New Waftoloon BROKEN

[oldcars]

Very nice, looks clean and well looked after. 

[Jim Bell]

Well this has not gone well.

 

After behaving well on a 30 minute test drive and a thirty minutes drive home, and subsequent commuting, the S80s gearbox has developed issues.

 

Its missing a few shifts, there's a bit of atf in the undertray and the clutch mech (or whatever) is having arguments with the rev counter.

 

All the usual things you'd check for before and after a prolonged test drive. Which I did.

 

 

 

Fuck my fucking life.

 

Most expensive car ever lasts the shortest amount of time.

 

Guess the interior, engine and wheels will be worth a few quid.

 

Think it's going on a 99P auction as Spears oar Reapers.

 

What a fucking kick in the balls. Lovely car too.

[Honey Badger]

Can you change the ATF to see if it improves the gearchanges?

 

Dont know if they have an atf filter you can chnage to improve things either, is it worth putting it into a decent transmission shop and paying for some fault finding? It could be a sticky/worn solenoid that can be easily and relatively cheaply replaced. 

 

Comiserations anyway, hope you get it sorted.

[JohnK]

What condition is the ATF fluid in ?

 

Edit - as Nyphur says above, it's worth a try. Cured the issues on my old 730 when I thought the box was kippered.

[Jim Bell]

It's brand new. Looks brand new. Bright red and doesn't smell. It was advertised as just having had a change. Reckon previous giffer owner has changed it pre sale hoping that it would improve enough to sell.

[AlsoMike]

Could a low ATF level give the symptoms you've mentioned? Has the previous owner just not tightened the sump plug? (does it even have one?)

[SiC]

Did they put the correct ATF in? Most modern boxes are fussy on the type.

 

Not sure of the 'box in this but on Volvo's you usually fill it thru the dipstick tube. They may have drained it by removing the dipstick tube too, so could be leaking out of there if not put in properly.

[Jim Bell]

Good points. It has a dip stick on the box and the level looks right.

 

Overruns fancy reader also shows this code.

 

I'll check the box externally though. No idea what ATF was used though.

 

 

If anyone wants to have a gamble on this, I'm happy to take a shit offer. I need something quick to Dailly.

[SiC]

Looks like it uses the AW55. The same box that's in Mr Bo11ox and my Gooners!

 

To be fair its used in many other different cars too, apart from Renault.

 

Now the biggest problems are old oil. Sealed for life nonsense. How many miles has this done?

 

If it's cherry red, then its had a good few flushes before hand to get it to that.

 

Also known problems on this era often can be solved by a replacement valve body.

 

They're also incredibly strict on the ATF oil level. To properly read it, you need to get it to a set temperature (65c I think on Volvo - dipstick says what), be on level ground, engine running and in park. Temperature is read by using scantool that can connect to the gearbox. Min to max on the stick is only 300ml. Funny stuff can happen if not the right level.

 

I can find a link to the ATF that I used, that is compatible. Cheapest that we've found - £50 for 20l of the stuff. Mobil equivalent is £120 for 10l.

 

Was this a private or car dealer sale?

[purplebargeken]

My osteopath had one of these. Lovely thing but it shit its gearbox a couple of times. It cost him a fair wedge last time and he got a recon box. He sold it on whilst it was working for 500 quid. I am sure yours will be easily fixable though. I am convinced* of that fact.

[Jim Bell]

Private sale man. Old old fella who wouldnt let me take it away until i was happy with it. I'm not feeling enthusiastic about doing anything but punting it this morning like. Cheers for all the help and suggestions though.

It is appreciated.

[Jim Bell]

Yeah man cheers. I saw that.

It's all a gamble really. Pay for software. Pay for atf and filter change.

I'm skint.

[SiC]

What about this?

http://autoshite.com/topic/24623-£299-what-day-is-it-for-sale-honda-civic-£299/

I find that a good Civic is a great antidote after a unreliable car.

[Jim Bell]

Have I not got enough problems?

Jk

[Bren]

Private sale man. Old old fella who wouldnt let me take it away until i was happy with it. I'm not feeling enthusiastic about doing anything but punting it this morning like. Cheers for all the help and suggestions though.

It is appreciated.

Sorry but I don't care if the previous owner was the old man of the sea.

 

The fact is the car has shit itself after an hour in your hands.

 

Have a word.

[cort16]

What a piss hole. Is the eml on?

I had it twice on auto's that clunking changes and too many rev's came down to the MAF being on the way out but I would have thought the code reader would have picked that up.

[Jim Bell]

There's no eml on (though it goes off and on correcrtly at ign) but there's stored codes for clutch position error and fuel pressure error. And something else trivial. It's strange that the codes only show when connected, with no indication but I guess that's moderns for you.

[SiC]

Do those codes stay after you clear them, restart and go for a short drive?

 

Codes can stick around after the fault has disappeared and some cars turn off the EML in those circumstances. Always best to clear the codes then go for a drive to see if they come on, as you have no idea how long those codes have been there for.

[cort16]

I remember scanning my smart that had no EML on and it found about 20+ logged codes none of which it found serious enough to put the light on. 

If you put it in neutral/park and rev it up does it seem to run fine?

[Lukas]

Oh no! 

 

Mine drove fine at least four month before it broke. But mine did have the 2.4 petrol with  only 140hp. A Volvo-mechanic told me

the auto-gearbox in the 2.4 lasts longer than in the D5-diesel  because the petrol does have less torque, so better for the auto-box. 

 

But there should be reconditioned and overhauled autoboxes availble quite ceaply. 

 

I wish you the best with your S80, may it not end like mine. 

[fatharris]

I have only GPRS mobile internet at my disposal so I can't see pictures on here but I'm assuming you've got a non-geartronic auto, which would be AW55/50SN?

 

I bought a 2.4T V70 back in 2012 for £125 with a kippered box, and the price for a replacement box was ludicrous. Eventually I sourced a cheap one at £150 which turned out to be just as broken, so I sold the car as spares. Last time I checked they were around £500 for a s/h one, and double for a recon box.

 

Annoying thing was I eventually discovered that the original box could have been repaired in situ for free. Bit late after I'd taken it apart to see how an auto box worked and eventually had more questions than answers.

 

Sorry to hear this has happened.

 

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[Station]

The fella over the road cured his Lexus auto problems by changing the filter and fluid (correct fluid was £80 from Lexus/Toyota) in the gearbox. The symptoms were setting off on a 200+ mile drive home, and it poo-ed itself halfway in, the verdict was the box was knackered, but doing this cured it, which doesn't make sense. Filter was underneath the gearbox through a plate and took 30 minutes.

 

You could send a text to the previous owner saying 'Just to let you know, the gearbox ate itself on the way home', he may be decent enough to help you out somewhat, but we all know 'buyer beware'.

 

If it makes you feel any better, my 'superb example' RX7 didn't come with any fluid in the gearbox, the suspension all round was completely dead (resulting in several rebounds over bumps), the 'rebuilt' engine is showing signs of failure (occasionally hard to start when hot - but this might be flooding etc), and the rear wheels have so much play in them (thanks to worn out control arms) it put me into a lamp post round a corner. It passed an MOT with this, which makes me think it was very lenient. It's going to cost me a couple of grand (that I don't have) to fix.

 

Hope you get it sorted!

[Jim Bell]

Cheers dudes. Jesus Station, I thought your off was just hoon related. I didn't realise the Mazda was in such a bad way before lamppost gate. Sobering really. Could have been worse.

I've sent the Previous owner a message as he did say let me know how you get on. Any second hand car is sold as seen though. Touch black no swappys back etc. That's how I live my life anyway.

Though I will have a winge.

[SiC]

The fella over the road cured his Lexus auto problems by changing the filter and fluid (correct fluid was £80 from Lexus/Toyota) in the gearbox. The symptoms were setting off on a 200+ mile drive home, and it poo-ed itself halfway in, the verdict was the box was knackered, but doing this cured it, which doesn't make sense. Filter was underneath the gearbox through a plate and took 30 minutes.

 

You have to think of a auto box as a complex hydraulic machine. The fluid is the life blood of the box. It actuates all the brake bands, which engages the gears. It is used in the torque converter to transfer power. It cools the box. Etcetera.

 

Most garages (in the UK at least), have no idea on auto boxes and treat them as one big magic, black box.

 

My suspicions on this are that the garage that did the fluid change used the wrong fluid. These require special oil with certain slip modifier compounds and other additives. ... I'm not entirely sure what that exactly is about, but if you get the wrong one the box will slip and eventually kill itself!

 

Chances are, its only had the sump oil in the box changed. You need to change it a good 4-5 times to get all the oil fresh, as over half of the fluid is stuck in the torque converter and won't come out. Changing it and going for a drive, change it again and after a couple of times will come out fresh.

 

My box fluid looks red for the first 100miles or so after I do a change. However once it's got a chance to properly mix thru, it goes a yucky brown colour. I've had 4 changes so far and hoping the next time the fluid is a bit more red!

[SiC]

This is the fluid I've been using: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361375579484

 

Like I said I'm on my 4th change and 500 miles so far with this stuff and the box hasnt shit itself. Others on Volvo forums have used it too with success too.

 

Massively cheaper than big brands and a fair bit cheaper than others (e.g. carplan).

 

Not sure how your DIY car skills are, but this is a DIY'able job. The only critical thing is to measure how much comes out and put the exact same quantity back in.

[rainagain]

Sorry to hear about your bad news, I was reading about the gearbox as it's the same one in my S80 and I want to do a fluid change, I found this on a forum hope it might help:

 

 

The B4 Solenoid is a fiddle to do but not difficult Volvo sell the repair kit (they call it a piston repair kit Rufe on here can help Doves if your desperate) its not expensive about £15 I think.
I used to have several V70 P2 in my business we had the flaring between 2/3rd changes on 3 of them as a precaution we changed the B4 cover on all 6 I also got into the habit of flushing the ATF every 50k after reading up on the American Forums (year was 2002).
You will need room to work under the car so up on stands or ramps. Take off the under tray M10 bolts if I remember.
At the rear of the transmission angled down you will see a large (about 60mm dia) cap with a raised cross on it, this is held in by an internal circlip. Remove the circlip access is tight but you can reach. With a large pair of grips rotate the cap using the raised cross the spring pressure will push it out, have some rag ready there will be a dribble of oil if the piston comes out push it back in.
Inside the cap you will see a hardened washer if this is loose or has come away that is your problem. 
Use transmission fluid to lubricate the "O" rings on the new cap and push it in fit the new circlip, clean the area run the engine and check for leaks. Replace the under tray job done. Myself and one of my engineers became pretty quick after the first couple.
Finally Flush the Transmission then go to Doves to have the fluid counter reset and software upgraded. My understanding is you should only need Adaption if you have had major surgery on the gearbox.

[xtriple]

There is a wealth of infor re these gearboxes on the Volvo forums. Scared the crap out of me and I sold my V70 sharpish, but I know that a lot of the faults that appear terminal are in fact, repairable. The fluid used is a BIG important one and must be the correct stuff, ATF no good.

 

Round here there is a really good gearbox specialist, can you not find similar round your way?

 

So sorry to hear these problems you're having. If you want cheering up and Stations tale of woe didn't help enough, read mine!

[rainagain]

Here's a guide on changing it:

 

http://www.volvoxc.com/0/resources/how-to/pdf/b4-servo-cover.pdf

 

From the guide:

 

DESCRIPTION: In the AW 55-50, brake number four (B4), is only applied in 3rd gear. The B4 is applied by a piston, which is covered by an aluminum cap. This cap has a steel washer crimped to its inside surface, and a rubber cushion that sits between the cover and the washer. If this washer breaks free from the crimps it will become concaved because of the B4 piston return spring pressure.

 

This loose washer can cause: - " 2-3 upshift flare / slip - " Harsh 2-3 upshifts - " 3-4 upshift flare / slip - " Harsh 4-3 downshifts

 

Does this match what you're experiencing? Also the forums all say wrong fluid = big problems. Might be worth trying a change with the proper Volvo stuff

[colino]

Good that your getting some Volvo specific info. but with the trendy, adaptive autos around now, after doing a fluid and filter change, the next stage if a problem continues is getting the dealer to rematch the ecus and doing a proper installation drive.  (Usually accelerating from standstill at 2000rpm through all the gears up to 50mph and braking gently to a halt, holding on the footbrake and repeating 5 times.)  BMWs and Jags are normally cured by this software fix but absolutely no BMW or Jag dealer will tell you about the fault or the fix without you pushing for it.

[rantingYoof]

Funny...I thought the Geartronic boxes were the unreliable ones (sealed for life etc).

 

I'm trying to get SnrYoof into an automatic V70 but might reconsider if they have a short life expectancy unless nannied.

 

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