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12 year old car in 0 Star EURO NCAP test shocker...


17-Coffees

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I'm not sure a Punto has suddenly become a death trap over the past twelve years, for me this asks more questions of the fitness for purpose of the NCAP system.

 

Strongly suspect that the Punto is a lot nearer to a brand new 5 star car than it is, say, a 1993 car.

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How does nocap work for motorbikes then? Will a 2017 Yammy fare similarly to a 1917 Indian? Or does it have airbags to inflate the rider themselves, in case of a hard landing? Could I patent this idea?

 

Airbags for motorbikes - already happening. Actually it's airbags in the clothing - the Dianese D-Air systemhqdefault.jpg

 

dainese_dair_misano_1000_bianco_rosso_2.

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I'm not sure a Punto has suddenly become a death trap over the past twelve years, for me this asks more questions of the fitness for purpose of the NCAP system.

 

Strongly suspect that the Punto is a lot nearer to a brand new 5 star car than it is, say, a 1993 car.

I agree. I think NCAP has became a victim of its own success in the 1990s in forcing manufacturers to build stronger, safer cars and now basically finds differences between models on the basis on how many electric ‘assistance’ devices a car has.

 

By 2027 all non-self driving cars will probably all score ‘0’ stars.

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When the first NCAP ratings came out, I had a 1996 Rover 100 and 1985 2cv. These were by far the two worst performers in the tests, but as others have said, it is not a fair comparison - a 40 year old design against a brand new one. The standards also move, probably because too many were getting 5 stars. That Punto is obviously safer than the 2cv as it will have had modern safety standards, presumably crumple zones, a steering column that will not spear its way through your chest etc. I worry that a lot of it now means the car is more intelligent than the driver, but these things should be an aid, not a replacement for observation, preparation and paying attention.

 

 Having said this, the ratings clearly don't bother me much, as I still have the 2cv, a 2002 Clio (which I think was 3 star when new), A new Sandero Stepway which I think is 3 or 4 star, and commute daily on a moped. As far as I am aware, I am not currently dead, so there must be some merit in being aware of your environment rather than cocooned!   

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I'm not sure a Punto has suddenly become a death trap over the past twelve years, for me this asks more questions of the fitness for purpose of the NCAP system.

 

Strongly suspect that the Punto is a lot nearer to a brand new 5 star car than it is, say, a 1993 car.

Aye, this. Just seems like sensationalist rubbish aimed at getting people to buy brand new cars because little Johnny will be traveling in the back.

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Look how the nearside B pillar has remained largely intact on that Punto.

 

As Wat_ says its just your Donald really. I had a pal who flipped his MK4 Astra end over end into a field at high speed. The only reason he survived was because he didnt have a seatbelt on and was thrown out through the rear window.

 

Not that I'm advocating not wearing a seatbelt, but it kind of illustrates my point that a lot of whether or not (and how well) you survive is pretty much beyond your control.

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FakeConcern, please don’t use that Fifth Gear video as a ‘new cars are better’ argument. The Fifth Gear crash tests were always exaggerated for dramatic effect - another example is slamming a Smart into a concrete barrier at a 45° angle at 80mph.

In this case, the 940 had its engine removed (a fairly well known fact). Of course the Modus didn’t deform.

What evidence do you have for that? I've seen this repeated online a lot but no evidence to prove they removed the engine!

 

I don't know about you, but this looks a lot like an engine to me:

5d6cf1c30274ef967ceb43d62a4281d8.jpg

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I note that as machines have to conform to higher and higher standards to achieve the same exam mark, the opposite is happening for humans. Given we're still the ones driving these cars with almost zero education in safe driving and that worn ditchfinders compromise safety so much, I think the latest cars are probably safer than they need be.

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Only been involved in one major shunt so far (and hope it stays that way!).

 

Doing around 60mph along a main road, and went straight into the nearside front corner of a fuel tanker.  Momentarily left the ground and span three full 360 degree rotations before coming to rest.  The tanker driver was sure at that point he'd killed me.

 

Walked out of the car with scraped knuckles from punching the indicator and wiper stalks in the impact and a bruise from the seatbelt.

 

Pedal box was shoved back about an inch, that was basically the only intrusion into the cabin.

 

What was I driving?  A 1988 Skoda Estelle 130GL.

 

The best safety device I think cars should be fitted with these days is a mobile phone jamming device so people can't text or use Facebook when they're driving.

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I've seen the aftermath of a Skoda Favorit vs a BMW 3 series in 1995, BMW was nearly new and the driver had to be cut free, Favorit was badly mangled and the roof bent, plus the gearbox casing shattered, but the drivers door still opened, and the driver had minor cuts & bruises, BM driver had a few broken bones. I'm deeply against all these driver aids coming in, because look at what happened with Jeep, the cars were remotely hackable, and everything could be switched off, plus as cars become older and solder joints in the expensive ECUs dry up, what are the odds of all this tech still working correctly? This reeks of scaremongering to get people into the latest plastic Eurobox on PCP

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For me that NCAP horseshit is on the same level as the manufacturer's fuel economy data, VW's diesel emission values, whatever a politician says

and the market predictions of the banksters.

 

We are dealing with organised crime on the highest level here and if you think about it, the scam is so simple that nobody is able to identify it as such.

 

They all only want what's best for you. Yep. Your money. Moolah. Dosh. Lolly. Shekels. Green stuff. Profits. More Profits. Record Profits.

Shareholder value.

 

Apart from this, they don't care about you. They don't give a shit about you. Not one little shit. Nemo. Nix. Nada. Zilch. Get over it.

 

I bet you anything, you take a car with a gadzillion of those stupid NCAP stars and run it into the very same concrete block just shifted ten inches

to either side and watch it disintegrate in hilarious fashion, because they are designed to score in the NCAP test and nowt else.

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I have said before on here I saw the outcome of a head-on between a 60's Humber Snipe and a 70's Honda Civic at highway speed. That lead to the Auckland harbour bridge being fitted with a moveable (to cope with rush hours) concrete median barrier. That has done more to fix a problem than any NCAP test can ever do. I don't think there as been a head-on on that stretch of road for 30 years now.

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FakeConcern, please don’t use that Fifth Gear video as a ‘new cars are better’ argument. The Fifth Gear crash tests were always exaggerated for dramatic effect - another example is slamming a Smart into a concrete barrier at a 45° angle at 80mph.

In this case, the 940 had its engine removed (a fairly well known fact). Of course the Modus didn’t deform.

 

The Modus is a much tougher design, whether you believe the 940 was engineless, or not.

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Doesn't matter. People [-]can't[/-] crash into [-]something[/-] what they are staring at!

It's called target fixation and causes many road accidents.

 

I have said before on here I saw the outcome of a head-on between a 60's Humber Snipe and a 70's Honda Civic at highway speed.

Which came off worst?
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I was considering a Grande Punto for Parkettes first car. This hasn't changed my mind at all. If anything it has probably done me a favour by knocking a few quid of the Punto second hand values.

 

A well maintained ten year old car with decent tyres and brakes is a perfectly feasible mode of transportation. In poor weather I would rather have a £700 Punto with front drive on decent Uniroyals rather than a 3 year old RWD Merc on Ditchfinders. Drive properly and you'll be fine.

 

The fact is you can't legislate away every risk. Nothing to stop me buying the worlds safest car but then slipping over on an icy street or electrocuting myself with a dodgy kettle. Just be careful and aware and if someone else isn't and wipes you out, there's nothing you could have done anyway!

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Driving modern cars with their NCAP and their safety aides makes you lazy and a worse driver and therefore more likely to have a crash - because "I'll be OK it's got a 5 star NCAP rating"

 

Driving old cars where you have to anticipate, and read the road and rely on good old fashioned reactions makes you a better driver and therefore less likely to have a crash.  

 

Well, that's my take on it.  

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As previously stated it's a load of horse shit. My parent's 66 C Class has all the auto brake etc crash prevention and if anything it makes things worse. It likes to brake automatically when overtaking if the front bumper gets a little close to the car in front when pulling out, it's the weirdest sensation. Can't imagine that's any good when you're desperately trying to avoid someone or something, like a deer.

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I've seen the aftermath of a Skoda Favorit vs a BMW 3 series in 1995, BMW was nearly new and the driver had to be cut free, Favorit was badly mangled and the roof bent, plus the gearbox casing shattered, but the drivers door still opened, and the driver had minor cuts & bruises, BM driver had a few broken bones. I'm deeply against all these driver aids coming in, because look at what happened with Jeep, the cars were remotely hackable, and everything could be switched off, plus as cars become older and solder joints in the expensive ECUs dry up, what are the odds of all this tech still working correctly? This reeks of scaremongering to get people into the latest plastic Eurobox on PCP

On the other hand my dads colleague at work was killed in a Favorit when he hit something at 40. Wouldn’t fancy my chances in one.

 

Agree with what you say though a lot of this is rigged, in fifth gear when they went head on against a Volvo they took the engine out of it for some bizarre reason.

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one that I always remember is:

 

'From June 2003 the X5 has an intelligent seat belt reminder system fitted for the driver and front seat passenger to buckle up their seat belts. As a result, the X5 has been awarded extra points that now gives the car the five star crashworthiness rating'

 

 

I have something similar in my car-  it's called me, seatbelts or GTF out. 

 

it was shortly after this I genuinely stopped taking any notice of ncap ratings. In a crash the car is still a 4star rated car, extra points for electronic aids is a piss take. You could add all these to a Herald and get a decent rating based on  driver aids alone but I'd still rather smash up a Punto than a Herald. 

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but most modern cars are a slow beast , they only appear to go fast , I believe this is a gov design ploy to increase fuel mpg ,reduce road wear and accident fall out . .

 

for my evidence  , I was again reduced to sub 25 mph speeds on a open road throu the local woods and the leading cars were some 15 or more years younger than mine !!! , not even a bend to worry about unless you were doing 70 plus !

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