invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[sutty2006]

Oooops 

 

 

[LightBulbFun]

3 hours ago, sutty2006 said:

Oooops 

haha as much as id like a team of TV producers to throw money at my car

I think if anyones Invacar needs that its @egg's Mk12!

(that or @OliD-E's 2 halves of a Model 70 although sadly he does not seem to frequent the forum anymore)

 

 

BTW @Eyersey1234 you mentioned in your pistons head thread that you know of 3 on a certain beige forum  

I think there's more than 3 on here now  

on the Model 70 front there's TWC725K (Dollywobblers), TPA621M (Zels), OPH868R (Mrs6c's) and REV451R (mine!) (plus the remains of KPL139P and TPE376S OliD-E's)

and on the Mk12 front there's XWC468F (egg's)

so I count 6 or 7 Invalid vehicles on here now  

[egg]

He's welcome to come round to my lock-up while Mrs Egg does the sob-story about me 'not being as spritely as he once was' ?

[Eyersey1234]

That reminds me @LightBulbFunI must get to the streetlife museum in Hull when this shitty situation is over and see if I can locate the Invacars there

[LightBulbFun]

6 minutes ago, Eyersey1234 said:

That reminds me @LightBulbFunI must get to the streetlife museum in Hull when this shitty situation is over and see if I can locate the Invacars there

ah yes see if you can find (and grab pictures of/info on) GVW564H   

[LightBulbFun]

Yet another picture of GPG721K has been uploaded to flicker

it must be one of the most photographed Model 70s! I wonder which has been photographed more  GPG or TWC  

funnily enough both are the oldest known Surviving Model 70's of their respective manufacturer! 

but more importantly the most recent photo is a relatively close up one of the front, so we get a nice close up of its number plate (think its a Tippers plate, and interestingly it looks to have been riveted on cant say iv seen a number plate get riveted on before!)

but I can also see paint on offside indicator, which tells me that GPG721K has been repainted at some point in time, something I had been wondering about for quite a while now!

(which means I cant trust GPG as a colour reference entirely sadly but I do still think its pretty accurate, if there was a Model 70 forum I imagine asking what colour a Model 70 is would be a good way to start a massive argument LOL)

https://flic.kr/p/2iQQvpR

 

in other news Stuart has taken delivery on a "new" car quite literally!

on a pallet wrapped in whatever industrial cling film is called!

its quite amusing to see a car shipped on a pallet like this LOL

if it looks familiar 

its cuz funnily enough it showed up on the ebay tat thread a little while ago!

On 3/27/2020 at 8:07 PM, Cavcraft said:

Today's big question Would you rather be in a coma or in Acoma?

 

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1970s-MICRO-CAR-ACOMA-MINI-COMTESSE-47cc-PETROL-BUBBLE-CAR-very-RARE/233540564844?hash=item36601a376c:g:FKIAAOSw3axefe2r

 

£1,249! He'll even deliver within 50 miles of Derby for £15.

(a @dollywobbler  shoot out video on the comtesse vs Stuarts Peel P50 would be fun! I have suggested the idea to stuart LOL)

[egg]

I do love a Comtesse. I see it is road registered as well. Microcar World were selling a William/Lawil for £1500.

[Eyersey1234]

Must admit I hadn't heard of a Comtesse before. 

[somewhatfoolish]

On 4/15/2020 at 8:31 PM, barrett said:

Er, yes, one of those. It's just visible in the back of a photo I have been sent and now way of deciphering which it actually is, but it's 'that shape' and dark blue.

I keep having naughty thoughts about that Harper! It's much less appealing being an electric one, however, which may just about stop me driving up and down the A3 looking for it when I'm allowed out again

Electric? Provided the money was right I'd have a crack at that, could be an interesting diversion fitting some cells from a Leaf or similar. Unicorn status guaranteed!

[cobblers]

On 4/16/2020 at 9:16 PM, LightBulbFun said:

Im not entirely sure what thread this should go in, (could go in the tech thread the computershite thread or the what have you fixed thread!)

 so im just going to stick it here in my own thread and hopefully someone might find it interesting!

 

as some of you may know I do have a 3rd hobby which is computers, specifically focusing on (older) Apple computers (but i also like tinkering with other computers in general as well)

and as such I had an iMac G4, (a 2002 desktop computer) which had a very dead CPU (note the melted and burnt plastic and thermal paste, plus the die (the thing you can see "XPC7451" written on) is meant to be purple not green!)

now normally this would be the end of the line for such a computer or its logic board (motherboard in non apple speak) because as you can see the CPU is soldered to the logic board via a Ball grid array or BGA for short, (its not in any sort of socket sadly)

what BGA is in basic terms, on the circuit board there are lots of little pads and on the CPU are lots of little solder balls the 2 are then lined up and everything is heated up until the solder balls melt and attach themselves with the CPU to the circuit boards pads

most people would tell you that CPUs and the such like attached to circuit boards by such methods are not replaceable/repairable but armed with a few tools I set about replacing it, and I figured id show a rough process of what I did etc  

 

first of all I need a new CPU to put in it, these apple computers from the time dont use off the shelf CPUs you can buy from ebay persay, so I had to salvage a suitable CPU from another apple CPU daughter card I had not helped by the fact these CPUs are soldered down and in general CPUs of all types which are of the type that get soldered down are not easy to find as they are not considered end user replaceable (but you can buy the daughter cards easily enough from ebay but you cant get the CPU's themselves easily)

so here I am preheating the donner CPU card to remove its CPU (the white goopy stuff around the CPU is soldering flux, this helps clean things up and helps the solder flow and stick to things better etc, much like how a plumber uses flux to help solder his pipes!)

(the preheating means I don't have to sit there blasting the relatively delicate CPU with hot air for as long as if I did it without preheating)

then after heating the CPU card with a hot air gun the solder balls under the CPU melts and I was able to lift the CPU off, which you can see on the right on the body of the hot air gun just for safekeeping

now the problem with re-using BGA CPUs like this is all the little solder balls get messed up when you lift the chip up so I have to clean up the "new" CPU and put fresh solder balls on, which I have done here using a stencil, then heating the balls up so they melt in place then removing the stencil  

then finally getting the iMac logic board with the dead CPU on the preheater ready to remove its dead CPU

 

I then removed the old CPU same way as above, but when you do this some of the solder is left on the pads on the circuit board and this has to be cleaned up etc ready for the new CPU like so  which I do using my soldering iron and some solder wick (a special copper braid that's good at sucking up solder from the pads etc  )

 

and then finally I take the new CPU pop on the board, and carefully poke and prod at it until its as lined up as I can get it, then hit it with the hot air gun until it solders itself in place

 

side on view of the now soldered, solder balls

 

and after putting it all back together again im pleased to report the computer now turned on and worked!

well kinda LOL it sadly still has issues, in that it locks up soon after booting, but i'm pretty pleased it worked at all!

given I had no idea if this board had any other issues, I just knew the CPU was very dead so figured id try replacing that as a start  

im still investigating the issues, but hopefully i can fix in the next few days or so, but as mentioned the board might have had other issues before the CPU cooked itself, which are now manifesting themselves

 

as a side note I think this is the first time I have done such work to repair a computer

this is not my first time doing BGA soldering, far from it  iv done it a good few times now, but that was to upgrade existing working CPU cards with newer/faster CPUs  (and I have mentioned this in passing in one of the tech/computer threads on here but I don't think I ever documented the whole process!)

the CPU I have fitted here is also a faster/better version of what it replaced so it is an upgrade in that regard too, but it was done primarily to try and fix the machine rather then upgrade it so thats just a nice side bonus in this case  (the old CPU was a PowerPC 7451 CPU rated at 800Mhz, the "new" CPU I fitted is a PowerPC 7455 rated at a faster 1Ghz although I have not adjusted the computer to run at that speed yet)

 

hope this little off topic excursion was enjoyable and made some modicum of sense! if anyone has any questions about it feel free to ask and ill be more than happy to try and answer them!

 

I repair electronic stuff for a living and there's nothing I hate more than BGA rework. It's a nightmare even in my proper workshop so absolutely hats off to you for doing that in your bedroom!

[LightBulbFun]

2 hours ago, cobblers said:

I repair electronic stuff for a living and there's nothing I hate more than BGA rework. It's a nightmare even in my proper workshop so absolutely hats off to you for doing that in your bedroom!

thanks!  (I have been enjoying your thread on your work ) 

yeah I have not touched any plastic BGA chips, with my current setup im pretty sure its just a recipe for popcorn...

ceramic BGA chips are much more resilient in that regard! 

tho funnily enough I have to say for me I find BGA  work easier then small SMD work!, but I think thats because of my CP which makes my hands shake, which makes tiny SMD rework a PITA!

trying to place that one tiny ass resistor while your hand is spazzing out, not fun LOL (especially for it to then only get blown halfway across the unknown universe by the hot air gun)

where as the BGA work I do, once iv spent a couple minutes gently minutes tapping the CPU to get it lined up, all I have to do then is "just" sit over it with a hot air gun at the right settings etc until it reflows!

but thats not to say BGA work is a walk in the park either! and larger SMD work aint too bad  

 

you should have seen the first time I did BGA soldering tho, to this day im surprised the CPU card I upgraded then is STILL working 3 years later (admittedly I did reflow it a while later with actual decent flux LOL)

as that setup was properly janky, I had no preheater shitty pen type flux, a soldering iron with sweet FA in the way of thermal mass, and somehow it all worked (well minus the L2 cache at the start!)

you can read about it in my thread on another forum here https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/making-a-g4-pismo-upgrade-at-home.2019269/

(do wish I gave it a better write up like I did my next threads on the subject!) 

heres a couple more I did later 

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/replacing-the-pearl-in-the-clamshell-diy-ibook-g3-clamshell-g4-cpu-upgrade.2105654/

 

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/bussing-around-with-a-g3-beige-xpc106-memory-controller-upgrade.2119510/

 

and here's some pictures of another PowerBook G3 Pismo card I upgraded to a G4 a little bit later for someone else (iv done a few of these Pismo cards now!)

 

 

 

 

(thankfully I can still get 7410 CPUs "new" from ebay, well pretty sure they might be pulls, but the important thing is they come with solder balls so I dont have to faff around with reballing yay)

[LightBulbFun]

3 hours ago, somewhatfoolish said:

Electric? Provided the money was right I'd have a crack at that, could be an interesting diversion fitting some cells from a Leaf or similar. Unicorn status guaranteed!

Yeah I have wondered how well an electric invalid vehicle would do these days if fitted with modern batteries 

much like what @Zelandeth wants to do with his Sinclair C5  

[LightBulbFun]

stuarts electric harding is coming along nicely!

heres how it looked about a month ago

 

thought to be pretty much the last actual invalid carriage to made (ie to that original definition of an invalid carriage, a vehicle built specifically for use by the disabled weighing no more than 254Kg)

its amazingly from 1968! (with several date codes scattered throughout the machine backing that up, wonder if he still has that lightbulb in the fridge...)

its amazing to think at the time this was built the Model 70 was well under development (infact WPB-G being a surrey reg, so for all we know there could have been a Prototype Model 70 registered along side it! sadly I don't think any Surry registration records survive to check that!)

 

his full facebook post about it can be found here, for those interested in some more details/pics  

https://www.facebook.com/groups/950689934973969/permalink/2919494191426857/

I do think he should sign up to the forum, as I think his vehicular content would go down well here  

 

its interesting to note the plug socket on the back, I do wonder what its for exactly/how it ties into the electrical system

(I almost want to say thats where the mains plugs in to charge it or such but that would mean you would have live mains 240V coming OUT OF a plug which would be quite dangerous!)

earlier hardings had the same sort of thing too, (but with obviously the older BS546 plug, since in 1939, BS1363 sockets/plugs where not a thing!, but that is also another clue to the age of Stuarts harding)

[plasticvandan]

I'd love to know who runs that group,as I appear to be blocked from it

[keef]

6 hours ago, plasticvandan said:

I'd love to know who runs that group,as I appear to be blocked from it

Looks like https://m.facebook.com/danny.walker.925 is your man.

 

[barrett]

I do hope he's not going to paint that Harding...

[Out Run]

Busa engine swap reqd

[LightBulbFun]

twas doing some light sleuthing 

stumbled across this picture of PEV627D again 

somehow i never realised that it was actually snapped by @quicksilver himself  (I wonder if anyone (@MorrisItalSLX?) knows who made the plate, its interesting how it has little serifs? on the letters)

but its interesting to note  his 2015 comment on it  not showing up on the DVLA system 

https://flic.kr/p/qUnJdL

(that we now obviously know is not because of any events in 2003!)

make me think this/was yet another case of a vehicle being brought back to life on the DVLA system from that twilight zone between 1974-1980 or so

and a couple others things that make me think the above are also its Jan 1982 tax due date, and the fact its its just "INVACAR" (not INVACAR UNKNOWN) on the MOT checker

it is interesting to note that my fancy tool cant pull PEV627D's info at all no matter what I try (something I noticed is somewhat common with such "brought back from the dead" vehicles, but interestingly maybe through sheer will power @egg's Mk12 aint a problem LOL)

 

(for those wondering I do know as far back as Feb 2019 it showed up so it must have been brought back to life sometime between 2015 and 2019, sadly? its last V5 issued date is March 2019, so I cant use that to tell me when it came alive)

[MorrisItalSLX]

3 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

stumbled across this picture of PEV627D again 

somehow i never realised that it was actually snapped by @quicksilver himself  (I wonder if anyone (@MorrisItalSLX?) knows who made the plate, its interesting how it has little serifs? on the letters)

The only presses plates I’ve come across with serifs on the letters were made by Hills.

[keef]

5 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

twas doing some light sleuthing 

stumbled across this picture of PEV627D again 

Interesting reg on the TIPPEN DELTA as well.

 

[LightBulbFun]

On 4/23/2020 at 7:30 AM, keef said:

Interesting reg on the TIPPEN DELTA as well.

 

indeed newly produced Tippen Deltas where all registered in Coventry as thats where Frank Tippens and sons where based  

ORW132F is a VERY early Petrol Delta 8, the 29th off the production line! believed to be with scott milnes (along with PEV627D above) 

I say newly produced as the Tippen Delta at Frank Tippen and sons ceased production when they downsized in 1970 or so

however Frank Tippen and Sons did continue  to provide/produce all the electrical bits to make an electric Tippen delta and supplied them to Fred miller Ltd in lancashire, who rebuilt/refurbished petrol Tippen Deltas into electric tippen deltas for the DHSS until 1978!

(making it what must be one of the first cases of petrol vehicles getting converted to electric?!)

these vehicles were registered as new vehicles with lancashire/preston registrations 

(as well as providing electrical bits, Frank Tippen and Sons also made Model 70 bits for the DHSS into the 1990s)

[keef]

There's A Flickr Album for Invacar but not Tipen Delta, as far as I can see.

I did try and create one, but the "new" Flickr doesn't seem to want to play ball.  The mobile version doesn't even seem to contain the option to add a new Album.

[LightBulbFun]

18 minutes ago, keef said:

There's A Flickr Album for Invacar but not Tipen Delta, as far as I can see.

I did try and create one, but the "new" Flickr doesn't seem to want to play ball.  The mobile version doesn't even seem to contain the option to add a new Album.

ah if your refering to this https://www.flickr.com/groups/2284164@N25/pool/page1

then I think its for all types? there a couple Tippen Delta's in there! 

(I dont a flicker account tho, I should make one one of these days!)

 

its just there are a lot less Tippen Delta pictures out there sadly!

just taking 1970-1978

there where about 18,150 DHSS Model 70's produced in that period, compared to about 546 (Electric) tippen deltas for the same time span!

so you can see why the Model 70 is when it comes to invalid vehicles the most common spot throughout the 1970's onwards!

[keef]

Yes, you should have a Flickr account. It's free for a few hundred photos.

Yes, that's the Invacar Album. I just noticed there were 20 Tippen Delta photos, so would be worth a seperate album. https://www.flickr.com/search/?text=tippen delta&view_all=1

 

[LightBulbFun]

Oh yay I found this again LOL just something I found on facebook of someone having fun with photoshop LOL

regrettably never did save it the first time round, so im happy to have unearthed it again LOL

[LightBulbFun]

On 4/22/2020 at 10:52 AM, barrett said:

I do hope he's not going to paint that Harding...

stuart says he has to paint it sadly as while it looks ok in photos all the grey paint is just flaking off all over the place sadly (that and given the other parts he has been forced to paint/replace/refresh he said it would look odd otherwise)

 

[Out Run]

1 hour ago, LightBulbFun said:

Oh yay I found this again LOL just something I found on facebook of someone having fun with photoshop LOL

regrettably never did save it the first time round, so im happy to have unearthed it again LOL

Should have done a Model 67 IMO. The original design, without the afterthought arch extensions.

Maybe that Photoshop was imagined as having a big running gear upgrade and subsequent wider track. Like that from a Big Red quad.

[LightBulbFun]

25 minutes ago, Out Run said:

Should have done a Model 67 IMO. The original design, without the afterthought arch extensions.

I wouldn't call the rear wheel arches an afterthought I think they were/are integrated quite well into the overall body shape  

certainly I prefer the look of the overall body shape of the Model 70 over that of the Model 67 but that shouldn't come as a surprise as anyone really!

you say "Model 67. the original design" however  the first Model 70 prototypes predate the first Model 67's, so one could potentially argue the Model 67 was just a stop gap until the Model 70 chassis was ready for its body!

much like the SRT in someways   http://www.countrybus.org/STL/SRT.htm

keeping in mind a Model 67 (especially the Mk14 and Mk14A) is just a Model 57 design with a fibreglass body lumped on top 

but sadly there is very little info out there on the production/development of the Model 67

(one thing id like to find out is how the wheelbase of the 57 and 67 compare so I can figure out just how identical the 2 are LOL)

[LightBulbFun]

I might not be able to get work done on my own invacar sadly,

but im pleased to say I have been able to help stuart with the electric side of his harding  

hopefully (famous last words) by tomorrow we will have speed control working  

 

also while talking to stuart about all this the subject drifted onto lightbulbs, and it turns out he only happens to have 2 Bayonet capped fluorescent tubes hidden away in his shed! one was stashed away and one was/is built into the shed itself with its 1940s control box still, removing that one without bringing down half the shed is going to be fun!

so that was very exciting! he has very kindly offered them to me when I can either collect them or get them collected!

I was planning on visiting Stuart once I had REV on the road anyway, and how many fluorescent tubes Can you fit in a Model 70 is a fun game iv been wanting to play  so that works out nicely I guess LOL

(can you imagine being some traffic copper sitting on an overpass and you see an Invacar fly down the Motorway with a load of fluorescent tubes sticking out of the side windows like some sort mad exhaust stack LOL)

 

for those who dont know, while we (Osram GEC) did technically invent the fluorescent tube first it was GE in the US with its massive clout who managed to properly bring it to market properly first in 1938

but by the time the "tech" had come back to the UK WW2 was underway so the "standard" US 4ft 40W Tube had to be redesigned around components already in manufacture in the UK so companies did not have to make new tooling etc

and such was the 5ft 80W bayonet capped flourcent tube born, stretched to 5ft and 80W so it could run off an existing 80W mercury vapour lamp choke (ballast), and then used normal bayonet capped end caps from normal lightbulbs

early bayonet capped tubes really did have normal lightbulb end caps http://www.lamptech.co.uk/Spec Sheets/D FL Silicate Ar Mazda F80T12-WW BC.htm

but these are quite rare (Osram GEC was the last manufacture to make BC tubes in this style making them until the mid 1980s I think) if anyone does have any please do let me know im quite eiger to add one to the collection  

 

such tho was the popularity of the BC tube and its fixtures throughout the war and just after the war, that replacement BC capped tubes did remain in production until 1992!

however despite this, any and all types of Bayonet capped tubes are sadly still very rare today including the later skirted cap types (which used a type of widened bayonet end cap which meant they could use a normal type tube without having to have special ends for the narrower incandescent lamp end caps) 

and this later skirted type is the 2 that Stuart has stashed away

the first is this Philips MCFA one, sadly going by the large splotches of missing phosphor i fear this one may have gone to air a long time ago, but im hoping im wrong (sadly I don't think Stuart has any sort of Plasma ball or such to try and make it glow to test if its still under "vacuum" or not)

this one is however unusual because it says Cool White /33 now Colour 33 was known as Daylight in the UK until the late 1970's where it was finally labeled up as cool white to match the rest of the world, but this tubes date code is 49, so that indicates its from January 1962! so that's a bit of a mistary! 

another rare feature is the fact its an MCFA tube and would have had an earthing stripe running down the length of the tube of which you can see the remains of in the second picture http://www.lamptech.co.uk/Spec Sheets/D FL Mazda MCFA20.htm

the second is this Omega branded (BLI made) one  I sadly dont know when this one was made (I know what the date code is, its the dots you see scattered around the etch, but I sadly dont know how to decipher them) but I can say this one is also likely from the 1960s going by its etch style etc

this one looks to be in much better condition and im hopeful it still works as well

 

 

I have wanted to get a bayonet capped fluorescent tube in the collection for many years now so this is/was quite exciting  

 

On 4/23/2020 at 5:45 AM, MorrisItalSLX said:

The only presses plates I’ve come across with serifs on the letters were made by Hills.

yeah stuart says they are Hills for sure  

[LightBulbFun]

in other news a small parcel arrived from @gm yesterday and in it was an old BT Cardbus wifi card

its something gm posted in one of the other threads on here, wanting rid of it, and I expressed mild interest in it, because I belived it to be compatible with OS X

however I did mention I already had an OS X compatible wifi cardbus card so didn't need another, just mentioned that if no one else takes it ill have it to save it from the trash, but he still kindly sent it to me

well im pleased to say my research/hunch was correct and it works nicely in my upgraded PowerBook G3 under OS X