Rave's Motors - 12/4/19 ST170 Step 1: MOT Step 2: Profit

[pauldoubleyou]

Jesus.

 

Right, the thing about brakes mate is that theyre there to stop you from getting dead. Especially in a french breadbin. You could PTFE that nipple in but lets be honest, that caliper is going in the bin. If its not im glad im not in the car with you.

 

Welding a nut on would have removed it very easily. I would suggest a proper redrill at oversize and another larger bleed nipple if youre still dying not to exchange a £20 caliper. Sometimes, you just have to admit defeat. Surely £20 is worth that two hours of swearing you just did?

 

It took me a very long time to learn that above lesson.

[Captain Furious]

Gotta sort of agree, I admire your tenacity and autoshite fixit philosophy, but I’d never be able to trust that bleed screw again. Some things are worth repairing yourself, callipers are just ungrateful bastards you need to ditch and exchange at the first sign of trouble. If anything this thread has reinforced my belief in that.

 

Nice write ups though.

[pauldoubleyou]

..and ill bodge everything as much as the next guy. I just had to get a caliper for the mk6 fiesta and the shitty rusty ones on ebay were £13 delivered.

 

I opted for one that looked quite new and even that was £22.

[Rave]

Well, the bleed screw is either going to leak or it ain't, and a few emergency stops on the quiet road outside my house ought to settle the matter. The rest of the caliper should be a hell of a lot better than it was before, and it didn't have any trouble stopping 750KG of French tin can when it was seized up. If it shows any sign of leaking I'll bin the caliper and put it down to experience. Remember that the seal is made between the bottom of the bleed nipple and the hole in the caliper, not by the threads. The nipple is in tight, it's not going to pop out.

 

Edit: just done some calculations to satisfy myself that I'm not just talking myself into a false sense of security. I reckon the bottom of the bleed nipple is 5mm diameter (if that) so an area of 19.6 square millimetres. There are 645 sqmm in a square inch. Max pressure in the system is 2000psi. So the force pushing the nipple out will be a max of 62lb.

 

Actually that's more than I expected, I'll see if I can rig my luggage scale up to it and have a good yank on it to be sure.

 

Edit 2: I should make clear as well that the PTFE tape is there to make bleeding it easier, not to do anything while the nipple is done up. I would be a bugger of a job to bleed if fluid was pissing out of the thread, I reckon.

[spike60]

I would now agree with the "shouda skipped it" calls but in a past life I successfully bodged  modified a Volvo 164 caliper. I went through the snapped bleed nipple/badly drill out rigmarole then ended up drilling and tapping the threads oversize, dropping a ball bearing onto the taper seat and fitting a plain bolt where the nipple used to be. It lasted several years, as long as rest of the car anyway. 

Unless you can smother the exposed part of the piston in Copaslip or similar be very careful with emery paper or similar, the scratches provide an excellent key for the rust to start.

When getting a piston back in the first place caliper wind back tools are unbeatable as the even the piston in the bore, often they won't return because they're kicked over and prising on one side with your biggest screwdriver makes it worse.

[Talbot]

I have to echo the sentiments above.  That caliper is scrap.. not so much because of the piston; you appear to have done a fairly good job there, and as long as there is sufficient lubrication between the piston and the bore in the caliper it will last a goodly while before corrosion sets in, but because of the bleed screw.

 

There is clearly a chunk of the casting missing, which means you may have threads missing.  Where you have diamond ground the reminants of the easyout away, you'll have buggered the threads holding the bleed screw in, and may have mashed the sealing surface in the caliper where the bleed-screw seals.  Not good.

 

The reason the screw extractors didn't work is because as you wind them in, they stretch the bolt that you are trying to remove and increase it's diameter, which makes it bind even harder.  You could try the "weld something to it" trick, but it doesn't often work.  Once a bleed screw shears off in a caliper, scrap it.

 

If you do plan to try and use this, get the PTFE off those threads.  You need friction to keep the bleed screw done up.. adding PTFE is not a great plan.  yes, there is generally a bit of leakage of fluid past the threads, but that's just how it is.

 

If, when you nip the bleed screw up (and I do mean nip... finger tight plus about 5° of turn with a spanner) it still leaks, then throw it in the bin.  If you have to tighten the bleed screw up tight to stop it leaking, the sealing surfaces are toast, and it's fit for scrap only.

 

For future reference, to get a really stubborn bleed screw out of a caliper, strip the caliper down to bare metal (piston, rubbers, sliders etc out) and then use some fairly significant heat on the area around the bleed screw.  Then, as it cools, use a tiny bit of compressed air on the bleed nipple itself and a nice cold spanner.  This will cause the nipple to cool faster than the caliper body, and hence shrink slightly in relation to the caliper, and it may then wind out.  But it's a lot of faffing about for a £20 caliper.

[Rave]

The piston and seal are brand new lads.

 

Anyway just going to finish my coffee then will go out and attempt to bleed it. Then I'll get someone to stand on the brake pedal while I check for leaks, then if it passes that test I will do some emergency stops. I do fully understand that there is no safe level of leakage on a brake system and I'm not silly enough to risk driving it about if there is. Quite apart from my own safety and that of my passengers, I've got 13 years of NCB to look after!

[Talbot]

Make sure you stand on the brake pedal so hard it feels like you're going to bend it.  Then stand on it even harder.  Your foot should hurt afterwards.

 

Assuming the bleed nipple doesn't strip it's threads and come out like a bullet, you may be OK.

[Rave]

OK well having never bled a brake system before that was quite interesting. First annoyance was finding that I've left my gauge and foot pump somewhere, probably round my inlaws, so was unable to get the recommended 20psi for the eezibleed. The tyre I attached it to tends to lose about 10psi a month and it's been stood for about 6 weeks, so I figured it would be right. The Eezibleed shot the hose to the reservoir full of fluid as soon as it was connected. Anyway, connected the pipe to the bleed nipple and undid it, and fluid started coming out straight away, fairly slowly. I was expecting bubbles the size of the one in a spirit level or similar but no, just a few little tiny ones. I ran the eezibleed bottle down to near its minimum to be sure. Then I got the wife to stand on the brakes, and put a bit more though.

 

Finally I started the engine and stood on the pedal myself. I'm not going to stand on it as hard as I can, because without wanting to sound like too much of a prick, I really do have strong legs being a former powerlifter and current very keen cyclist. I did press it harder than I ever have in an emergency braking situation. Pedal went nowhere near the floor and there were no leaks from the nipple. The pedal does seem to feel a bit soft, but I really can't remember what it was like before.

 

I'll stroll round to the inlaws and see if my pump and gauge are there (will be a bit annoying if they're not) then I'll take it for a slow and careful drive round the block once I've pumped the tyres up. I also plan to put a strip of paint or tippex on the nipple so I can visually check it every so often for coming loose.

[Rave]

OK well, I'm calling it. The roads here are a bit damp (not wet) and the refreshed caliper with its new discs and pads was good enough to lock the wheel leaving a substantial skidmark. I'll have to do the other side next week!

 

Edit: during the test drive a pogged F-Reg Renault 5 with one differently coloured door came out of a turning in front of me and trundled off up the road. I'm calling that a sign from the shite gods .

[Rave]

Got home safely from an 83 mile round trip to Stansted airport .

[Rave]

The 106 still stops, my mum is out driving it this afternoon so hopefully she won't return with the front stoved in.

 

Meanwhile I said I'd have a look at my father in law's old Megane that I failed to sell on here for £300 last year. A friend of ours passed her test around the same time and decided that she fancied it as her first car. Anyway she's been bombing around in it for the last 5 months or so, and by the looks of things, giving it a bit of a hard time.

 

 

Apparently, the car has started pulling to the left. She took it to the garage next to her house who apparently told her that the CV boot has failed, and that she's bent part of the suspension. They quoted her something like 500 quid to sort it, so I said I'd have a look. Anyway, I jacked it up and had a look. Offside first:

 

 

Hmm. This boot was replaced for the last MOT at the end of September, should it be that loose on the inside edge? There's lots of grease on the inside of the wheel but that could have been there for months. I could replace the spring clip with a jubilee clip easily enough, I suppose, and maybe squirt a load of new grease into the boot while I'm at it. There didn't seem to be anything wrong with the wishbone.

 

So wheel back on, turned the car around so I could work on it from the curb, confirming that it does indeed pull to the left.

 

 

Oh, so that's what they meant.

 

The problem is that the wishbone on that side looks fine too. I reckon that replacing a wishbone with the car on axle stands at the side of the road looks doable, especially the NS one, and I could have a go with a stretchy boot kit on the CV joint while I'm at it. But if it's not bent, that's not going to help. How does one go about trying to diagnose bent suspension bits? Looking at the car, the NS wheel does seem to have a bit more positive camber, but I could well be just imagining it.

 

I reckon that the garage that I usually go to would do a wishbone and a driveshaft for more like £200 if I took it up to them, which is debatably worth it as the car has MOT till the end of September. If I could do it myself at a cost of £40 for a wishbone and stretchy boot kit, then that would definitely be a result. Equally it would probably weigh in for £100 and there seems to be no shortage of cars on here and elsewhere for £300-350, and if I got her something smaller than a 1.6 she'd save on tax and possibly insurance as well. I don't know if my FIL even charged her anything for the car but even if he charged her £300 she's had 5 months use out of it and would get £100-ish back from the scrappy. What do you all reckon?

[The Moog]

Quite honestly I wouldn't offer your services. That often ends up in tears one way or another

 

Best bet is to say yes agree with garage and give the option of getting friendly garage to do it or buy something else.

 

Sometimes though better the devil you know - if I was recommending it I would get it changed.

 

Buying unknown car can soon eat any savings with tax, fuel or insurance.

[Rave]

Cheers. She's a pretty good friend and she admits to abusing the car, so we're unlikely to fall out over it. The problem is trying to figure out why the steering's gone skew-whiff, I can foresee a frustrating wild goose chase replacing bits of suspension until we find the one that's bent. Maybe I should take it to a place with a laser alignment system and see what they say about it?

[Split_Pin]

The CV boot on my Megane split last year so I got a second hand shaft (cv joint is not separate) for £30 and had my local shop fit it, £100 all in. I woukd suggest that the tracking might just have been knocked out. If the garage have a tracking device, that would be the best way of confirming accurately what it or isnt bent.

[Rave]

Quite possibly Ben. I will inspect the other side before I remove it and re-affix that side with a jubilee clip if necessary.

 

Having watched a couple of videos on youtube I reckon what I'm going to do it try and do the CV joint boot with a stretchy universal one, and if I succeed, drive the car to a tyre shop to get the tracking done, see if they can straighten it up satisfactorily. If they find something's bent I'll only be down the cost of the boot and many hours of pissing about, and I can decide what to do then.

[D Spares & Tyres]

With the wheels straight, measure the distance between the tyre and the arch. If same both are the same then arm is not bent.

 

If the arm is bent then its easy enough to replace at the roadside.

 

As for the CV, I'm not sure if the CV itself knocks off on these? If so, then just put a new gaiter on if if its split. If not then the stretchy ones are a pain to fit and the glue together ones don't work for long.

 

I bet a new or reconditioned shaft isn't much money, maybe £30 for these and they are easy to do.

 

Or you could just say you don't have time or whatever excuse you want. That's probably what I would do!

[The Moog]

Have a look at JR driveshafts.... Might end up cheaper overall

[Rave]

Cheers Tom. I think I can get a replacement shaft from ebay for about 30 quid, but I don't really fancy draining all the oil out of the gearbox which I think would be required? The stretchy boots don't look all that hard to do, and I can manage a bit of determined shoving and swearing. Good tip on measuring wheel to arch, I will try that. I'm not sure how easy it will be to find a completely level bit of road though, does that matter?

[Split_Pin]

As I said earlier the CV does not separate from the shaft on these. I got a second hand shaft from ebay which was indeed 30 quid. 1.4 and 1.6 items are the same so either will do.

[D Spares & Tyres]

Sorry no they aren't necessarily the same. On the ones I have encountered, the 1.4 has a slightly smaller shaft. Count the splines for accuracy.

 

Easy to refill the gearbox with oil. If you are very quick, with the new shaft ready to go it then you might not loose that much oil but its usually no big deal to top it up.

 

Level ground is best. Maybe a multi story car park? Nice and dry ☺

[Split_Pin]

I have a 1.4 and I bought a shaft for a 1.6 and it fitted perfectly.

[Dave_Q]

Pulling could also be a bent track rod, or maybe worn wishbone bushes?

 

Get a pry bar or big screwdriver and try levering the wishbone about near the bushes to see if there is any movement.

 

If not, I would agree with the approach of putting some new clips on the boot (assuming it's not torn or holed) then taking it for tracking/alignment to see if they can spot the issue.

[D Spares & Tyres]

Sorry no they aren't necessarily the same. On the ones I have encountered, the 1.4 has a slightly smaller shaft. Count the splines for accuracy.

Easy to refill the gearbox with oil. If you are very quick, with the new shaft ready to go it then you might not loose that much oil but its usually no big deal to top it up.

Level ground is best. Maybe a multi story car park? Nice and dry ☺

Well I probably jetwashed underneath mine and shrunk the fucker

[sierraman]

If the boot has gone for any length of time the CV joint will be knackered. I'd just pull the driveshaft out and put a JR Driveshaft on it.

 

To test the wishbone accurately, with the car on the ground try prying the lower swivel against the knuckle, similarly if the inner void bushes are seriously shot it would affect the tracking. Again if she's twatted a kerb the tracking will be way out. Wishbone isn't a difficult job unless like I've had in the past the pinch bolt sheared.

[Rave]

Damnit. My mum took the Peugeot off to Stansted airport today to collect our lodger. Less than a mile away from our house on the way home, she was turning into a very short section of one way street when she had to stop as someone was illegally pulling out of it- at which point someone else ran into the back of her.

 

 

 

 

The damage really does look fairly minimal, but I can foresee it being a pain in the arse. The other driver was apparently a youngish lad in an 06 reg 1.6 Golf, he sustained a smashed up headlight and possibly some other damage according to my mum. There was already a patch of rust in that corner of the boot which I had been meaning to do something about, it has clearly pushed that corner in a bit as the light cluster is slightly to cock, but the boot floor still looks flat. The car's clearly only worth a few hundred quid anyway. Half tempted to see if the lad just wants to make a donation of a couple of hundred quid to save his own NCB, but I'm opening myself up to all sorts of being pissed about if I do that, I bet. I might just do nothing for the time being, see if he or his insurance company ring up. I'll certainly not be letting them take it away for appraisal, but I foresee a lot of "we hear you've been injured" (they haven't) and "don't you need a hire car" calls in our near future too. Bollocks!

[The Moog]

I would always ask. Had young guy in land rover go into the back of me - offer him £170 to buy and repair myself or stick through insurance and he ripped my arm off.

[Rave]

He rang up an hour after I posted that- by that point I'd already decided that I wasn't getting involved in any insurance claims even if it meant I ended up with nothing.

 

He was polite and apologetic, and said that he didn't want to claim on his own insurance, and could we sort it out between us? So I asked for 100 quid. Done. I have yet to get it, will ring him tomorrow.

 

Today I took the wheel off to investigate. The arch liner just fell off! It looks as if one of the screws was missing anyway, and the impact sheared off the rusty bit that the other one was attached to. I already knew I'd be welding up that corner sooner or later, looks like it's sooner now. I'll try and push it back into shape a bit once I've cut the rot out. The bumper is scuffed and it looks as if the mount on that side has broken off, but otherwise it doesn't seem to be cracked.

 

Then I put the wheel back on and took it on a 130 mile round trip to Hastings and Pevensey this afternoon with four of us onboard. Put 20 quid's worth of diesel in at Sainsburys in Hastings as 116.9 is the cheapest I've seen it for a while. Doubt I used even half that trundling up and down the A21 .

[Rave]

Decided to attack the Megane today. Found I didn't have a 30mm socket for the hub nut so changed back out of my work gear and cycled off to Machine Mart to buy one. Returned with it, jacked the car up an inch just to take the weight off the wheel, and then found that gently bouncing my entire 12 stone on the end of my 2' breaker bar wouldn't shift it. It did bend the end of the bar though .

 

I've given it a dose of plusgas now while I consider my options, which are, as far as I can see 1) buy a longer, stronger breaker bar 2) buy a mains impact gun 3) give up as the job is clearly beyond me.

[bigfella2]

It might be easier not jacking the car up before loosening the hub nut. If the weight of the car is on the floor you don't need to worry about the wheel spinning when undoing the hub nut, it should come off with a breaker bar easy enough, but you don't know who has been there before.