invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[Richard_FM]

This site has some information on the highest issued registration before 1965 in most areas:

http://web.archive.org/web/20100420032442/http://www.fleetdata.co.uk/allocations.html

[Cavcraft]

Have you seen this one yet, M8?

 

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/James-Captain-Special-Electric-Start-Part-of-Museum-collection/293789684501?hash=item44673ad315:g:kr8AAOSwiSBfib~c

 

'James Captain frame and cycle parts Villers Invacar engine'

 

 

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, Cavcraft said:

Have you seen this one yet, M8?

 

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/James-Captain-Special-Electric-Start-Part-of-Museum-collection/293789684501?hash=item44673ad315:g:kr8AAOSwiSBfib~c

 

'James Captain frame and cycle parts Villers Invacar engine'

 

 

not seen that one specifically  

but indeed in general the Villiers 11E engine from all the various invalid vehicles that used it, was a very popular engine for after market applications finding its way into many bikes and go carts etc, because of just how numerous it was with how many Villiers powered invalid vehicles where made and where being scrapped throughout the 1960s-1980's

the Villiers 11E was actually an invalid vehicle specific derivative of the Villiers 9E, so pretty much anything you find fitted with a Villiers 11E today has an engine that was once in someones invacar (or AC Acedes or Tippen Delta etc)  

 

 

[LightBulbFun]

anyone for a Stanley Argson Deluxe? petrol powered so you could probably actually see 55Mph  on the funny shaped speedo if you dared LOL

https://www.facebook.com/spitalleisure/posts/194624875367946

[Christine]

Bub?

[Out Run]

Wonder what the reg is... 😅

[LightBulbFun]

managed to unearth an old photo of TTW991R back when she was kept at the Yorkshire transport museum  

(have to wonder what bus it is she is next to, I dont know of any bus type with that rear end which entered London Transport service with those fleet names when new at least...)

[Borsuq]

On 29/10/2020 at 01:32, LightBulbFun said:

anyone for a Stanley Argson Deluxe? petrol powered so you could probably actually see 55Mph  on the funny shaped speedo if you dared LOL

https://www.facebook.com/spitalleisure/posts/194624875367946

Ooooh, I want this. I bet it's hilarious to drive.

Shame I can't afford it.

[LightBulbFun]

13 minutes ago, Borsuq said:

Ooooh, I want this. I bet it's hilarious to drive.

Shame I can't afford it.

Yeah I am really quite interested in trying out a Villiers machine and seeing how they are to drive, although Ideally id like to try a full bodied machine (like an Invacar Mk12 or AC Acedes or Tippen delta etc) before having a go on the more whacky open style machines!

yeah price is a little bit strong, but it is in good condition and iv seen similar carriages in similar shape go for a lot more sadly!

but they can be had a bit cheaper if you dont mind a project the Nelco Solocar "only" went for £715

On 20/10/2020 at 12:42, LightBulbFun said:

in other invalid carriage news

have just spotted the Nelco Solocar KPO457 is for sale on ebay

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/324340708253

its on the DVLA which is a nice bonus, a lot of these earlier invalid carriages are not sadly

 

and I do know of 1 and a half Model 70's (and maybe a Model 67) that are in Poland if you can find em  

 

 

 

I wonder wonder what happened to this one in the end...

On 15/09/2019 at 15:32, LightBulbFun said:

https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1155136

a Petrol Argson!  

I think iv seen this one before number plate rings a bell, but I cant confirm

sadly reg turns up nothing on the DVLA checker but it would be very interesting to try and V62 this one! (Just how far back to those dusty old pre DVLC records go? ) 

 

[LightBulbFun]

in other news, iv been contacted via the ICR by the person who bought the Invacar Mk12 that scott sold recently on ebay

and really feel for the guy as he bought the Mk12 with the intention of returning it to the road, and iv had to tell him at present time that cant be done as it has no known chassis number (its one of the Ex Trysull cars and most of them have sadly lost their chassis plates at some point)

(I did explain that I hope in time to be able to date such a vehicle to sufficient standards that the DVLA will accept so such chassis plate-less cars can be registered under an age related plate if an actual chassis number cannot be found, but I think that will be quite the ways away at the current pace the ICR moves at!)

but it really does sadden me, as not many people buy Invacars these days with much intention to use them or put them back on the road, so it pains me to see someone who does want to do so, accidentally buy one of the ones that cant currently be returned to the road!

especially so when there are Mk12's in similar shape with chassis plates for a similar price that can be road registered for sale as I type this

[Mr Pastry]

2 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

(its one of the Ex Trysull cars and most of them have sadly lost their chassis plates at some point)

Clearly you've done the right thing, but where are all the chassis plates going?  I can't see them being very convincing ids for fake Cobra replicas etc.

I would also have thought that there are enough date codes on various parts to satisfy DVLA if you were able to inspect  the vehicle. 

[LightBulbFun]

managed to get a quick word in with Stuart about things  

he said he knew of the Hamblin-Barrett connection for a couple years now (first coming across the connection about the time when he handed the ICR off to Simon) but is quite interested in seeing what I managed to hopefully unearth on the whole topic/subject  

he also noted that the Stanley Argson on the previous page (the one with no reg plate) is one we have seen before!

On 08/07/2019 at 10:36, LightBulbFun said:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/283540757424

I do wonder given a Mk12 can do 45Mph flat out, I wonder what these earlier villers machines could do given they dont have a fibreglass body to also lug around  LOL

the most uncanny thing for me is how it looks like there's nothing controlling the front wheel (but you can see a steering rod lower down)

so at least we know where it ended up now  

50 minutes ago, Mr Pastry said:

Clearly you've done the right thing, but where are all the chassis plates going?  I can't see them being very convincing ids for fake Cobra replicas etc.

I would also have thought that there are enough date codes on various parts to satisfy DVLA if you were able to inspect  the vehicle. 

it was sadly pretty standard practice to strip an invalid vehicle of its identity when scrapping/deposing of it, to try and stop it being returned to the road etc or so they cant be traced back to whoever dumped 13 of them in the middle of the woods!

(and I also have to wonder if over time they simply fell off, as the rivets corroded in the harsh environment or if they did get pinched by someone passing by etc)

 

but yeah indeed I would hope so too on the date code front, one thing I am curious to know is if the Villiers engines can be dated from their serial numbers or not,

but yeah I need to figure out exactly what the DVLA will and wont accept etc

 

there is also the question of is there a chassis number stamped on the chassis itself and if so where is it!

thankfully we know Model 70's have such a chassis number location and this is how I have been able to ID several Model 70's which have otherwise been stripped of registration and chassis plates

but we dont know if any of the Villers machine have anything, nothing has been found sadly

(although in the response I am writing back to the chap with the ex trysull car I will tell him what to look out for incase he has a look at the chassis and does find something!)

[Mr Pastry]

1 minute ago, LightBulbFun said:

but yeah I need to figure out exactly what the DVLA will and wont accept etc

PM incoming. 

[plasticvandan]

It was required as proof of destruction for the official repairers to give the dhss the chassis plate,obviously many did this but didn't scrap the cars,much later on they got wise to this and the cars were taken to head office for crushing instead.

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, plasticvandan said:

It was required as proof of destruction for the official repairers to give the dhss the chassis plate,obviously many did this but didn't scrap the cars,much later on they got wise to this and the cars were taken to head office for crushing instead.

back when these Trysull cars where scrapped im not sure if it was a requirement back in 1980's you could buy scrap invacars from an approved repairer under the notion you would destroy them, but people where not doing so, so that scheme ended and as things changed and became much more centralised (with the IVS changing hands becoming a responsibility of the Department of social security rather than the responsibility of the Department of Health etc)

you are right that over time they requested more proof that a vehicle was destroyed

but I dont think it ever became a requirement that cars where taken from AR's to head office for crushing

I know of a good number of Late Service Model 70's (vehicles marked scrapped or untaxed post March 31st 2003) which where simply dispatched to scrap yards and scrapped (or stripped of their identity and hidden away depending on which survivor we are talking about ) 

and even then they where not always stripped of their ID's see the field find cars where TPA and TWC came from, all of which retained their number plates and chassis plates, even after being marked scrapped

from what I understand by the end in 2003 approved repairs  where simply required to "mutilate beyond economic repair" any machines they held (and thats official wording passed to me by someone who used to be an AR and was close friends with their local AR till the end)

[mitsisigma01]

🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔WTF is an AR in LBF lingo please 

[Out Run]

Approved Repairer. 😁

[plasticvandan]

Only going by what Stuart had written in one of his register pages,may be wrong of course.I know that the chap my grandad worked with just signed a form to say a car had been scrapped and drove it home to use as sheds in his garden.

[dollywobbler]

Have you seen the Invacar for sale on DoneDeal.ie ? 4750 Euros for a project. Good luck... "Porsche engine," well, close...

https://www.donedeal.ie/vintagecars-for-sale/-aacutec-invacar/26382232

[Mrs6C]

2 hours ago, dollywobbler said:

Have you seen the Invacar for sale on DoneDeal.ie ? 4750 Euros for a project. Good luck... "Porsche engine," well, close...

https://www.donedeal.ie/vintagecars-for-sale/-aacutec-invacar/26382232

It has a steering wheel!

The seller, Patrick, is a long-time Landrover enthusiast. It might be worth giving him a call and helping him find the chassis number of that Model 70, then doing a bit of research for him so he can put some history of it together for the prospective purchaser. His telephone number is an Irish one, of course. so needs the Ireland code. The car is mentioned as being in Tullow, which has a Leonard Cheshire home in it, so perhaps that Model 70 had belonged to a resident.

Also from Ireland (NI as opposed to Eire) this looks like a Tippen Delta?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EOZdRJwXkAAZJiJ?format=jpg&name=900x900
https://twitter.com/pipmcgowan/status/1217763303386177537/photo/1

 

[LightBulbFun]

4 hours ago, dollywobbler said:

Have you seen the Invacar for sale on DoneDeal.ie ? 4750 Euros for a project. Good luck... "Porsche engine," well, close...

https://www.donedeal.ie/vintagecars-for-sale/-aacutec-invacar/26382232

no I had not seen that one!

in Ireland thats very interesting as they had no invalid vehicle scheme AFAIK... so either its a private example sold there when new, or an ex Ministry example that someone dragged over from NI or England (the fact its missing its registration plate makes me think ex-ministry example)

2 hours ago, Mrs6C said:

It has a steering wheel!

The seller, Patrick, is a long-time Landrover enthusiast. It might be worth giving him a call and helping him find the chassis number of that Model 70, then doing a bit of research for him so he can put some history of it together for the prospective purchaser. His telephone number is an Irish one, of course. so needs the Ireland code. The car is mentioned as being in Tullow, which has a Leonard Cheshire home in it, so perhaps that Model 70 had belonged to a resident.

yeah shame theres no email option, I found out the hard way when the Invacar Mk12 in Ireland popped up for sale that my phone due to my data plan cant really do international calls!

so ill have to think how I can go about contacting him for the details to help him ID it is as you say

2 hours ago, Mrs6C said:

Also from Ireland (NI as opposed to Eire) this looks like a Tippen Delta?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EOZdRJwXkAAZJiJ?format=jpg&name=900x900
https://twitter.com/pipmcgowan/status/1217763303386177537/photo/1

indeed, looks like a Tippen Delta 3 4 or 5 to be exact  

[Mrs6C]

Have an Argson as well...
http://www.circlecity.co.uk/oldpics/invalid_tricycle.php

... as the Alps Challenge done (for the second time!) with pioneer Danny Denly's original Argson...

More info. on that here...
https://www.disabledmotoring.org/about-us/charity-history

[DVee8]

This is the garage in Thornberry Street, Millfield, Sunderland that maintained them.

[DVee8]

I haven't really got involved in the invacar thread. I can remember there was a invacar that belonged to a owner that lived on St Lukes Road Sunderland, mid to late 80's through to the mid 90's. That  regularly err got picked up and moved by the local yoffs.

[LightBulbFun]

heres a nice eye catching black and white for this thread  

[LightBulbFun]

10 minutes ago, DVee8 said:

This is the garage in Thornberry Street, Millfield, Sunderland that maintained them.

ah thats cool, I wonder if anyone there is still from that time and if they have any parts left over on a dusty shelf at the back...

1 minute ago, DVee8 said:

I haven't really got involved in the invacar thread. I can remember there was a invacar that belonged to a owner that lived on St Lukes Road Sunderland, mid to late 80's through to the mid 90's. That  regularly err got picked up and moved by the local yoffs.

Yeah, its quite neat how almost everyone who was alive when they where still in service has some sort of memory or story involving them  (even if said story is not particularly nice to the person who's Invacar it was!)

[somewhatfoolish]

5 large for a non-runner in a field? No photos worth a damn. Worthy of the Bargain thread.

[LightBulbFun]

4 minutes ago, Andrew353w said:

The earlier Daf 33 vans had 3 separate rear lights, all circular; the top one being the indicator, the middle the brake light and the lower one the tail light, as seen on the van I've recovered and I can confirm this from my late Father's Daf 33 van, which was a "J" reg one.  Later they were combined into a single light cluster,  as evidenced on the NEAR side of the yellow one in your Flickr feed. All the other clusters are not Daf originals! 

ah thats good to know  

although its not my flicker feed just a collection of DAF images I gathered to try and figure out the rear light situation for my Invacar research

(im still curious exactly when the Britax/rubbolite rear lights where introduced and who exactly came up with the design/made them first)

(figured it would be best I drag this back over to my thread before people get twitchy given the invacar content/connection LOL)

[LightBulbFun]

On 28/10/2020 at 01:21, LightBulbFun said:

(will be interesting to see if they then issue xxxYVL next or just jump, randomly?, to one of the many unissued reverse registration series's there are, I noticed for the 1931-1952 age related series's  they will issue them in alphabetical order like before NXSxxx was MXSxxx, but I notice for reverse plates 1953-1962, they dont do this, like it does not look like they issued xxxWVL before xxxXVL was issued)

did a bit of DVLA bashing on this and it looks like they issue reverse registration age related series in an alphabetical order but not quite the way you would expect it

rather then the next series being xxxYVL after xxxXVL was recently all issued as you might expect, it looks like the next series after XVL, is xxxXVM  they incremented the last letter rather then the first letter

and they have been doing these for a while, it explains why for a while I noticed a lot of age related reverse registrations where xxxUX* London ones

and checking back everything from xxxXVA to xxxXVM has been issued as age related series's 

I wonder why they do it this rather then the normal method of incrementing the first letter which is meant to be incremented, as increment the last letter constantly changes the location marker, but with reverse registrations I guess they have a lot more freedom to do that as quite a few county council offices never issued reverse registrations into the later alphabetical series (U V X Y etc)

but some did, and for example as above so far xxxXVA-xxxXVM have all been or are being issued as age related plate series but if they continue like that they are going to going to have fun when they hit the Essex marker VX as xxxXVX was issued in period  (and probably adorned a few Invacar Mk12's being issued in 1961  ) 

so it will be interesting to see what they do there will they finally move onto a new series entirely (ie increment/changing either the first letter, the serial letter, or the middle letter the first of the 2 location marker letters) or will they just skip over it, issue xxxXVY then move onto a whole new reverse age related plate series to issue

[busmansholiday]

How many of these have you ordered ?.

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/4000208354780.html?trace=wwwdetail2mobilesitedetail