They_all_do_that_sir Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Morning fellow shite fans The V70 is due an oil change. I have the oil + filter and I'm ready for some messy fun. However on removing the filler cap I can see a lot of sludge in there. When I replaced the cam seal I noticed it was pretty sludgy in there as well. I'm tempted to run a flush but I've heard contrasting advice: YAY - engine flushes are the dogs and your car will love you more afterwards NAY - all that sludge is happy where it is, if you flush it it'll likely block oil ways somewhere else, the car runs sweetly just change the oil and walk away Lots of OMG I iz flushed my engine and it is fucked a week later type posts all over the inter web. What would you do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lisbon_road Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Consider taking off a cam cover or whatever and scooping out what you can. Personally, I'd flush. One way is to flush then change the oil using something cheap or even kept oil from another car to flush out the flush then put something decent in. Obviously change the filter after the process. saucedoctor 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Des Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 I wouldn't, I think the stuff is responsible for quite a few engines I rebuilt many years ago, sludge is a symptom of insufficient oil changes, you wouldn't down a bottle of laxative to deal with indigestion would you? Twiggy and alf892 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panhard65 Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 My garage used to be in the "good garage scheme" (A right rip off created by Forte to sell their products only and you don't have to be "good" just pay them £30 a month to be in the club.) Part of being in the scheme meant that you had to use their engine flush on all services. I would say if they are insisting that you use their product all the time then they must be very confident that it won't cause problems. On modern cars that have been well looked after it should be ok but not on really old stuff it can cause problems. It does make a difference you can tell which cars have been on it for years as they are always much cleaner, but they have had it as a preventative measure rather than trying to cure something. I am fitting a turbo on a Laguna and part of the conditions of warrenty are that you should flush the engine before fitting the turbo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mat_the_cat Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 If there aren't any problems then I'd be inclined to leave it - more on the basis of saving money than thinking you're at a huge risk of engine failure. Maybe many of the horror stories are people using it on engines which are halfway to being fucked anyway? I've used it a few times for the 'clean and shiny inside' feel good factor, then I decided there were probably better things I could be spending money on. However, the one time I've used it to cure a known problem (Rover V8 sticking valve lifter) it did the trick and the engine has remained tap free after several years and 30k miles. That was Forte, as I was impressed with their coolant flush getting rid of oil contamination. No idea whether other products would have worked equally well though. brickwall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bren Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 On a car that has been neglected I would do a couple of 1000 mile oil changes. Flushing oil can bring on the equivalent of a thrombosis if sludge comes loose. Plus it can sometimes make hydraulic lifters noisy. On a modern, sludge on the rocker gear is unacceptable - it means it has had 20k oil changes. Modern oil really are very good, this only happens when it is left for a long time. If you see it run like hell... brickwall, forddeliveryboy and PiperCub 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danblez Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 I most definitely would and then report back here every 3 months over 100k miles so we know once and for all who is right! Twiggy, mat_the_cat, brickwall and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mat_the_cat Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 /\ At the same time as running an identical vehicle in the same condition without the flush, just for completeness! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derskine Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Nay to the additive style ones, run some cheap oil for 200 miles, drain and refill with good oil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigmund Fraud Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Modern oils have 'detergent' additives that will gently dissolve sludge if your oil changes are reasonably frequent. 'Diesel-spec' oils are said to be better, but I suspect it's the diesel leaking past the rings doing this, rather than the oil. 'Engine flush' products are little more than an over-priced mixture of solvents (don't take my word for that, check the MSDS sheets !). I have no doubt that they will remove the sludge quicker, but I suspect there are more disadvantages than advantages to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skattrd Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Personally I use a flush every time I do an oil change. I don't consider it a proper service unless I change oil, filter and flush the engine. My tame mechanic did tell me to stop servicing the boring tdi too frequently as I was doing it at the scheduled interval (when the light comes on) but as I do virtually all motorway miles in the car I now do an oil change etc every 12-15k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
They_all_do_that_sir Posted October 10, 2014 Author Share Posted October 10, 2014 I've went for the halfway house option - I've bought the cheapest oil eurocarparts had (triple QX) and I'll run that for 1000 miles then change. Given I only do around 4000 miles a year in the car this might take some time....... I've emptied the old oil - looks like treacle, then found my filter strap wrench won't fit the volvo filter cover. I've ordered the proper sized filter wrench, once that arrives I can update my main thread with OMGDIRTYFILTER pictures and the like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plasticvandan Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Worst thing I ever did using flush,engine rattled and smoked afterwards. Run some cheap mineral oil or something like if you were running in an engine,but not glorified paraffin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brickwall Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Dropping a couple of pints regularly often works wonders and progressively cleans out the sludge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forddeliveryboy Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Cheap diesel oil for a couple of hundred miles, repeat. I'd be concerned about an aggressive solvent in an engine flush dislodging sludge and sending it floating around the engine looking for trouble. In the case of this V70 I'd remove the sludge with careful mechanical means and suction, then make sure to use decent oil and not prolong the change interval. brickwall and PiperCub 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timewaster Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 My only misgiving about the additives is wether a ALL the additive is removed when you drop the old oil. You wouldn't want a product designed to break down oil mixing in with your new oil. Maybe a cheap oil refill and change again after a few miles is the way to go with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Jimmy Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 On modern cars I'd say yes. Anything older, especially '70s and earlier no. I've been told of oil leaks occurring due to damage to Cork gaskets. Maybe this is the solvents damaging them? Some old boys have told me they used a pint of paraffin which seems a bit vicious too.The oil in my Corolla I bought 6 weeks ago was like molasses and there was a fair bit of brown varnish around the cam gear so I've filled up with cheap semi synthetic and I'll do so again after a few hundred miles. brickwall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Jimmy Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Depends too on whether you have an oil cooler, they can hold a litre so you don't want the left overs contaminating your fresh oil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovejoy Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 I seem to remember I made this mistake on my 327 Vette engine, flushed it out, put in new oil, went for a gentle sunday afternoon drive (as you do, in a Corvette...) and spun a big end shellbearing, engine siezed solid... was only doing 40 mph when it happened, honest officer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiperCub Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 When I get a new (to me that is!) car, If it's going to be with me for a while, I do the change the oil again after about 1000 miles trick which seems to clean up the engine a treat in my experience. You can tell how effective this is if your oil is still pretty clean after 2-3000 miles. Personally, I do this along with oil changes well inside those specified and that keeps things pretty clean so further flushing is unecessary.Some may think this is a waste, I don't, as a wise mechanic of the old school I used to work with once said 'Oil cheap, engines expensive' - he's long gone but his advice is still with me. I'm not specifically anti-flushes (apart from the cost of them) I'm sure it wouldn't be in any companies interest to market something that would stand any chance of wrecking an engine. It's just that I'm always consious that the aggressive nature of them on an old engine that might not have been overly loved in the past may be to dislodge a bit too much and end up blocking a small oilway, say to the cam/head. I suspect they work or are intended more for modern cars that while maintained, are inclined to be lumbered with (to us) stupidly long oil change intervals. mat_the_cat 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twosmoke300 Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 Basically to summarize . Don't use it in an engine that needs it but fine in one that doesn't . Hmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiperCub Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 That's about the size of it as far as I'm concerned - unless you're feeling brave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
320touring Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 Whatever you do- dont jetwash an f4R in a clio 172:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twosmoke300 Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 I love these little nuggets of info you get on here cos they come from someone's day of cursing and throwing tools around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beko1987 Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 I've been tempted to bung some flush in the meriva at the next oil change, to clear up and the sludge in there, and hopefully stop the tappety sound... No idea what to use though, its been about 12k since the last service, I've neglected it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
320touring Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 I love these little nuggets of info you get on here cos they come from someone's day of cursing and throwing tools around new fangled fwd with too many valves and not enough cyls was the issue here;) that and the fact that the water gets into the plug recesses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
They_all_do_that_sir Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 Here's a shite pic of my sludgy top end, for interests sake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forddeliveryboy Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 new fangled fwd with too many valves and not enough cyls was the issue here;) that and the fact that the water gets into the plug recesses Thought you were talking about pressure-washing the top of the engine with the cam cover removed. Perhaps you were...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
320touring Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 Thought you were talking about pressure-washing the top of the engine with the cam cover removed. Perhaps you were...?Alas no-french engineering thoughtfully provided a route that allows the water in whist the engine is complete, but required the removal of the inlet manifold to get the same water back out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
They_all_do_that_sir Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 I had a K series, great engine with the built in steam cleaning head gasket system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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