Zel's Motoring Adventures...Peugeot, Renault, Rover, Trabant, Invacar & A Sinclair C5 - 19/04 - HVAC Preemptive Investigation...

[bobdisk]

Intersted to see how it goes, I am thinking along the same lines for Tiddles the Kitten and the Daf 33 (if I get the Daf going!) and if(when) I get an Invacar

[Zelandeth]

Right...Let's try this again.  I wrote 90% of this up earlier on the phone when the editor glitched and ate it.

The first thing I wanted to have a look at was the alternator on the Jag.  Before I got that far I had to pull the carpets out as the passenger side ones were soaking wet...this is different as it's usually the driver's side that turns into a sponge!

Having a look into the engine bay of the Jag to see whether the alternator is completely inaccessible.

Actually doesn't look too horrible all things considered.  Once the airbox is out of the way I think I've got a fighting chance of getting to it.  Whether I can get to all the fasteners and connections is a different matter entirely...I'll take a closer look sometime soon...but I'm more hopeful that I might have a shot at getting it changed myself than I was expecting.

Back to the Invacar.

The box of track rod ends arrived this morning.

Doing a quick visual comparison they look to be correct - the length from the end of the casting to the centre of the nut looks to be the same (they're not quite lined up in the photo).

I'll try swapping that one out first as it's by far the easiest to get to.  That's a job for another day though.  I want to finish off the list of things I've already started first.

 

Before I buttoned the service hatch back up there were a few things I wanted to get finished off.

First up was a belt swap.  Figured it was time to put theory into practice and see if the Dayco HP2020 is indeed a suitable modern drop in replacement CVT belt for an Invacar. 

Comparing it to the one I've had on there for the last 415 miles I cannot see any difference whatsoever...so I reckon it will be absolutely fine.

That belt by the way looks absolutely fine - so it seems that the current parts stash having been stored in far better conditions than my originals were has made all the difference.

No real signs of wear there at all or any issues like glazing that would suggest overheating, or the outer braiding failing - which given she has been blasting along at high speed a few times lately was something I wanted to check for.

New belt on. 

The old one will be kept in the car as a spare.  I'm going to figure out some method to tether it either in the engine bay or under the front hatch so it's out the way.  Definitely worth having it in the car though, changing the belt only takes five minutes and requires nothing but a 17mm spanner (and 8mm in my case to open the service hatch), so it's definitely within the realms of viable roadside repair if one lets go in the future.

For reference, the arrows on the belt need to face towards the nearside.  Kind of hard to get a usable photo of that I'm afraid.

I'll report back on how it performs...I'm honestly expecting the answer to be "exactly the same as the one I just took off."

On the subject of the transmission, I wanted to address some of the leaks.  While TPA's engine is more or less oil tight, the gearbox not so much.  It weeps a bit, especially after fast runs.  I'm not entirely sure how many leaks there are - but I know that one source is from the top cover, where it then runs down over the offside of the gearbox casing.  I can't tell if there's also a leak from the driveshaft seal there until I've sorted the one from the top cover.

At least that's simple enough.  I don't have any gasket paper in stock at the moment, so just made do with a bead of instant gasket (which looks like what it was sealed with originally).

While I had the cover off I checked to make sure the oil level hadn't dropped - glad to see it's still level with the fill plug.  Though it looks to have been frothed up more by my spinning of the pulleys than I'd like, and the oil definitely looks more murky than I'd like.

She'll be getting an oil change in about 150 miles anyway, so I'll make sure the gearbox and diff oils are done along with that.  The one thing which does occur to me is that when I change the gearbox oil last time it was done stone cold when the car hadn't moved in a while...so it's quite possible there was some gunk at the bottom of the box that I didn't pick up when I drained it.

I'll see about making a paper gasket then too.  This will do for now though, and hopefully the oil will now stay put.

 

While I was working on fitting the belt I noticed that the electrical isolator switch had worked loose from the bulkhead, so tightened that up.

 

Something I'd planned to do last time I had things apart there was to improve the seat mounting arrangements a bit.  To allow the standard seat to slide left to right the rear sits on a pair of rollers in a channel.  One of the downsides of this is that because the seat is only secured laterally by a single catch at the front, it means that when you corner the back of the seat is able to shift an inch or so.  This is probably more of an issue for me as the seat I've got in TPA offers several orders of magnitude more lateral support than the standard one!

Even after a year this sensation is still downright unnerving.

My solution to this is extremely simple.

Two bolts through the rear seat frame and the backing of the runner.  This securely locks it in place so should do away with that really annoying shift whenever you turn into and then the opposite way when you leave a roundabout.  It's also entirely reversible if someone wants to get rid of it in the future.  I actually started this job ages ago before realising I didn't have any suitable bolts...I had ones that were either too short or waaaaaay too big.

Last job was to put the brake lines back in their clips (I'd removed them when fitting the new flexible lines to give more freedom of movement), then I was clear to reassemble the interior.

This should have been a ten minute job...however the seat decided to be an absolute pig and put up a fight (this happens about one in four times when you have it out), so it took about half an hour to get that bolted back in.  I'm glad to report that the difference now the rear of the frame can't shift is immediately apparent the moment you sit down, never mind while driving.  It's a tiny detail in the grand scheme of things, but I think should make a big difference to the feel of things when you're driving.

This is where I had to leave things today as I ran out of time (hence there still being tools scattered everywhere).  Feels like I got a few things ticked off though.  Things like the gearbox oil leak have been on the list for a while.

I haven't bothered bleeding the brakes yet as I'll be changing the master cylinder when the new one arrives so I'd need to repeat that effort once that was plumbed in anyway.  At least that will have a standard lid so I'll be able to use the Easibleed on it which will make it far less of an annoying job.

[LightBulbFun]

59 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

Right...Let's try this again.  I wrote 90% of this up earlier on the phone when the editor glitched and ate it.

ah so THATS what I witnessed entering LEO earlier today...

 

happy to see continued TPA refinement and fettling going on, will be very interesting to see how the HP2020 belt does  

 

the bolting of the seat in place was actually something done to some Model 70's in service so you could claim it as a period modification LOL, in fact @Mrs6C's Model 70 has its seat bolted in place, as it has nowhere to slide to due to, the floor mounted handbrake on the nearside and a wooden slide-over box is on the offside (I suspect as the normal tip up slide over seat was only made for the nearside)

(I think they thought it was best to bolt it in place so it could not ever accidentally get unlatched and accidentally slid into something, you would not want to trap your fingers between it and the slide over box for example LOL)

 

[Zelandeth]

1 hour ago, LightBulbFun said:

ah so THATS what I witnessed entering LEO earlier today...

 

happy to see continued TPA refinement and fettling going on, will be very interesting to see how the HP2020 belt does  

 

the bolting of the seat in place was actually something done to some Model 70's in service so you could claim it as a period modification LOL, in fact @Mrs6C's Model 70 has its seat bolted in place, as it has nowhere to slide to due to, the floor mounted handbrake on the nearside and a wooden slide-over box is on the offside (I suspect as the normal tip up slide over seat was only made for the nearside)

(I think they thought it was best to bolt it in place so it could not ever accidentally get unlatched and accidentally slid into something, you would not want to trap your fingers between it and the slide over box for example LOL)

 

I've managed to crush my fingers between the seat base and the gear selector a couple of times when I've managed to unwittingly unlatch it while working on things in the cabin.  Now I've locked the back in place I'll probably see if there's an easy way to lock the latch release lever in place.  There is a temptation to remove it entirely if it was possible as it does jut out into the cabin and I regularly snag myself on it.  Wonder if it might be possible to bend it back on itself to tuck it away under the front of the seat better...

The seat will need to come out once more though at some point as I do want to paint the frame.  As the interior is getting tidied up bit-by-bit it's bugging me progressively more.

[Mrs6C]

6 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

There is a temptation to remove it entirely if it was possible as it does jut out into the cabin

In the interests of not damaging something that isn't easily replaceable, how about doing a long-term-but-not-necessarily-permanent swap for the seat release lever in Dolly? The handles on Dolly's seat release lever have been cut short  so you can't actually grab anything easily to effect a seat release. With the seat being at present bolted into place in its runner as @LightBulbFun says, I guess this was to stop the user from trying to move the seat. The extra seating box has been removed for the moment (it will be restored and go back in for general originality and display purposes eventually but in a more easily removeable way) so I'd like to be able to slide the seat around in its limited space rather than not.

Swapping the seat release levers, if it's possible to do so without it being a major exercise, could be a useful non-permanent modification for both vehicles.

[Zelandeth]

If memory serves the fasteners involved on TPA are sufficiently crusty that they're unlikely to be removed in any way that's not going to be at least somewhat destructive.  That's the only reason I didn't take the seat base out when I did the carpet (which would have made my life WAY easier).

I'll take a closer look next time I'm in the garage to see if the latch can be removed separately.

EDIT:

Had a look, and as far as I can see the latch assembly is essentially an integral part of the seat base.  Looks like the eyes it passes through are slipped over the actual latch/handle assembly before they are then welded onto the frame.  So removal of any of that is impossible without pretty major surgery I think.

Photo from way back in the archives from before TPA was on the road.

[Zelandeth]

Just noticed something when flipping through the photos I took when looking at the alternator on the Jag.

Is it just me, or does that output lead look like the terminal has been getting rather toasty?

If I can get to it, that's getting trimmed back and re-terminated... I'm not honestly expecting it to make the slightest difference.  However it's £1-200 cheaper than an alternator so definitely getting tried first.  The behaviour initially seemed to suggest a high impedance issue somewhere...

Could I be that lucky?

[LightBulbFun]

6 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

EDIT:

Had a look, and as far as I can see the latch assembly is essentially an integral part of the seat base.  Looks like the eyes it passes through are slipped over the actual latch/handle assembly before they are then welded onto the frame.  So removal of any of that is impossible without pretty major surgery I think.

Photo from way back in the archives from before TPA was on the road.

there must be some sort of way to get it apart relatively easily as the individual components are listed as parts in the DHSS parts manual I think?

(unless handle assembly means something else? also have to wonder what Zip fast means in this context because all im getting is fire starters! unless the DHSS was ahead of the Japanese in including destress flares LOL)

[Zelandeth]

I'll need to take a closer look next time I'm in the garage but the handle etc certainly looked like one piece and the mountings it runs through looked like they were welded in place.  Further investigation needed!

This just arrived in the post.

Let's see if I have an opportunity to get it installed this afternoon.  Currently looking like a solid maybe.

[Zelandeth]

...Just wrote out an update and then the sodding editor ate it.  Ctrl+Z does nothing as it appears that my browser hasn't interpreted it as me deleting anything.  All it does is undo typing the half a word I got down before realising what had happened.

Have had a frustrating afternoon in general and that's just the icing on the cake.  Sorry folks, you're probably going to have to wait until tomorrow for the update unless I find I can't sleep later and feel inclined to type the whole damned thing out again.

[Zelandeth]

All right... let's try this again.

It's been a bit of a frustrating afternoon.  Spent another hour and a half on the phone to Vodafone, trying to give them their stupid 4G modem thing back.  No surprises that they've charged me for it, despite assurances half a dozen times that I wouldn't have to.  Seriously, if you have a choice just don't go near them.  They'll be losing me as a customer once my current contract is up, after 25 years.

I then set about trying to revive my desiccant dehumidifier as I'd really like to properly dry out the Jag.  This thing is supremely effective.  When I put it in my original Xantia after discovering  a swimming pool under the rear seats it pulled over 20 litres out of the car within a day and a half.  Unlike refrigeration based dehumidifiers which really don't work well below about 15C, the cooler it is the better these work.  In addition to that this thing kicks out about 650W of heat as well.

It's actually quite well designed and by the standards of 21st century plastic tat it's actually pretty well put together.  Unfortunately Amcor dropped the ball by using the cheapest and nastiest motors in the world.  I've already changed the one which drives the desiccant wheel, but last time I had it running the blower motor seized up.

I did pull the motor itself to bits to see if it could be saved, but the bearings are just utterly shot.  Then started a swearing match with Google (etc) where 85% of my search string was just getting ignored.  Thankfully I was offered assistance and a replacement has now been ordered.

By the time it arrives from China summer will probably be here so it'll be a moot point!

At that point I was able to escape to the garage for an hour to start getting the brake upgrade on the Invacar installed.

There's just a *bit* of a difference in size between them!

The mounting points are identical though as we hoped, though I obviously needed to swap the pushrod over, was expecting that though.  Is a simple enough job, it's just held in place by a circlip...the removal of which was made slightly more awkward as this happened to my circlip pliers the moment I tried to use them.

Yep... it's one of *those* days.  After about 15 minutes of swearing at it I eventually managed to ping it off my forehead into the footwell.

The new cylinder has a spring clip, so was easy enough to remove with a normal pair of pliers.

My *plan* had been to transfer this clip over as it would be far easier to manhandle into the groove...however I then discovered that the spring clip was too small to hold the washers of the old cylinder in...so I ended up having to wrangle the original flat circlip in.

Got there in the end.  One assembled cylinder ready to go on the car.

Having learned my lesson before, I made sure that the "fork" of the pushrod was around the handlebar home rather than off to one side.  It's a real faff to get this into place if the cylinder is already bolted in place if the pushrod isn't centralised properly.

Getting the roll pin back in is a pig of a job just because it's fiddly.  That's on the docket for tomorrow hopefully.

The cylinder is actually in place now though. 

I can't actually finish the installation yet because I completely failed to realise I needed to buy one additional part in.  The current setup has the line from the master cylinder coming straight into a 4-way splitter block.  From there it splits the hydraulic line to the front and rear of the car, with the brake light switch screwed into the fourth port.  Of course there will be one less line there because there's a separate port on the master cylinder for each circuit. 

I should have realised that before I even ordered the cylinder...bit annoying as I'll need to wait for that to arrive.  Sadly I'm pretty sure I don't have one in stock given the lengths I went to to save the rear axle T on TPA.  I'd not have spent hours salvaging that if I had a spare!  Annoying.

The reservoir is meant to be at a slightly steeper angle than it is on this car but that won't be a problem at all in use as the cap is at the highest point and it's only a very slight tilt.

In the meantime I will get the rest of the plumbing done and will take the opportunity to pull the mud guard out and attack it with a large hammer to beat it back into something resembling the right shape.  I suspect I may need to attack the bolts with the grinder as they're pretty crusty.  While in the area I'll get the foam finally installed under the fuel tank upper strap and get rid of the folded up Amazon box which has been in there for a year.

I've got a couple of cans of truck bed liner spray on order as well.  I'm going to paint the bulkhead with that on the outside to see if that helps reduce the drumming of that panel a bit.  If it works I'll probably go round the inside of the other hollow body sections too.

Just more little bits and pieces it'll be nice to get ticked off the to do list.  She's worth it, and they're all things which will add up in future when the car's in regular use.

Speaking of minor things I need to sort up front...can someone provide a photo of how the bonnet stay is actually meant to be set up?  I'm sure I can fabricate something without needing to raid the spares stash there, just need to know how it's meant to be set up to start with.  Propping the thing open with your shoulder while refuelling is really awkward!

No huge progress today then, but at least I did get a couple of steps done!

Assuming the new one works fine I'll make sure the cylinder I've taken off is carefully bagged up so it can be dropped off and added to the spares stash next time I'm over that way (and allowed to) as there's absolutely nothing wrong with it so would be a perfect candidate for one of the pair over there needing their braking systems rejuvenated as it's a known good part.

[LightBulbFun]

7 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

...Just wrote out an update and then the sodding editor ate it.  Ctrl+Z does nothing as it appears that my browser hasn't interpreted it as me deleting anything.  All it does is undo typing the half a word I got down before realising what had happened.

Have had a frustrating afternoon in general and that's just the icing on the cake.  Sorry folks, you're probably going to have to wait until tomorrow for the update unless I find I can't sleep later and feel inclined to type the whole damned thing out again.

really wish the admin(s?) would do something about it, as you say its very frustrating! (to the point where I have gotten into the habit of just doing a Ctrl A Ctrl C regularly during long write ups so if it all goes tits up i can refresh the page, clear the editor and Ctrl V it all back in)

 

 

3 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

Speaking of minor things I need to sort up front...can someone provide a photo of how the bonnet stay is actually meant to be set up?  I'm sure I can fabricate something without needing to raid the spares stash there, just need to know how it's meant to be set up to start with.  Propping the thing open with your shoulder while refuelling is really awkward!

here you go  

the rod then goes up and locates into a right angle bracket with a hole in it in thats attached to the front bonnet itself  (I know I have better photos but ill have to check for those when im on the main desktop)

we think it might of originally rested in front latch, but it obviously cannot do so with the later larger plastic brake fluid container so the one in REV has for the past 20+ years, merrily been wearing a divot/hole for itself in the fibreglass lip that it rests in when its put off to one side to clear the brake fluid container 

 

 

one thing to note is that the front bonnet stay and its associated gubbins are only mentioned in reference to Model 70 Mark B's so I dont think the Model 70 Mark A ever had a front bonnet stay to start with hence the lack of one on TPA (I dont see the hole for it in TPA's chassis which backs that up)

 

[Zelandeth]

7 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

really wish the admin(s?) would do something about it, as you say its very frustrating! (to the point where I have gotten into the habit of just doing a Ctrl A Ctrl C regularly during long write ups so if it all goes tits up i can refresh the page, clear the editor and Ctrl V it all back in)

 

 

here you go  

 

the rod then goes up and locates into a right angle bracket with a hole in it in thats attached to the front bonnet itself  (I know I have better photos but ill have to check for those when im on the main desktop)

we think it might of originally rested in front latch, but it obviously cannot do so with the later larger plastic brake fluid container so the one in REV has for the past 20+ years, merrily been wearing a divot/hole for itself in the fibreglass lip that it rests in when its put off to one side to clear the brake fluid container 

 

 

one thing to note is that the front bonnet stay and its associated gubbins are only mentioned in reference to Model 70 Mark B's so I dont think the Model 70 Mark A ever had a front bonnet stay to start with hence the lack of one on TPA (I dont see the hole for it in TPA's chassis which backs that up)

 

I honestly doubt it's something that the admin team can do anything about.  More likely it's an underlying issue with the Invision text editor, so other than complaining to them there isn't likely to be much they can do.  Especially given that the problem is so intermittent and utterly random as to when it decides to pop up. 

It would be infinitely less annoying if the aforementioned bloody editor didn't handle embedding of images completely differently to EVERY other forum I use - so I can't even just use ImgBB, prepare the post in a text editor and just drop the whole lot in - as I then have to spend half an hour wrangling the images into working - which on a mobile device in this editor is enough of a headache at the best of times. 

I really can't understand what Invision were thinking when they chose to depreciate the use of BBCode.  For someone who uses multiple platforms it is a massive pain.  One of the other forums uses Invision as well, but mercifully they're still several versions behind so for the moment I can still copy/paste things in there.  Given it's very quiet these days and I very rarely see any engagement, if/when they upgrade the software on the server so I can't easily do that will probably be the day I stop posting there.  To be honest the fact that here is where I see an order of magnitude more engagement with my blog is really the only reason that I've gritted my teeth and put up with the software.  Biting off my nose to spite my face isn't going to change the minds of the creators of the Invision software.

-- -- --

Regarding the bonnet stay - I should have been clearer.  It's a detail of how it props the cover up that I'm after.  The base of the stay in my case is located in the hole at the top of the brake master cylinder bracket, basically because I couldn't see anywhere else for it to live.

I figured there must be a bracket of some description attached to one of the bonnet hinges given there's no other hardware attached to it!

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, Zelandeth said:

 

Regarding the bonnet stay - I should have been clearer.  It's a detail of how it props the cover up that I'm after.  The base of the stay in my case is located in the hole at the top of the brake master cylinder bracket, basically because I couldn't see anywhere else for it to live.

I figured there must be a bracket of some description attached to one of the bonnet hinges given there's no other hardware attached to it!

ah whoops here you go

looks like it does attach via the bonnet hinge as you say

 

and here is how it rests in most cars due to the plastic brake reservoir but we think it may have gone straight ahead originally

[Zelandeth]

Excellent, should be pretty easy to fabricate something along those lines.

[Zelandeth]

Very little time today for the cars thanks to getting a call from a friend right as I was about to step into the garage saying they'd lost all power to their garage (which contains their washer and drier) but the breaker hadn't tripped.  We are their support bubble so at least I can go there without fear of repercussions.

Didn't take long to track down the issue.  After exiting the fuse box, the feed to the garage enters a junction box where one line disappears to serve a single socket in their hallway, then via a fused switch to the garage.  This is what was left of the fuse holder in said switch.

Six years of running at close to the rated load when both the washer and drier are on has resulted in it overheating.  They are planning on having the whole house refurbished this year, which will include the wiring being completely gutted and replaced properly as this was just the latest in a line of *many* electrical issues or oddities they're dealing with.  Couldn't find anything else amiss so reckon as the fuse or holder has aged there has just been a poor connection resulting in a hot spot which eventually resulted in it self destructing.  Switch replaced like-for-like (albeit with a decent one rather than that which didn't have a maker's mark...or any markings for that matter anywhere) and they have been advised to avoid running both appliances together if possible.  The advise has also been left that they really need to get the cable replaced with one of a known quantity and that switch to be deleted.

 

This only left me with half an hour really once I got home to spend in the garage.  Task I figured I could get done in that time was to get the front mudguard off TPA.

As expected all three fixings were utterly knackered.  The front two are through the nose of the car so some care needs to be used with power tools...

There was no way these were coming off, both the heads and the nuts were mangled.  The angle grinder really isn't suitable for this job... it's just too much of a blunt instrument.

Step forward the multi-tool.  This is a scalpel compared to the angle grinder.

This allowed me to buzz the heads off both bolts without any trauma to the surrounding bodywork.

The bolt under the brake master cylinder bracket was a bit more of a pain but we got there in the end.  I did actually end up tearing a bit of metal out from around the bolt, but it'll be a simple repair.

This thing needs some help...

It *should* be a straight U shaped channel!

I reckon a bit of attention with a large hammer and a big block of wood as a former should get it back into a shape more reminiscent of what it should be.  Doesn't need to be perfect.

Looks like the bed liner I've got will cover well, consistency seems very similar to the original coating on some areas of the chassis.

Will pull the cylinder out again so I can get the bracket without having to faff around masking stuff off.  The wiring has already been painted once so I'm not losing sleep over that!

[Zelandeth]

Can't remember if I mentioned this yesterday now...

I actually used the 3D printer for something useful!

I lose this meter far, far too often because it's one of those awkward not quite square shapes.  It had no actual permanent home so I could never remember where I'd left it.

Problem solved.

Can't quite believe that meter is still with me...I bought that before I started university back in 2002, and has been subject to all manner of abuse - including me accidentally connecting it across the mains in current mode because I was an idiot, being rained on and getting drowned in coolant at least once.  Yet it still works perfectly.  Only gripe with it is the lack of a display backlight.  I'd really like something like a BM235 or an older Fluke...just hard to justify the cost when this still works perfectly!  Shame Uni-T seem to have gone downhill since.  Their meters were never the flashiest, but they were pretty robust and got the job done.  Orders of magnitude better than most of the nameless tat on eBay/Amazon.

I've already got ideas in mind for some of the smaller awkwardly shaped tools in the garage getting 3D printed wall mounts made.

[LightBulbFun]

very nice! the texture made me think it was made out of wood at first glance!

35 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

including me accidentally connecting it across the mains in current mode because I was an idiot,

ah yes I have done that too, except said DMM was some cheap ebay thing, and said current mode I accidentally had it in was the mA range with a *glass* fuse, so of course it promptly and literally exploded blowing the case apart, I think the transformer who's mains input I was probing still bares skid marks from that  

 

speaking of things exploding (maybe?) I finally recently got all the engine numbers of all the Model 70 engines floating around on this forum

and its very interesting to note that the engine that was pulled from TPA, was NOT TPA's original engine and in fact number wise said engine is only a few numbers ahead from Dolly's engine! go figure! which explains the spin on oil filter

I really do wonder just what happened to TPA's original engine then given how few miles the odometer reports, or what harsh conditions TPA's engine was subjected to necessitate such an early engine change

and I have to wonder if the same harsh conditions that wore out or blew up the original  engine, is also why the replacement engine pulled out of TPA is seemingly down on power so much?

[Zelandeth]

In my case it was a laptop with a no power issue we were looking for.  I was going to check there was power at the kettle lead, having forgotten the lead was still in the 20A socket.

Cue loud bang, bright purple plasma flash...and the house plunging into darkness.

Oops.

The HRC fuse in the meter survived.  The 5A fuse in the plug survived.  The *flex itself* did not!  Both live and neutral conductors went open!  The meter probes are somewhat scarred though.

Regarding engine numbers, I wonder if TPA spent a lot of time in reserve or something, and the engine got pulled for another vehicle or something like that?  Or there could have been a dozen reasons they'd just swap the power unit rather than repair it in situ.  We'll never know sadly unless someone randomly stumbles across a service centre works order logbook or something!

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, Zelandeth said:

In my case it was a laptop with a no power issue we were looking for.  I was going to check there was power at the kettle lead, having forgotten the lead was still in the 20A socket.

Cue loud bang, bright purple plasma flash...and the house plunging into darkness.

Oops.

The HRC fuse in the meter survived.  The 5A fuse in the plug survived.  The *flex itself* did not!  Both live and neutral conductors went open!  The meter probes are somewhat scarred though.

 

makes you wonder just how flimsy the flex was and probably a good thing you blew it up with a dead short so it could not catch fire later under lesser fault conditions!

1 hour ago, Zelandeth said:

Regarding engine numbers, I wonder if TPA spent a lot of time in reserve or something, and the engine got pulled for another vehicle or something like that?  Or there could have been a dozen reasons they'd just swap the power unit rather than repair it in situ.  We'll never know sadly unless someone randomly stumbles across a service centre works order logbook or something!

yeah its an interesting one, I suspect if she was a reserve vehicle they pillaged for an engine they would not have bothered putting another one back in it especially as TPA is a standard handle bar control machine and I imagine they would have had plenty of those lying around (and yes LOL, I did check the engine number of REV453R and the other known/suspected DHSS reserve Model 70 and no none of the  engine numbers match sadly)

for those curious I think at peak the DHSS held 2000 cars (of all types in service at the time) in reserve, and even in the mid 1990's still held a reserve of 1950's Stanley Argsons!

but as you say Approved repairs would generally just swap engines whole rather then bother trying to fix said engine problem, so maybe it could have been something as simple as damaged spark plug threads or something such that wrote TPA's original engine off

but I know that the approved repairer that TPA was from was pretty liberal with the VIN/Reg plate swapping, so I would have thought if TPA ran into serious issues to save the effort of an engine change they would have just slapped TPA's ID onto another car, but I checked TPA's other ID's and they all match up, So im pretty confidant TPA really is TPA  and so someone obviously did go through the effort of doing an engine change at some point!

(of course we dont know when this engine change happened so it may have happened when she was under the care of another Approved repairer) 

but you can see why I find this most interesting  even tho as you say we probably wont find out for sure unless we find the old maintenance dockets for TPA or such

its a shame GDPR killed the whole previous keeper details thing, as that would tell me a lot about TPA's history, from what info I can dig up she had 4 keepers before you with the keeper before you "acquiring" her on the 23rd of July 1996 (I sadly do not have dates for keepers 2 and 3)

 

[Zelandeth]

Finally got hold of the last couple of bits I'd been waiting on to allow me to proceed with the brake system upgrade on the Invacar.

Metric unions are needed because the master cylinder is metric, and the T is a replacement so I can replace the 4-way one the brake light switch is currently fitted to.

The switch was removed from the car and stored safely in the bag with the union it will be living in from now on while I removed the old T piece.

That's now been loosely refitted to the stud the T-piece lives on.

This has then allowed me to have a think about how I'll be routing the lines, shouldn't require too much plumbing.  The line to the rear will be getting extended the couple of inches needed to reach the cylinder.  I did think about remaking the whole line to avoid the need for a join...but the run is a single piece all the way to the T at the rear axle and routing it would require me to remove the fuel tank.  It's getting extended!

Shouldn't take long to get things in here hooked up.

Just ran out of time today. 

The mud guard will need a bit of careful attention, but even a couple of minutes has got it looking far closer to the correct shape again.

 

That was mostly achieved simply by standing on it!  Shouldn't be too hard to save it.

I do alternatively have a couple of sheets of metal here I could probably fabricate a replacement out of if it came to that.

[Zelandeth]

Now we're getting somewhere.

Front circuit is bled through, rear will have to wait till tomorrow.  Everything seems fluid tight though.

Have encountered one slight snag though.  I may need to source a longer pushrod for the master cylinder.

The handlebars are resting essentially depressed by a couple of inches.  There is a bit of adjustment in the pushrod, but I doubt enough to fix this.  We'll see tomorrow once I've got everything bled, nipped up all the joints a bit more and see how much I can extend it by.

Should have spotted that when I had the two cylinders next to each other.  The Invacar one has the base of the cylinder recessed further beyond the mounting bracket than the Spitfire one...so the rest position of the piston is about 3/4" further forward.

Hopefully that's not too much of a headache to figure out.

Edit: Thought occurs to me that I may be able to get myself a bit of extra room to play with by drilling an additional hole in the yoke - there are already three or four (I assume for different setups) so one more won't make any difference... between that and the adjustment on the pushrod I *might* be able to make this work.

[bobdisk]

Hope the pipe to the front brake from the light switch union is not too tight a bend, mine was (pic on RR) and it leaked slightly and had to have it replaced with a longer pipe with a larger radius bend. With yours, I would have taken the pipe behind the speedo cable to make a larger bend.  (Actually, it turned out the through bolt was the wrong size as well, previous owner again!)

[LightBulbFun]

9 hours ago, bobdisk said:

Hope the pipe to the front brake from the light switch union is not too tight a bend, mine was (pic on RR) and it leaked slightly and had to have it replaced with a longer pipe with a larger radius bend. With yours, I would have taken the pipe behind the speedo cable to make a larger bend.  (Actually, it turned out the through bolt was the wrong size as well, previous owner again!)

I wonder if Zel has it curved/S bent like that on purpose to take up thermal expansion and contraction?

 

 

[Zelandeth]

Thinking about it, I'd rather shorten that front line anyway.  That way I could clip it to the support and reduce the odds of it vibrating.

Few steps forward today.

Had a closer look to see how far out we were on the pushrod clearance issue.  Not very much is the answer.  This also really highlights the mechanical advantage in the handlebar setup.  This equates to a little over 3" of travel at the bars.

With the adjuster backed as far off as I can without worrying about the nut backing off and coming loose (which would be bad), I was able to reduce the offset to this.  The thing I've circled is the little rubber stop the handlebars usually rest on.

For reference, here's the same clearance at the same spot yesterday.

The loss of that bit of travel probably isn't the end of the world (keep in mind this cylinder has a slightly larger bore, so will require slightly less travel but be heavier to operate).  That's plan C at this point.  I don't like the fact that the return spring tension on the 'bars is resting on the pushrod, as that means any failure of the adjuster locknut or the pushrod retaining circlip on the master cylinder will result in the pushrod ejecting itself from the braking mechanism.  This Would Be Bad.

Plan A is to pull the yoke out and drill a new pivot hole slightly above and forward of the existing one.  Couple of reasons I prefer this. 

[] Firstly is that it removes the aforementioned situation where it's not entirely beyond the realms of possibility that the master cylinder could spontaneously disassemble itself at 70mph on the sliproad coming off the A5.  The resting position of the handlebars will keep everything under (light) compression.  If the adjuster backs itself off you'll notice the brakes feeling sloppy and hear it rattling long before anything comes apart.

[] Secondly, shifting the pivot point slightly higher thanks to the geometry of the linkage will increase the mechanical advantage provided, so make the brakes lighter - providing an offset for the slightly larger bore cylinder.  I'll be taking some careful measurements beforehand to make sure I've still got enough clearance to get a full usable stroke and that the pushrod isn't going to get pushed at too much of an angle.  Stroke measurement is something I need to be particularly careful of too given that my knees are closer to the bars than in a standard car due to the upgraded seat.  No, there's no way in hell I'm changing that back...I like being comfy!

I'm going to do some testing with the setup as it is now though.  Given that this is all very experimental it's entirely possible that I'll find that this cylinder just doesn't work...I wind up with impossibly grabby brakes, or it's like trying to brake a 1920s bus with cable brakes because they're so heavy.  Might need to mess around with an adjustable bias valve to prevent the front wheel locking up...I just don't know at this point.  I'd rather know the system is fundamentally sound before I go modifying things permanently.  Plus I know that getting the handlebars out is going to be an absolute pig of a job.

I did look at removing the handlebars quite early in the restoration as it would have made cleaning them up and painting them massively easier.  However they're (as you'd expect) very solidly mounted by a load of fasteners.  All of which are to put it politely, disinclined to acquiesce to my request that they move.  At least I am armed with a decent selection of Imperial tools now at least so I'm more likely to get there in the end.  Plus one of the worst fasteners is on the ball joint, and that's about to be replaced anyway. 

I'm half tempted to get the whole thing powder coated while it's off the car.  It's such a visually striking bit of the interior that it would really help tidy it up I think.  Not sure...either way it'll definitely get some better paint while off the car.  Would be sticking with black, pretty sure that's what it was originally painted.

Got most of the system bled through this evening before running into a snag.  The offside rear bleed nipple is thoroughly seized.  I cheated when originally setting this up by filling the cylinder by hand, fitting it and then bleeding from the pipe union.  However that union is also a little chewed up (the run between that cylinder and the axle flexible line is one that came on the car as it's spotless cupronickel), and rounded off the moment I touched it today.  If I apply any more force to the bleep nipple it's going to either snap off or strip.  I very much doubt it will crack off.

Fair enough.  I'd pondered replacing the wheel cylinders since day one.  I was frankly astonished they were serviceable given the age and conditions they'd been stored in.  They're not expensive, so I think it's time to change them.  The nearside one needs to be removed from the hub at some point to replace the rubber boot around the handbrake linkage as it's perished and torn anyway.  So time to get three new cylinders in and just change them I think.  That way the only ancient bits of the brakes left will be the drums, a few springs and the shoes.  All good things from the perspective of long term reliability.  I'd like to take the opportunity to dismantle, clean and grease the adjusters too.  I didn't really know how they worked when I first got the car back on the road, but now I have that knowledge I'd like to do some preventative maintenance there.  If I've got braking work to be done, may as well do the lot.

When I was first reviving the car I didn't really know whether it would be sticking around long term and whether it would be an occasional weekend toy to take to shows or actually see regular use.  So there were a few instances of reusing older parts and semi-temporary bodges that I knew I'd likely end up revisiting at some point.  As I've found I actually really enjoy driving the car now it's obvious to me now that it's well worth sorting those things out now once and for all.

On that list is also sorting out the metalwork in the engine bay.  While the actually important bits of tin that route the cooling air are okay, the splash guard is in a right state.  Not likely to find that sitting around anywhere so I'll probably need to make something up myself.  That's one I've been putting off though as it's probably going to be an engine-out job because of how the shields are fitted.  On the plus side, at least they're not critical to engine cooling like in a VW.  The "snorkel" on the engine cover itself serves that purpose instead, ensuring that cooling air is drawn from outside to minimise the recirculation of warm air.  I do still plan to fit a temperature gauge though...not having one just bothers me!  Thanks to whoever suggested one of the types popular among the air cooled VW crowd that just clamps to a head under the spark plug, that's a way more elegant solution than a wet oil temperature sender that I was originally planning to use.

That's a way down the list yet though!

Even with there still being a bit of air in the brakes though I do have something of a pedal, albeit a very spongey one.  Just pushing the car back and forth in the garage it feels like they're working properly and we've got braking from both ends.  Doesn't mean much, but from a purely psychological standpoint it was nice to see!

On the subject of spares - the two good wheel cylinders which come off I will clean and bag up with a view to making them available to the communal Invacar spares stash.  Reckon with it on the bench where you could safely get some heat on it the seized bleed nipple on the one may well be sortable...just not on the car.  I've had no indications of issues with them in use, but just can't be bothered messing around with things like that when new ones are cheaply and readily available.  I know some folks prefer originality though, and/or enjoy the satisfaction of getting things like that overhauled and back in use.  So they'll definitely not be binned.

Just remembered something else too.  On another forum someone had mentioned that it looked like there was a worrying lack of clearance between the front wheel and the brake master cylinder.  They're right, in a lot of photos it does look quite close.  That's more down to a bit of an optical illusion though just how things line up.  Trying to get a photo from a lower angle (tricky with the body in the way!) shows there's a decent gap.

Really shouldn't be any worries of these making contact.  Especially given how little weight there is on the front, even under heavy braking the nose doesn't dive much.  Glad they asked the question though as it's the sort of thing which could well have been an issue with the new cylinder being so much longer.

[egg]

19 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

On another forum someone had mentioned that it looked like there was a worrying lack of clearance between the front wheel and the brake master cylinder.  They're right, in a lot of photos it does look quite close. 

Glad someone else thought this, was going to say, and then felt it might be a stupid question.

Enjoying the ongoing re-engineering project that's going on here.

[Zelandeth]

3 minutes ago, egg said:

Glad someone else thought this, was going to say, and then felt it might be a stupid question.

Enjoying the ongoing re-engineering project that's going on here.

My opinion is that there's no such thing as a stupid question.  Especially where the answer may affect something that's safety critical.

There are a LOT of questions which I've asked during my first year of ownership that I'm sure a lot of people on the marque specific forums for the Jag would have said were stupid based on the experiences of my old flatmate with his XJ6s.  That's one of the reasons I prefer this place...folks will generally give you a reasonable answer - even if the answer needs to be nothing more than a photograph from a different angle.  Being condescending never helped anyone...one of the reasons my time on a couple of VW forums when I had my T25 was very brief! 

[LightBulbFun]

5 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

Thanks to whoever suggested one of the types popular among the air cooled VW crowd that just clamps to a head under the spark plug, that's a way more elegant solution than a wet oil temperature sender that I was originally planning to use.

that would be @PhilA  

On 05/05/2020 at 13:08, PhilA said:

http://thesensorconnection.com/cht-sensors/cht-sensors/cht-cylinder-head-temperature-12-and-14-mm?keyword=&gclid=Cj0KCQjwncT1BRDhARIsAOQF9LltUUBEbnCshWU-aR8laPXeWFHLYheim7mjscc2rh8WsKPBYyRrenEaAlJYEALw_wcB

Ring around the spark plug type. Other variants are available.

 

 

very happy to see the brake system/master cylinder upgrade going relatively smoothly I look forward to seeing how it does on the road etc

[bobdisk]

8 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

12 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

Thanks to whoever suggested one of the types popular among the air cooled VW crowd that just clamps to a head under the spark plug, that's a way more elegant solution than a wet oil temperature sender that I was originally planning to use.

that would be @PhilA  

On 5/5/2020 at 1:08 PM, PhilA said:

http://thesensorconnection.com/cht-sensors/cht-sensors/cht-cylinder-head-temperature-12-and-14-mm?keyword=&gclid=Cj0KCQjwncT1BRDhARIsAOQF9LltUUBEbnCshWU-aR8laPXeWFHLYheim7mjscc2rh8WsKPBYyRrenEaAlJYEALw_wcB

Ring around the spark plug type. Other variants are available.

 

 

very happy to see the brake system/master cylinder upgrade going relatively smoothly I look forward to seeing how it does on the road etc

This temp gauge would also work on the Daf. I think the brake upgrade would also work.

[Zelandeth]

4 hours ago, bobdisk said:

This temp gauge would also work on the Daf. I think the brake upgrade would also work.

Now I'm just trying to find a complete gauge and sender kit...without spending £80 from an air cooled VW "specialist" or paying the ridiculous rates for shipping from the US.  Thinking this might be a job for when I've got an actual PC in front of me.