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Dollywobbler's Invacar - Ongoing


dollywobbler

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Oooh yay! :)

 

 

been very interesting too, the most noticeable thing to me, is how much quiter she is now, is that due to microphone/setup changes or is she really that much quieter then before?

 

and yeah I see what you mean about the Revs staying constant till 55 instead of 45, I wonder if its because of the miss matched 780 and 790 pulley setup? although the way you have it setup now all the sheave diameters should be the same size as the original 795 setup if im reading the how its sized thing correctly and its the sheave size that would affect max CVT speed right? (I do wonder now, if the revs stay at 3500RPM for longer now, does that mean you effectively have longer gearing therefor a higher theoretical top speed?  :mrgreen: )

 

 

I would get her up on some axle stands and see how she compares to Zels video where you can quite clearly hear the Revs go up at 45Mph  :)

 

 

 

all in all tho well done!, im very happy to see you got TWC running so well now especially given how much of a struggle its been! :)

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Having had the chance to watch that latest video last night it really night and day isn't it.

 

One thing that I've noticed on TP is a low frequency "hum" which starts to become noticeable from around 30mph, it seems to be there on TWC as well, albeit a lot quieter. Has that been affected by the belt/pulley changes? It's a bit hard to judge from video as it seems to come out a bit different every time and microphones always seem to struggle with low frequency audio. Sound isn't unlike a wheel bearing droning, but I've checked and they're all smooth. Just hoping it's a quirk of the CVT and not indicative of a deeper problem in my gearbox/diff.

 

The behaviour of your drive "dragging" irregularly sounds quite similar to what I've felt on a couple of occasions in TP especially when coming to rest, almost like a missfire in how it feels through the car.

 

Can definitely see me ordering a set of these myself...

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Makes sense though- the Deere Gator has similar size wheels, a similar engine with similar top speed so I would guess that the spring rate would be set for about 55 in that application (you can road register the Gator here).

 

It may pay for TWC to be in CVT flux for most daily use because of the hills around its locale.

 

Phil

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Yes, there is definitely a deep vibration or hum around 30mph. Took TWC up the Autoshite Cymru test hill today, and she was generally able to hold 35mph. The transformation is not vast in terms of hill climbing ability, but the revs are much more consistent and she certainly doesn't bog down like she did.

 

I had fitted the belt back to front. Swapped it today, which has made absolutely not the slightest bit of difference. 

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Yes, there is definitely a deep vibration or hum around 30mph. Took TWC up the Autoshite Cymru test hill today, and she was generally able to hold 35mph. The transformation is not vast in terms of hill climbing ability, but the revs are much more consistent and she certainly doesn't bog down like she did.

 

I had fitted the belt back to front. Swapped it today, which has made absolutely not the slightest bit of difference. 

 

is it time for a Big Bore upgrade for TWC now?  :mrgreen: (I imagine it would be pretty easy to source some 650cc Piston and barrels for her :) )

 

Also MOT time? :)

 

(did you get a chance to try adjusting the belt tension?)

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I decided not to adjust the belt tension. It sort of self-sets once the pulleys starts turning anyway, so the adjustment is just to minimise slack as drive is taken up. She's pretty good in that respect, so I'll leave well alone.

 

Got the windscreen washer pump fitted today, so she's MOT ready. Just need to find a chance to take her for one. Like TPA, currently making use of the 40-year exemption.

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Yes, there is definitely a deep vibration or hum around 30mph. Took TWC up the Autoshite Cymru test hill today, and she was generally able to hold 35mph. The transformation is not vast in terms of hill climbing ability, but the revs are much more consistent and she certainly doesn't bog down like she did.

 

I had fitted the belt back to front. Swapped it today, which has made absolutely not the slightest bit of difference.

Some belts I came across on some farm machinery are designed so that the braiding in the belt is wrapped in a particular way. As such even if it's an apparently non-directional belt, if it's running under load the wrong way it's likely to be less long lived. Know the belts on one of the big grain drier fans we had (nice big 30hp motor on the fan, that made a nice noise when it started up, and the lights in every property for about 1/4 a mile dimmed when the contactor closed...) were like that. It would shred them in a couple of weeks if they were fitted backwards, and they just looked like totally ordinary (if large) V-belts. Usually got a few years out of them fitted the right way around...and even then they usually used to stretch and screech horribly rather than snapping.

 

Seeing the fallout from that definitely made you appreciate the safety cage around the belts though, and make you want to give any engineer who couldn't be bothered not to put it back on a good kicking. A couple of tonnes of fan has a lot of momentum when it's spinning at a few hundred rpm...it doesn't stop just because a belt has started to delaminate and has decided to tie itself in a knot with its neighbour...

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Some belts I came across on some farm machinery are designed so that the braiding in the belt is wrapped in a particular way. As such even if it's an apparently non-directional belt, if it's running under load the wrong way it's likely to be less long lived. Know the belts on one of the big grain drier fans we had (nice big 30hp motor on the fan, that made a nice noise when it started up, and the lights in every property for about 1/4 a mile dimmed when the contactor closed...) were like that. It would shred them in a couple of weeks if they were fitted backwards, and they just looked like totally ordinary (if large) V-belts. Usually got a few years out of them fitted the right way around...and even then they usually used to stretch and screech horribly rather than snapping.

 

Seeing the fallout from that definitely made you appreciate the safety cage around the belts though, and make you want to give any engineer who couldn't be bothered not to put it back on a good kicking. A couple of tonnes of fan has a lot of momentum when it's spinning at a few hundred rpm...it doesn't stop just because a belt has started to delaminate and has decided to tie itself in a knot with its neighbour...

 

Yeah, I went for a drive without the guard or engine cover today. I was pretty sure the belt wouldn't explode into fragments, but even so...

 

Having had one belt shred itself to bits, you get fair warning as bits start being hurled into the safety cage with a fair degree of force!

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Went for a drive to Penrhyncoch.

D3YmZkrW4AEv8_c.jpg

 

Had an MOT at the best garage in the world.

D3YypLfW0AAK11p.jpg

 

Fun fact - that Ensign was last on the road in the year TWC entered it for the very first time.

 

As I got home, this happened!

D3ZKNvdXoAIbdio.jpg

 

November 2017

D3ZLbKbX4AAX21q.jpg

 

You've come a long way TWC!

D3ZLdm1XkAA62MP.jpg

 

Next month, planning to visit Thundersley and the Retro Rides Weekender at Goodwood.

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Yay! Congrats to you and TWC for another MOT, and a clean pass at that too :)

 

Just 1 of 2 Model 70s with current MOTs

 

2000 miles in an Invacar :)

 

what did the MOT man say to that?  :mrgreen:

 

when you make it to Thundersley can you have a nosey around for me?

 

it looks like there might be a long lost invacar there to greet TWC http://autoshite.com/topic/32723-wanted-an-invacar-ac-model-70-and-general-ramble-thread-with-survivors-list-on-page-26-and-thread-index-on-page-1/?p=1768116

 

and it would be great to get some more info on that one :)

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I would still love to see this hammering down the M5 or round the M42....

 

Needn’t be too scary - just keep to the slow lane and do one short motorway junction to begin with. Just let lorries roll past in the middle lane and I think you’ll be fine.

 

Would certainly get a feel for it. If she can do 60, 50mph in the slow lane would be alright I think...

 

Come on man! ;)

 

Furthermore....when is she due another oil change?

 

I love your video of this....especially when you take off....the noise that I can only compare to my time as a young child about to mix up some cake mix banging the wooden spoon against the edge of the bowl...

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I would still love to see this hammering down the M5 or round the M42....

 

Needn’t be too scary - just keep to the slow lane and do one short motorway junction to begin with. Just let lorries roll past in the middle lane and I think you’ll be fine.

 

Would certainly get a feel for it. If she can do 60, 50mph in the slow lane would be alright I think...

 

Come on man! ;)

 

Furthermore....when is she due another oil change?

 

I love your video of this....especially when you take off....the noise that I can only compare to my time as a young child about to mix up some cake mix banging the wooden spoon against the edge of the bowl...

 

Slow lane?

 

I think not, not with a reported top speed of 82Mph  :mrgreen:

 

theres a verse in the song "Thunderseley Invacar" at about 1:56 that goes something like "Mercedes car can never touch my Thundersley invacar now!" and I would be lying if I said I didn't want to blast past a modern Mercedes in an invacar as that verse comes up on whatever improvised music device I happen to be using LOL

 

(iv never actually had any of the various top speed reports properly verified, so iv been just as eager as you are, to see someone take a Model 70 onto a motorway for a proper thrashing/top speed run :) )

 

I know DW has wound the 2CV up to 70 before, and the Model 70 is a good 200Kg lighter but with similar horse power figures....

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I would still love to see this hammering down the M5 or round the M42....

 

Needn’t be too scary -

 

The scariest part of a motorway in a small car isn't the speed itself, it's other motorists taking a dislike to being overtaken by a small car and treating you like a bug they want to swat as a result. You have to give everyone 4 times the space you would in a normal car, trucks "can't"/won't see you and others seem to adopt a "meh, if we crash, at least i'll be better off than you" mentality.

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Be careful. Invalid carriages were specifically banned from motorways (see the big blue sign near the slip roads, along with tractors etc). I know that it is now taxed as a tricycle, but that does not alter what it is (taxing a lorry as an agricultural vehicle does not stop it being a LGV) so I think they are still banned from motorways by law.  At the very least it could be a long, time consuming and expensive court case.

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This larger class of Invacar wasn't technically part of that ban I don't think. The earlier two stroke versions certainly, and rightly, were. That said, I do know someone who was stopped by the Police in one on a motorway. They just told him to get off at the next junction.

 

What puts me off an attempt is the fact that speed can still be a touch variable when gradients kick in. Also, it is so horrifically unstable in a crosswind that passing trucks could be a very real danger. It's just not something I'm really prepared to try.

 

She's due a service. I have the stuff. Maybe next week. Maybe today!

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All invalid carriages were banned,inc the model 70,but as its now registered as a tricycle, legally you should be fine.

 

its true that invalid carriages where banned from motorways

 

but the Model 70 is not an invalid carriage, its an invalid tricycle and those where never banned from the motorway :) any invalid vehicle between 5CWT-10CWT is considered an invalid tricycle rather then an invalid carriage

 

(in terms of legislations, and licensing , an invalid tricycle was treated the same way any 3 wheeled car would be, its also why you do see period Photos of Model 70s with L plates, because the users where required to get a proper licence, even if the test was done very basically)

 

of course the question is how many people including the constabulary actually knew this, is why you sometimes heard stories of Model 70s being told to pull off the motorway back in the day, but there are other stories of People driving happily on motorways, including one Catholic father who drove his Model 70 from Newcastle to Lourdes and back!

 

 

its also worth mentioning, that the only thing on the V5 of a Model 70, that alludes to it being any sort of invalid tricycle, is the body type, "invalid vehicle"

 

a lot of current owners have incorrectly assumed or been told you have to change this from "invalid vehicle" to "tricycle" when this is NOT the case, all you have to change, is the tax class from Disable, to either Tricycle or Historic vehicle

 

(since all Model 70s are over 40 years old, they can all get lumped under the historic vehicle tax class, but before that legislation kicked in, you just changed the Tax class to tricycle, NOT the body type)

 

a fun tidbit, is the Invacar Mk10 was the last Invalid carriage, everything after that where invalid tricycles :)

 

 

(this does mean even Egg if he really wanted to could drive his Mk12 on the motorway LOL)

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Bonus marks for filming TWCs motorway run while screaming the whole way down. 

 

:mrgreen:

 

 

happy to see more reports of smooth running (and smooth flooring!) and she now has her AC badge (time to Gate crash an AC Cobra meet!)

 

considering this is exactly the sort of thing id be using mine for, glad to see she works well for doing so  :)

 

 

I look forward to the Mad dash across town at 70Mph for her first MOT  :)

 

"Hey dude I saw an Invacar screaming its way along the motorway today!"

 

"An Invacar?!"

 

"No it was the driver!"

 

:mrgreen:

 

in regards to body work repairs, any plans to neutralise the rust on the window frames? I hear that those are the weak spot of the Model 70 and have a bad habit of rusting out, so might be worth having a look at, same goes to DW and TWC  :)

 
I dont think TWCs latest video has been linked here, so here it is :)
 
 
I wonder if we will get a video on the servicing :)
 
grease points next? :)
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Be careful. Invalid carriages were specifically banned from motorways (see the big blue sign near the slip roads, along with tractors etc). I know that it is now taxed as a tricycle, but that does not alter what it is (taxing a lorry as an agricultural vehicle does not stop it being a LGV) so I think they are still banned from motorways by law.  At the very least it could be a long, time consuming and expensive court case.

Hes quite right you know...

 

 

Motorway_Ahead_%28IRL%29.PNG

 

however....

 

 

253

Prohibited vehicles. Motorways MUST NOT be used by pedestrians, holders of provisional motorcycle or car licences, riders of motorcycles under 50 cc, cyclists, horse riders, certain slow-moving vehicles and those carrying oversized loads (except by special permission), agricultural vehicles, and powered wheelchairs/powered mobility scooters (see Rules 36 to 46 inclusive).

 

From 4 June 2018 provisional licence holders may drive on the motorway if they are accompanied by an approved driving instructor and are driving a car displaying red L plates (D plates in Wales), that’s fitted with dual controls.

 

Laws HA 1980 sects 16, 17 & sch 4, MT(E&W)R regs 3(d), 4 & 11, MT(E&W)(A)R, R(S)A sects 7, 8 & sch 3, RTRA sects 17(2) & (3), & MT(S)R reg 10

 

So maybe.....

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as I have explained this above and in my own thread,

 

things get a bit confusing 

 

because if 3 things

 

the Model 70 is not an invalid carriage

 

and the fact the government at one point had 2 vehicle classes both called "Invalid carriage"

 

both invalid carriages classes are/where banned from the motorway

 

however

 

one refers to the original style invalid carriage like the early open frame 3 wheelers

 

post-25614-0-23286700-1549501242_thumb.jpg

 

the other, is that the government officially refers to modern day "Mobility scooters" also as invalid carriages, but they have their own set of rules and classes, bellow is the rules for Old timey invalid carriages (I think modern day "invalid carriages" aka mobility scooters are limited to something like 110Kg)

 

 

 

 

  • "In this Act `invalid carriage' means a mechanically propelled vehicle the weight of which unladen does not exceed 254 kilograms and which is specifically designed and constructed, and not merely adapted, for the use of a person suffering from some physical defect or disability and is used solely by such a person".
 

 

 

and (its worth noting that the Model 70 specifically has 410Kg listed as its revenue weight on its V5, AFAIK normal cars dont have their revenue weight listed on the V5)

 

 

 

 If an invalid carriage exceeds 254 kg in unladen weight it will not be classified as an "invalid carriage" for the purposes of the RTA 1988, the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 (the "RTOA") and the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (the "RTRA") and of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 (SI 1986/1078) (the "Construction and use Regulations"). It will, instead be a motor car or, if it has less than four wheels and the weight does not exceed 410 kg, a motor cycle. 
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