Air tools versus power tools

[Skizzer]

I need to acquire various tools to do a bit of DIY restoration work and I’m at a crossroads.

 

Do I:

A. get a compressor and air tools

B. get into one of the battery pack systems (Makita or something) or

C. just buy random individual corded tools from whoever has a sale on?

 

The sort of tools I’m talking about are a finger sander, die grinder, impact wrench, maybe an angle grinder (I have a cheap one) etc.

 

A compressor would also be handy for pumping up tyres, cleaning and possibly paint spraying. I can’t see me doing serious painting though as I’ve tried it before and am crap at it, so rattle cans for primer/touch-ups and farming out the rest seems more likely.

 

All thoughts, experience and recommendations welcome.

 

I’m not usually a starter of threads, apart from collections, but I don’t think we’ve had this discussion before and I thought if might be helpful to others. Mods: feel free to merge with Ask a Shiter or something if you want.

[blackboilersuit]

Angle grinder, die grinder, sander etc all use LOTS of air. I wouldn't even attempt to run them without a big compressor that was running off a 16A or 3 Phase supply with at least a 150L tank. A small cheap compressor is still worth it for tyres and blow gun etc. Battery tools are great but only if you don't cheap out on them. Whatever way you decide to go (battery vs air) there is no cheap solution, if you want good tools it's going to be expensive. Best value is probably going to be in corded hand tools.

[Jazoli]

my 50L SGS compressor runs all of the above tools with no issues and is perfectly good for home use, air will be the cheapest, but battery is the most convenient, one thing to bear in mind is that compressors are bloody noisy, mine never fails to make me jump when it kicks in and I'm sure it must annoy the neighbours a bit.

 

Compressors are just handy, as you can blow up tyres, blow stuff clean with the air gun, re-seat beads on tyres etc etc, I wouldn't be without one now. 

[wuvvum]

A mate of mine has a few old skool compressors with a massive but slow revving electric motor driving a big old cylinder.  They are relatively quiet and get up to pressure quickly but do use a lot of electricity.  And they are heavy bastards.

[coalnotdole]

I bought into the Makita LXT cordless range in 2015 and its been very good. The platform has expanded quite a bit and you can now get a huge range of tools all of which run off the same, Lithium ion battery. They do a dual charger so with 3 or 4 batteries you should have enough power to keep you going through most jobs.

 

I use the cordless drill and angle grinder all the time and have some woodworking tools in the range which I use less often. I will buy a cordless power file, a multitool and probably a right angle drill at some point too. Once you have something cordless its amazing how quickly you get bored with the trailing cables!

 

Once you get the batteries and charger. Its easy to buy tools in on their own as singles and expand the range as you need it. Ebay seems quite good for this.

 

Joe

[Dave_Q]

Would agree with Joe above, I have always bought the cheapest shittest corded tools for each job but went for a Makita drill set when doing the kitchen last year.

 

I've since added a multitool and will probably get an impact driver if I see one at the right price.

 

You could get started with a pack with drill and 2 batteries for about £200, then just add tool bodies as required.

 

The late great Davenumbers did do a thread on the open forum with a Makita vs snap on impact gun death match and the Makita beasted through everything it was presented, wheel nuts, hub nuts, ultra crusty suspension bolts etc. Without any cleaning or penerrating fluid or owt.

 

The makita impact wrench he recommended is about £280 for the tool body, you would probably be looking at getting towards a grand for a decent range of Makita tools (3 or 4 batteries, drill, impact wrench, grinder, power file, maybe a ripsaw or recip saw if you do any woodwork) but they're tools for life, and don't require you to be attached to your garage with a wire or tube to use them.

[Dan_ZTT]

Slightly biased as I spent several years working for Bosch tools, but yeah I'd say one of the battery systems would be a good idea. A lot less faffing around than a compressor too.

 

Bosch, Makita, DeWalt, Milwaukee are all good and I'm sure there's others too, but it is obviously more cost effective to pick one system to stick to, only get a couple of batteries and then the rest bare tools.

[loserone]

I'm impressed by the Parkside Professional stuff, though god knows what the support/ warranty would be like.

 

 

They won't be a par with those brands though

[Matty]

At work we have stopped bothering with 110 and air. I have a Milwaukee drill, 1/2 drive nut runner, 3/4 nut runner, angle grinder even a mag base drill. All are more powerful than air tools and all run off the same battery system. Not cheap but brilliant to live with

[Dave_Q]

I'm impressed by the Parkside Professional stuff, though god knows what the support/ warranty would be like

This is a good point, have had a look at this stuff in Lidl and the tools look like decent quality.

 

The warranty is pretty good I think, your main issue would be if you need new batteries in 4-5 years and they just aren't sold anymore.

 

Also I don't think the tool bodies are much cheaper than other brands really.

[Skizzer]

Thanks all, that’s very helpful. It sounds like battery is the way to go, and if I want a compressor for tyres and cleaning I can just get a small cheapie.

 

I agree that decent tools are worth the extra.

[sierraman]

I’ve a corded impact gun, it’s incredibly powerful. Not too dear either at £70.

[captain_cal]

If you buy Makita ones, register the bastards! Automatically gets you three years warranty instead of one.

[Scruffy Bodger]

Battery stuff is great but when it comes to grinders I'd buy a decent Makita corded one every time. Cordless grinders eat batteries and have very little power compared to a mains powered one.

[SiC]

Battery stuff is great but when it comes to grinders I'd buy a decent Makita corded one every time. Cordless grinders eat batteries and have very little power compared to a mains powered one.

Interesting. I've been seriously considering a Makita LXT battery powered grinder.

 

I guess good for cutoff jobs but not dressing welds/cleaning ready for welding with flap discs?

[Kringle]

Some great advice in this thread chaps, thanks. I had a 50L Clarke compressor and some parkside tools and they were shit. Probably my compressor to be fair but it was so much easier just getting the wrench out or a breaker bar.

 

I've never experienced a good cordless impact gun. The amount of time I've wasted with rusty suspension arms isn't worth thinking about!

[Scruffy Bodger]

Interesting. I've been seriously considering a Makita LXT battery powered grinder.

 

I guess good for cutoff jobs but not dressing welds/cleaning ready for welding with flap discs?

 

They simply haven't got the power or the capacity. I've used a Makita one in the past. They have monitoring technology to stop you drawing too much current, as soon as you lean into it to do a bit of heavier linishing they limit the power and soon run flat. You are indeed correct, they are ok for cutting with a 1mm disk as then you let the disk do the cutting, too much pressure just turns it into brown dust and it's a waste. They are quieter to use mind, probably why they are liked so much by certain keys capable of opening any lock, pikeys.

[Dave_Q]

Here's Davenumbers' thread on battery impact guns.

 

http://autoshite.com/topic/31117-dave-reviews-a-battery-impact-gun-makita-vs-snap-on-deathmatch/

[Mally]

Batteries are good if you stick to one good make and have a few charged up.

Compressors can be noisy. but are handy if you fancy a tyre machine.

I'm using a lot of 110v stuff on a transformer, I pick it up cheap on ebay now and then. 

Seems to last well and safer than 240v

[Schaefft]

Some very good information here indeed. I've been planning to get a cordless impact wrench and drill somewhat soonish for suspension and DIY work around the house. I was recommended a Bosch impact drill that seemed very fairly priced, but when it comes to rusty bolts, I just want as little pain as humanly possible. From what I hear here, Makita seems to be the way to go there.

[loserone]

I've had a Bosch drill for five years, which has put me off buying a proper one.

 

Avoid

[willswitchengage]

Remember the tool varieties are fundamentally approaching different problems.

 

Air: Powerful, reliable, durable. Require bespoke hard-wired infrastructure.

 

Electric (battery): Not quite as durable or reliable, batteries need charging now and then. Portable.

 

Basically one suits the DIY handyman type and the other is better for the workshop environment, when the tools have little downtime.

 

If you want extra power I'd just suggest mains-powered electric for heavier stuff like the angle grinder example - but even then I assume they'll be expensive professional tools.

[SiC]

Air: Powerful, reliable, durable. Require bespoke hard-wired infrastructure.

 

Electric (battery): Not quite as durable or reliable, batteries need charging now and then. Portable.

 

Basically one suits the DIY handyman type and the other is better for the workshop environment, when the tools have little downtime.

Not sure that's completely true in 2019. Certainly from my route into work walking past garages and seeing what mechanics seem to have in their hands.

 

Eric the Car Guy did a video on this did a pretty good job of summing it up:

 

I bought into the LXT range and love the Makita stuff. Extremely good tools that are quite cheap when bought body only.

 

I do have a (cheap) air compressor which I use for tyres and blowing air - about all the power + storage it has capable for. Air tools only run for a matter of a minute before the tank is empty and the compressor is unable to keep up.

 

That being said, when I've moved house I'm seriously considering getting a bigger compressor. Some tools are more convenient air powered due to their energy source being further away and thus lighter+smaller. Mostly want a bigger one to run my nibbler and so I can get an Air Ratchet. The amount of times in a job where an air ratchet would have been incredibly useful when getting into a space only big enough to fit a tool but no movement, an air ratchet would have been an incredibly useful thing to have.

 

The thought of how much stored energy is in an air compressor tank and if it ever did fail & let go does give me a bit of the heebie jeebies.

[Dave_Q]

Just seen on the toolstation catalogue littering my doormat they have the drill plus 2 x 3ah batteries for £169. Not bad when the batteries are £35 each.

 

https://www.toolstation.com/makita-dhp459sfe-18v-li-ion-brushless-combi-drill/p20882

 

The Davenumbers approved impact wrench body is cheaper than I thought, £210.

 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F233164008349

 

Most of the other tool bodies are relatively cheap, I paid £70 for the oscillating multitool, a grinder is £70, etc.

 

Edited to add: I don't work for Makita or owt just like the tools I have used. Bosch, Milwaukee, Dewalt and probably others have very similar tools/systems around the same price.

[SiC]

I do love my Makita DTW1002Z. Mine looks immaculately clean because its a tool I very rarely use. However that is not to say I wasted money on, oh no. Its a tool that you crack out when you realise nothing else is going to work and saves the day for you.

 

Here are a few action shots. Bare in mind I'm doing these videos with one hand on the tool, the other hand holding the camera. Also all on the lowest speed setting. These jobs I probably couldn't have done without a decent Impact Wrench.

 

 

 

[SiC]

One other small note, air tools are very noisy - especially compared to battery tools. This may or may not be a problem, depending where you are doing your work.

[hpi_matrix]

Another vote for the Makita LXT range, I currently have a drill, impact driver and impact wrench. Impact wrench has been invaluable for crank bolts, gearbox flange bolts, track/tie rods and other hard to remove bolts.

 

Their corded grinders have always seemed on the expensive side, I went with a Bosch blue instead and have been happy with it (used extensively for welding duty's)

[drewd]

I've got some old Ryobi tools with a knackered 18v Ni Cad battery. I bought them years ago from a plumber who was upgrading his tool set. The Ryobi One+ 18v tools are all compaitble so I should really get a Lithium battery and charger.

 

I tend to buy tools when they're on offer, so have

Parkside battery impact driver which has been great for the £40 it cost, a mains powered

Parkside Impact wrench that's not too bad but I haven't needed it much as I don't have a drive. A cordless model would be great for me

Stanley Fat Max drill from the same parent group as Dewalt and has a metal gearbox, which again has been faultless.

 

I'd like to buy the Ryobi impact gun and a 5A battery, as that will be handy for my jigsaw and circular saw, but I'll probably end up buying something on offer when I do eventually buy one.

 

Incidentally, Lidl have some sanders in from today, and are doing their mains impact guns from next Thursday.

 

EDIT

Aldi have a portable compressor on sale for £58, which is basically a mains powered tyre inflator/blow gun. It has a euro air fitting on the hose so you can swap the tools. Aldi claim it can run air tools, but there's no reservoir, it's just a pump so that's quite unlikely. I have an older one and it's really loud. Like ASBO loud. As such I never use it. If anyone in the North West wants one I'm looking to move mine on #shamelessplug

[willswitchengage]

Not sure that's completely true in 2019. Certainly from my route into work walking past garages and seeing what mechanics seem to have in their hands.

 

Things have clearly moved on since I last worked in a garage in 2006! They are probably still using a Mk3 Astravan as a courtesy car though.

[Dan_ZTT]

Battery tech is improving constantly and quickly. The difference in power & runtime on a lithium-ion cordless drill for example, new now compared to even 3 years ago will be remarkable. That said, certain tools suit being cordless better and it's to do with style of use. Short burst stuff e.g. drills, impact wrenches are ideal and it'll feel like the batteries last forever. Constant full-power stuff like grinders or sanders are never going to be quite as good on that front, although they're getting closer all the time.

 

My view - cordless drills and screwdrivers are useful round the house,l as well as the workshop, so invest in a decent one. You don't really need anything else to be cordless unless you're out working on building sites every day, so I'd just get everything else you might need on 240v mains. It'll certainly be a hell of a lot cheaper that way too.

 

Air tools are for factories and I don't really understand why anyone would bother with all that faff at home. Again, just my view.