment!

Brilliant stuff. Well done to all those generous enough to lend their time and knowledge to make it happen! 

🎅🎄☃️

 

48 minutes ago, Dick Longbridge said:

AMAZING news Dez. Finally! I bet you're still beaming!

Thanks! indeed I am really chuffed with things :) 

it was very surreal  driving around my local area in my very own Invacar! you very much do get noticed and while waiting inline at the chippy I even saw someone crouch down take a selfie in front of REV LOL

24 minutes ago, auntiemaryscanary said:

Brilliant news, now get out and about everywhere in it! I hope you got @bobdisk the biggest haddock in the chippy.

Hope to see more pics of it on the roads of the big city tomorrow.

haha yeah! I did offer! but he said he had something waiting for him at home :) 

also many thanks to  @Six-cylinder @Mrs6C and @CaptainBoom who came to assist me in my time of need and helped REV get to this point :) 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dead chuffed to see this!  Well done @bobdisk and yourself.  I guess that you removed the cover beind the seat to access the pulley area? 

I suspect you will get papped a lot, even in London (where people famously don't notice things and stare at the ground a lot).  Top stuff and many congratulations.

Make a list of the running issues as they crop up, and they can be tackled a bit at a time.  An oil change will be much easier now you can get it hot and move it into a position to access the drain plug. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

at long last with many thanks to @bobdisk who popped round again, we managed to solve REV's throttle cable woes and I made it to the chippy (and back!) finally :) 

(and I made a Nissan Micra look massive LOL)

510994045_IMG_01211.thumb.JPG.4009cdb201ba54af328abd5b9f22f580.JPG

1822043254_IMG_01221.thumb.JPG.307365dcbf08945052e0cc4980cf8f94.JPG

the issue in the end was because the throttle cable was routed around the pulleys in 2 90 degree angles in an almost Z shape which clearly would not have been helping matters, so I said to bob how about trying to run it under the car like so

r183589808_IMG_01171.thumb.JPG.9ecea0b08fabb249dd414cc3ccbfcef4.JPG

and it looks like that has solved the problem the throttle works lovely now with the existing cable setup (so im still on the broken twist grip which id like to replace) but its much smoother to operate and it no longer jams on :)

she drives pretty well! got up to the thrilling heights of 20Mph, and Oh my the visibility in REV is so much better then the modern driving school cars im use to! I can actually look over my shoulder and see whats behind/beside me, rather then just PILLER

as you can imagine I am very pleased with all of this! as it hopefully means I can start using REV now! she still has some foibles here and there (and id still like to do a full service/oil change)

but now I can use her for trips to the shops to support the household etc :) 

heres hoping she continues to play ball!

No wonder Sadiq Khan has declared a "major incident"

Great news well done.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well done on making it down the road.

I don't know if you spotted it but there was a strand sticking out on the end of the throttle cable you posted a close up of, that really really won't be helping matters and you should replace it as soon a possible. It is entirely possible to fit a new inner cable to the existing outer one if you want to keep the look.

Making up cables only requires at the most basic a hacksaw and blow lamp/ decent soldering iron, liquid flux and solder,  ensure you get plenty of heat into the fitting/ cable and make sure you tin the end of the cable you want to solder to.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...