Vehicles with strange controls.

[barrett]

Those Berkeley boxes are actually great when you get the hang of them, straight cut gears makes the best of the limited power as you can shift up in a split second and keep the revs up, down changes are much nicer than a typical prewar non-synchro box again because it's so revvy. Still takes me a mile or so to get accustomed to it when I drive ours after periods of hibernation. In fact I got it out for the first time in two years the other day and tooled around the lanes, so much fun with so little power. Lovely stuff.

[Ghosty]

[Noel Tidybeard]

Still easier to work I bet than a Nissan primera heater .

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

primevil heater piece of piss- press auto button then turn big right hand knob for desired temp job done

demist front window press top button,  press top button again to cancel demist

heated rear window bottom button, auto shut off after 10-12 mins

[Noel Tidybeard]

[alcyonecorporation]

Normally takes a bit of explaining. 

[Rod/b]

Nothing like in the league of the gearshifts that take a team of 3 to operate, but i find my Dodge weird in asfar as it's only got one stalk for indicators, main beam / flash, with wipers and washers on a turn knob. Well i've never seen it before anyway.

 

Please now continue with talk of 1930s cars with head-operated steering and whatnot.

[PiperCub]

Volvo trucks with their 4-over-4 range changer plus a splitter gearboxes - great fun once you get the hang of them. Add to that another lever for the Thelma retarder. Others may have a foot operated exhaust (Jacobs/Jake-Brake) to add to the fun of truck driving. Lots of trucks have similar amusing layouts.

 

Dog-leg gearboxes - nice idea for the racetrack, bit crap on the road, esp if they put reverse where you'd normally have 1st! 

 

Overall, if you want a complicated machine, sit in a 40's or 50's military prop-driven aircraft. Something like a DeH Beaver (used by the Army before helicopters took over). I sat in one a year or so back, never seen so many levers (throttle, mixture, prop pitch, supercharger, fuel primer, fuel pressure pump, carb heat etc), buttons (lost count), radios (4 off), etc in my life. It is bewildering if you don't fly, if you do fly then you'll do what I did, sit there thinking 'How the fuck did they manage to juggle all those controls and fly, navigate, operate this big bastard??'. 50's Army pilots, hats off you guys. (Still want to fly one though). 

[SierraMikeHotel]

Holy thread resurrection, Batman!

 

I was thinking of starting a thread about ergonomics but had a search first and here it is.

 

A couple of mentions of Citroen PRN satellites above.  I've had a couple of GSAs, an early CX and a mark 1 BX and I think they're brilliant.  They look weird but when you get used to them it's clearly far superior to conventional cars (like hydropneumatic suspension).  Everything you need is within a finger's reach of the steering wheel.  To my mind the GSA version is best, apart from the horn switch being hidden round the back (this is a BX).

 

 

By comparison, my wife's new Merc C-class is bloody terrible.  The buttons on the centre console have no logic, and neither of us can remember what order they're in so we always have to take our eyes off the road to make sure we hit the right button.  The infotainment system is dreadful, you have to dig through menus to do anything.  The cruise controller is right next to the indicator stalk, so it's really easy to grab the wrong one.

 

My boss had one recently as a courtesy car and he said all the same things.  It's a shame that things have actually regressed in this area.

[Talbot]

I really like having unconventional controlled vehicles. Some of the oddities I have had:

 

Talbot Horizon. The heater is between the steering column and the driver's door. Obviously.

Land-Rover. Floor-change switch for dip-main. I like that a lot. Also many gearboxes. 16 forward gears and 4 reverse, with selectable 4x4.

Early 80's Range Rover. Stereo is where? Oh, same place as the Horizon's heater.. obviously.

Citroen BX Mk1. As picture above. PRN controls, Dosieur valve brakes, front axle handbrake, hydropneumatic suspension.

Citroen CX MK1. As BX plus DIRAVI. And bonkers dashboard. Heater controls are where? oh, under my elbow, obviously.

Citroen CX MK2. As above. Stereo is where on the MK2? Oh, where the heater is on the MK1. Obviously.

Citroen C25. Right-handed handbrake. The number of times I grabbed for fresh air when stopped!

Merc W210. Everything on one column stalk. I quite like it. Foot operated parking brake. OK, as it's an Auto.

 

Pretty much everything else I've had has been conventional. And boring.

[SierraMikeHotel]

Citroen C25. Right-handed handbrake. The number of times I grabbed for fresh air when stopped!

 

I found myself doing this in the job Mondeo in January.

 

It took me a while to figure out why the hell I was doing it until I remembered that the last manual I drove was an LHD - the rental car I had on honeymoon in September. Muscle memory does some very odd things.

[beko1987]

My first experience of early bx weird controls was the as bx at shitefest. Looked bloody odd, until I sat in it and played with it. Everything reachable with an extended finger from the steering wheel. Makes me want a car with those controls ever since, but I couldn't afford one/do the work required to one I could afford now

[Zelandeth]

G plate Fiat Uno I had I seem to recall had slightly odd "pods" around the instrument cluster.  Didn't have it for long enough to really get to know it.  I do remember that it was completely unusable after dark however when I first got it as the SINGLE bulb that lit everything aside from the instrument panel itself via fibre optics had blown.  Sadly never saw it all lit up, but I reckon it would have looked pretty cool.

 

The Albion bus I've had a brief shot of (circa 1929 if I remember rightly) is a bit fun.  Manual mixture and advance/retard ignition controls.  Gear lever is on the right, and obviously is a crash box.  Conventional 4-speed H-gate, however 1st and 3rd have the gear lever virtually on the floor, wheras 2nd and 4th it's virtually jammed against the back of the cab.  First thing I did going for 3rd on the first occasion was near knock myself out on the steering wheel.

 

Centre throttle as per most commercials from that era.

 

Brakes only exist in the mind of the madman who designed the thing, and do absolutely nothing when you're actually driving.  Emergency stop from walking pace is about 200 yards.

 

Oh...and don't accidentally put your hand behind the control panel when going for the kill switch (it shorts out the magneto), as it will give you an all-bloody mighty belt if you do.

 

I have driven a Model-T, and while there's a brief period of flailing around trying to work it out, it actually works surprisingly well and is pretty intuitive once you've got your head around it.  I think the biggest challenge is just having to tell your brain to forget everything that you think you know about what the controls in front of you are going to do, because they LOOK like the controls you're used to.

 

Lada has the same extra stalk on the steering column to control the dip/main headlight function as most Fiats from at least the 60s to the 80s had.  I far prefer this setup for the lights to be honest.

 

 

Hot air to the lower part of the car is also controlled by the handle you can see down by the clutch pedal, which literally hinges the whole lower cover of the heater box.

 

 

 

Surprised that nobody's mentioned Saab's famous ignition key location (unless I missed it)...The choke is positioned where the little coin tray is here on carb cars - that took my father an age to find the first time he borrowed one from a friend!

 

 

Top tip - don't accidentally bash your elbow on the gear selector in an auto 900 when working on something in the interior either - it's a solid lump of cast aluminium, and will hurt like hell and leave a really nasty bruise.

[Talbot]

When a control looks like it should be something, but it's actually something else is when it sometimes gets a bit confusing.

 

Many years ago I did a few hours towards a PPL, and was flying a Piper PA28. Between the seats is a lever that looks *exactly* like a handbrake, and even has a button on the end in exactly the same way as a handbrake.

 

It's for the flaps. If you pull it up on the ground, the aircraft still rolls away. I know this.

[Zelandeth]

Oh...Some of the Leyland vehicles with the pneumo-cyclic semi-auto box where you need to put the lever in a position marked "S" to start the thing.

 

Took me a good fifteen minutes to figure that out on the first vehicle I encountered that on (Atlantean I think).

[2MB]

It’s not unusual in itself, but I still enjoy using the column shift autobox in my Elgrand

[dollywobbler]

Do I win?

 

Mind you, I drove a Ford Model T two years ago, and that REALLY messes with your head.

[cros]

Strange steering wheel arrangement on Ferrets to enable the driver to get out faster. Looked horrible.

[SierraMikeHotel]

Lada has the same extra stalk on the steering column to control the dip/main headlight function as most Fiats from at least the 60s to the 80s had.  I far prefer this setup for the lights to be honest.

 

 

This looks like a brilliant arrangement!

 

Lots of cars have a thing where if the lights are off, pulling the stalk flashes.  If the lights are on, pulling the stalk turns the main beams on permanently.

 

I dislike this enormously - one action should have one result.

 

I used to think it was the only good thing about the Merc: pulling it flashes, pushing it activates main beams.  That is, until the time I drove it and it randomly turned the main beams on.  I *think* the switch had been left "on" the last time the car was driven, but because that's a logic arrangement rather than a physical one (it still returns to the rest position) I guess I'll never know.

 

Sorry, that was very geeky, even by the standards of this site.

[Guest Hooli]

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Strange steering wheel arrangement on Ferrets to enable the driver to get out faster. Looked horrible.

 

Pre-selector box too for added fun*

[Zelandeth]

Yep.

 

Pulling it towards you flashes main beam. Stalk has three positions. Up, sides. Middle (level with indicator stalk) dip, and down is main. Some later ones only have the lower two positions so there's no possibility of accidentally switching from main beam all the way to sidelights if you're too enthusiastic!

 

It's a layout that I always miss on other vehicles.

 

Newest none Lada I saw it on I think was a 1994 Panda...

[Felly Magic]

Leyland buses did often have some crackpot gear selectors, I encountered an ex West Yorkshire Road Car Malton B reg'd Olympian that had a dual mode Hydracyclic gearbox, which had 2 lots of 'D' & Hold gears, top set on the selector started the bus in 2nd, the bottom set started the bus in 1st crawler, and it also had an un-used position for the doors, it baffled my colleagues who had learnt on point & squirt buses with a ZF or Voith, I got put in charge of types training on it whilst it was on loan. I new about the S to start long before I started driving buses, as I used to have a Mk2 Nasty, I also drove fully auto Hydracyclics as semi autos too, using the hold gears, and pausing in neutral, seeing drivers slam change makes me wince, I learnt how to change gears properly on the Nat, and my PCV instructor was amazed how easy I found the gearbox on the Atlantean I learnt in

[DSdriver]

I've just remembered I had a DS with a hydraulic gear change on a manual box. There was a lever behind the top half of the steering wheel which you moved progressively to the right to go up through the gears and vice versa. it also operated the clutch for you as well. How do you start the engine? Push the gear lever to the far left and release. Best security system ever unless car thief had driven one before.

it was brilliant when properly adjusted, all the people who hated it had a badly adjusted one.

[Zelandeth]

Leyland buses did often have some crackpot gear selectors, I encountered an ex West Yorkshire Road Car Malton B reg'd Olympian that had a dual mode Hydracyclic gearbox, which had 2 lots of 'D' & Hold gears, top set on the selector started the bus in 2nd, the bottom set started the bus in 1st crawler, and it also had an un-used position for the doors, it baffled my colleagues who had learnt on point & squirt buses with a ZF or Voith, I got put in charge of types training on it whilst it was on loan. I new about the S to start long before I started driving buses, as I used to have a Mk2 Nasty, I also drove fully auto Hydracyclics as semi autos too, using the hold gears, and pausing in neutral, seeing drivers slam change makes me wince, I learnt how to change gears properly on the Nat, and my PCV instructor was amazed how easy I found the gearbox on the Atlantean I learnt in

See also: me (aged 22) having to explain to the driver (50s) doing the City Tour in Aberdeen how to drive First's open top Atlantean. Pulled away from the stop and first thing that happened was me landing flat on my backside in the aisle as he slammed the poor thing straight through the years.

 

Spent the whole time complaining what an old heap of junk she was too.

 

Not true...yes, the engine is pretty worn out, so she idles rough, the suspension is...well... she's an Atlantean. Once you're moving though she drives absolutely fine, and I can vouch for the fact that she will happily cruise at 42mph on the open road all day long.

 

Whoever fitted the tachograph was an idiot though. It's directly in line with the steering wheel hub. This means that the only position you can actually see the speedo from the driver's seat is with your forehead pressed against the windscreen.

 

I apparently got bonus points from the instructor for managing to find the windscreen wiper switch unassisted too.

 

Those pneumo-cyclic semi auto boxes are a true joy to use when set up right. Why on earth would I use the "auto" position?!?

 

Never had the chance to drive a National on the road (yet) sadly.

 

Was trying to think if some of the farm machinery I've driven had any really odd controls, but even the combine isn't actually that strange. Rear wheel steering takes some getting used to...but the actual driving controls are normal enough.

 

Model-T is probably the strangest thing. ...though some of Craig's TVRs were probably close. Chimera (I think) I seem to recall having its instruments and switchgear all positioned really oddly - as though someone was laying out a cockpit based on a very badly translated set of instructions that you had then fed back through Google Translate...

[Tadhg Tiogar]

I really like having unconventional controlled vehicles.

 

....Citroen BX Mk1. As picture above. PRN controls, Dosieur valve brakes, front axle handbrake, hydropneumatic suspension.

Citroen CX MK1. As BX plus DIRAVI. And bonkers dashboard. Heater controls are where? oh, under my elbow, obviously.

Citroen CX MK2. As above. Stereo is where on the MK2? Oh, where the heater is on the MK1. Obviously......

I might also add CX S2 Automatic. Gear position indicator is.....by my right knee. Rear demister switch is....in the roof above the mirror. Logical.

 

 

 

I've just remembered I had a DS with a hydraulic gear change on a manual box. There was a lever behind the top half of the steering wheel which you moved progressively to the right to go up through the gears and vice versa. it also operated the clutch for you as well. How do you start the engine? Push the gear lever to the far left and release. Best security system ever unless car thief had driven one before.

it was brilliant when properly adjusted, all the people who hated it had a badly adjusted one.

BVH. Apparently you can now get them in 5-speed, but they cost a feckin' fortune.

 

Much-missed NSU Ro80 had Fichtel & Sachs "clutchless manual" with just three speeds, but touching the gear lever instantly operated a vacuum clutch.

[Felly Magic]

Trying to keep an Atlantean in a straight line at 50mph with gale force crosswinds is 'fun', yes that AN68 would do over 50 flat out!, Bent lollypop stick CAV selector bolted to the column on the left, control box with engine start etc down by your left foot, with the door pedal on the floor in front, spring parking brake bolted to the column on the right, indicators mounted just above the parking brake, so you could flick em on & off without taking your hand off the wheel, wiper controls on a ledge under the cab window. Mind you I have seen some series 2 VRTs with the wiper control by the air motors at the top of the windscreen.

 

First adopted a Yorkshire Rider trait countrywide, hiding the start inhibit switch, so if you didn't press it, all that would happen was the horn blew when you tried to start it, sometimes these switches were in obscure places, and often in different places on the same batch of buses

 

I did read once a letter re someone moaning about the multi function stalks on modern Dennishite in a veg mag, someone from Dennis said 'we could fit them upstairs, but I don't think drivers would be happy about it'.

[somewhatfoolish]

Overall, if you want a complicated machine, sit in a 40's or 50's military prop-driven aircraft. Something like a DeH Beaver (used by the Army before helicopters took over). I sat in one a year or so back, never seen so many levers (throttle, mixture, prop pitch, supercharger, fuel primer, fuel pressure pump, carb heat etc), buttons (lost count), radios (4 off), etc in my life. It is bewildering if you don't fly, if you do fly then you'll do what I did, sit there thinking 'How the fuck did they manage to juggle all those controls and fly, navigate, operate this big bastard??'. 50's Army pilots, hats off you guys. (Still want to fly one though). 

 

Fixed wing aircraft want to stay airborne, whirlibirds do not; Helicopters don't fly, they're so ugly they repel the earth. Even with hindsight it's not clear why we're still fucking about with helicopters and nonsense like the V22 when the Fairey Rotodyne existed and worked really well.

[Peter C]

I first came across a push button gear selector when I read an article in Classic & Sportscar about a Facel Vega (not shite by any definition).

 

 

Various American cars also featured these type of controls, these photos are from a Dodge and Plymouth.

 

 

 

All of the above are for automatic transmissions. I doubt there’s a manual equivalent. Or is there?

[SierraMikeHotel]

I loved my CX C-matic.  Three speed manual with a torque converter instead of a clutch, so to change gear you just lift off the accelerator, change, and carry on.  As nice as an automatic in heavy traffic, but you could enjoy driving it like a manual on a proper A-road run.

[cros]

This is not so much a strange control as a perverted control. In the 30's Rover provided a short gear lever that was a nice to use. Unfortunately the car it was attached to was either too rusty or expensive for me so I'm stuck with the waggly abomination that replaced it on my P4. It is made this way to allow a 3rd person in the front and is adjustable so that the lever can be swung closer to the driver. Unfortunately it does a terrible job of changing gear- the series Land rover gearbox is similar but without the linkage and you don't often hear people eulogising about how slick that is.

One control you don't come across too often these days is the freewheel which is engaged by turning the black knob. This allows clutch-less gear changes and the possibility of shitting yourself on long declines with a sharp bend at the bottom.

 

[Rocket88]

Citroen DS 23 with 5 speed column change box.......................to digress slightly, in the sixties, Triumph flogged a load of Standard Atlas vans to the Belgian Postal service.................which kept ending up in tram depots..............the track on them was exactly the same width as the tram tracks............