Crappest engine ever

[sutty2006]

Definitely the LR 2.25 petrol engine. Had one in my series 3 ambulance that thing weighed nearly 3 ton and was so slow you could feel yourself age ungraciously. Not to mention 4mpg ish. Great in snow though

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Prolly not the worst ever but I got pretty quick at fitting exchange heads onto BMW M42 engines. They had an extremely low 'abuse threshold', I fitted an exchange head supplied by a customer once and I could see where it had already been welded and repaired. As Daz the apprentice warmed it up we heard a loud cracking noise, time for another head then...

 

 

 

 

 

I think I've changed one in 20 years. M42's are ace.

[Supernaut]

Definitely the LR 2.25 petrol engine. Had one in my series 3 ambulance that thing weighed nearly 3 ton and was so slow you could feel yourself age ungraciously. Not to mention 4mpg ish. Great in snow though

That just sounds like the wrong engine for the vehicle, rather than a crap engine.

 

I used to drive a SWB SIII Land Rover with the 2.25. Yeah, it was crap on fuel but it was short-geared and had all the aerodynamics of a block of flats. Otherwise a nice engine, and made a lovely flatulent noise from the exhaust.

[bigstraight6]

The Ford CVH (coarse vibratory harsh) gets my vote, the only thing they did well was burn oil..

[Lacquer Peel]

Those GM (USA) diesel engines ...

 

Didn't they just bolt a diesel head on to a petrol block?

No they didn't, but there were some weaknesses like not enough head bolts and a service network that didn't know what to do with a diesel engine.

[John F]

All the weight of a 400, all the power of a 125....smooth though I remember.

 

I made a special tool to tension up the cam chains on the 100/ 125/ 185 range as the spring adjustment never really worked unless you got the sequence absolutely correct and were lucky, i used to fit a new chain as a matter of course anyway for what they used to cost me - £4+vat from memory. Always made them sound better.

 

Yep, the Wet Dream was smooth. The ones I had handled nicely on Avons too, and even went fairly fast, eventually

 

But the 10 mm bolt that held the fragile camchain tensioner blade in place was tucked up underneath the back of the block behind the camchain tunnel, you could only get to it by splitting the bloody crankcase halves. Madness!

[HH-R]

Everything I've had with the 8v FIAT FIRE 1.2 in it has been shit, one was unreliable, one had HGF, one used a lot of oil, they're not particularly economical for their mediocre performance, they sound like sewing machines at idle and don't like to rev. The Euro 5 FIREs are utterly grim, every ounce of fun has been sacrificed for lower emissions.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Yep, the Wet Dream was smooth. The ones I had handled nicely on Avons too, and even went fairly fast, eventually

 

But the 10 mm bolt that held the fragile camchain tensioner blade in place was tucked up underneath the back of the block behind the camchain tunnel, you could only get to it by splitting the bloody crankcase halves. Madness!

 

 

The CX500 Vee twin had a similar kind of issue did it not? 

[Cavcraft]

 

 

I present to you the 4 cylinder Iveco 75E14 lump.

 

140 horses, 138.5 of which must have been left behind. Absolute and utter shit. Gutless, stupidly heavy on fuel, unreliable and the absolute epitome of awful.  Fucking rubbish engine, anyone who had to drive something with this engine in on a daily basis deserves a dustbin lid sized medal.

I'd rather drive a Golf with a Ford Ka engine.

[John F]

The CX500 Vee twin had a similar kind of issue did it not? 

 

Dunno, I hated my old CX500 with a passion & didn't even bother pulling it apart when it shat a head gasket.

[somewhatfoolish]

The Rover 2&1/4 isn't shit, it's just been fitted to inappropriate vehicles because LR refused to fit furriners and it was the only thing they had spare. It's a perfectly fine engine in a P4 80 or an ordinary landrover. Ignoring kettles the worst LR engine is a toss-up between the VM in the Range Rover or the 19J Turbotdizzler, and even they have their good points, the 19J being quite sprightly(in landrover terms) even when in the early throes of terminal turbot borkage.

[Bren]

Isuzu 3.0 diesel. Not that powerful. Not that economical. Rediculous parts prices. An utter pain in the arse to work on.

 

Verdict - would buy again.

[Bren]

I spelt ridiculous wrong due to developing an inspector Dreyfuss like twitch when thinking about that engine.

[sutty2006]

That just sounds like the wrong engine for the vehicle, rather than a crap engine.

 

I used to drive a SWB SIII Land Rover with the 2.25. Yeah, it was crap on fuel but it was short-geared and had all the aerodynamics of a block of flats. Otherwise a nice engine, and made a lovely flatulent noise from the exhaust.

 

Ahhh the flatulent burble through a pea shooter exhaust. You are right, to a degree. Why did they put that engine in the ambulance and not the 6 cylinder petrol or the V8 i'll never know. But hey, it was still crap..... and im sure the V8 wouldnt have been any worse on fuel

[Squirrel2]

At the risk of being flamed, has anyone had experiences of the Rover ‘K Series’ as bad as it’s reputation?

Weak head gaskets and a tiny coolant capacity must have caused many a demise amongst other problems. So many otherwise acceptable Freelanders have been ‘bridged’ owing to the failure of this inadequate lump.

 

Squirrel2

[captain_cal]

Ahhh the flatulent burble through a pea shooter exhaust. You are right, to a degree. Why did they put that engine in the ambulance and not the 6 cylinder petrol or the V8 i'll never know. But hey, it was still crap..... and im sure the V8 wouldnt have been any worse on fuel

 

Pretty sure the ambulances only had the 2.25 because of standardisation across all the military LRs. Besides, mpg doesn't matter when the Army is picking up the fuel bill. Mine was lovely and smooth, even with a fucked carb.

 

The Td5 is probably my least favourite engine out of all the cars I've driven. Gutless, coarse past 3k and with the most hilariously bad throttle lag from its fly-by-wire. Oh, and the inevitable injector loom/oil/ECU interface. I hate my Td5 Disco and am actively looking to get rid of it. If anyone has a nice Saab 9-3 coupe, let me know.

[spartacus]

Another candidate has to be that VM diesel 2.5 4 pot used in Jeep Cherokees of the 90's. They had four heads and at 100,000 miles they would warp a head or two. Any taken in at the local Jeep dealership with over 75,000 miles went straight to auction. I believe it was originally designed as a marine engine, not well suited to road vehicles.

[AMC Rebel]

I might have put this in the other thread - but - 1.6 FSI VAG Pez as fitted to my ALDI A3.

 

Trumpeted as powerful and sophisticated.  Slow, gutless, unrefined and uneconomical.  Pointless when it only made a few bhp more than the 1.6 8 valve engine.

 

Pointless 6 speed box where none of the ratios helped get any significant power out of the fecker but in 6th it was still reviving like a bastard at 70mph.

 

Chocolate timing chain - mine had been changed under warranty but still did the death rattle on startup on random occasions.

 

Chewed it's EGR valve due to being a cheapo piece of crap and the clan in the inlet resulting from piping only recirculated exhaust and air (no air/fuel due to Direct injection) into the inlet system.

 

Hateful.

[AMC Rebel]

Another candidate has to be that VM diesel 2.5 4 pot used in Jeep Cherokees of the 90's. They had four heads and at 100,000 miles they would warp a head or two. Any taken in at the local Jeep dealership with over 75,000 miles went straight to auction. I believe it was originally designed as a marine engine, not well suited to road vehicles.

They put an extra cylinder on that for the Grand Cherry.  I test drove one but wasn't convinced.  Not especially economical either.

[Mrcento]

the Fiat 1.6's of the late 90s, the ultimate worst of all worlds engine of that era.

 

All the performance of a 1.2, with all the thirst of the 2.0, 5cy 20v.

 

The fact they actually replaced the 1.6 with the 1.2 16v Superfire and it was a massive improvement in all areas says it all.

[xtriple]

Honda camchain tensioners in the late 70s early 80s were nearly all appalling in their bikes and did serious damage to their reputation. If I remember correctly (doubtful) the CX500 had about 5 revisions of the tensioner before they got it right(ish)!

 

Can't think of any spectacularly dreadful engines though, everything has its fans it seems   Old Fords with valve stem seals that failed within days of the warranty being up, they still went okay but boy, did they like a smoke!

[Zelandeth]

Everything I've had with the 8v FIAT FIRE 1.2 in it has been shit, one was unreliable, one had HGF, one used a lot of oil, they're not particularly economical for their mediocre performance, they sound like sewing machines at idle and don't like to rev. The Euro 5 FIREs are utterly grim, every ounce of fun has been sacrificed for lower emissions.

Can't speak for the later ones, but the 999cc one with the single point injection one in our 93 Panda was a cracker. Never returned less than 50mpg, and went really well so long as you kept the revs up as it had no power to speak of below about 4000rpm. It loved to rev though so that wasn't really a problem. Given how light the car was it was possible to hustle it along surprisingly rapidly - even despite the total lack of syncromesh on 3rd gear. The single box exhaust on the Panda left it with quite a nice growl when it was being worked hard too.

 

This was back in the days of my parents being beyond broke - so it wasn't ever maintained. It had an oil change once - when the oil filter exploded, and a new thermostat when that stopped working. Only headache there was that the bolt hole in the head stripped, so I had to faff about tapping it out to something bigger.

 

We sold the car on when the fuel pump assembly started to leak. Our local mechanic wasn't comfortable working on the high pressure injection side of things (he was about 90), I didn't have the resources to do it and we couldn't find a good used pump anywhere locally (we didn't have internet access back then).

 

L25PAS, we miss you.

[Zelandeth]

 

 

I present to you the 4 cylinder Iveco 75E14 lump.

 

140 horses, 138.5 of which must have been left behind. Absolute and utter shit. Gutless, stupidly heavy on fuel, unreliable and the absolute epitome of awful. Fucking rubbish engine, anyone who had to drive something with this engine in on a daily basis deserves a dustbin lid sized medal.

I'd rather drive a Golf with a Ford Ka engine.

Wasn't it this engine that Optare in their infinite wisdom coupled to the most over complicated prop shaft setup ever conceived by mankind in the Alero?

 

We had one of those on fleet at the Council...in the six or seven years I knew it, the thing was probably on the road for a few months...we counted it as a major victory if it made it through a full week without a breakdown!

[barefoot]

Is there only me on here who's regularly driven a two stroke Trabant?

'Piece of shit' doesn't come close.

595cc's worth of...

 

Apparently 'It has a free wheel on the overrun in top gear, because it will try to four stroke'

 

What the actual fuck does that even mean?

 

It means that the fucker will kangaroo like a bastard whilst you are trying to negotiate your way around the Coop car park

when dressed in a suit & tie and trying your very best not to look like a complete mental case. 

[LightBulbFun]

on the subject of iveco buses and marine engines

 

wasn't the iveco engine they fitted to some Routemasters in the early 1990s just that? and as such (being an iveco and a marine engine in one) rather shit? I dont know what the engine was called specifically however

 

(I much rather me an AEC AV590/690 or Leyland O.600 please )

[Mrcento]

Everything I've had with the 8v FIAT FIRE 1.2 in it has been shit, one was unreliable, one had HGF, one used a lot of oil, they're not particularly economical for their mediocre performance, they sound like sewing machines at idle and don't like to rev. The Euro 5 FIREs are utterly grim, every ounce of fun has been sacrificed for lower emissions.

 

I disagree...at least partially.

 

They are a pretty good engine. At least the early ones were. The 1.2 8v isn't as revvy as the 1.1 8v or the 999cc 8v flavours, but is more "chunky" torque wise.  They are also really, really tuneable if you know what bits from other FIRES to throw onto them.

 

Reliability wise, little goes wrong. HG's nearly always due to lack of maintenance of cooling system. Aside from that, little or nothing breaks and generally, when it does, it's because it has been ragged for years with zero maintenance, long past when similar engines would have cried enough.

 

Easy to work on too, non interference, timing belt snaps? no worries, carry a spare and basic tools, change it in 15 minutes, on your way again. You can unplug every sensor on it bar the crank and it will run. Like shit, and drink, but it will still get you home,

 

Generally the models they appear in as the cheaper ones, run by the clueless or skint, treated as disposable items. When they break, they get "shit Fiat", when the Fiesta or Corsa dies long before it "Oh it had a hard life".

 

The later ones, though, are shit. Fiat started cutting costs and standardising everything they could and strangled the thing with emissions regs.

[MorrisItalSLX]

What happens when you get Holden's 173 6 pot and hack of 2 cylinders? You create an abomination.

 

[Jerzy Woking]

The  250cc BSA and Triumph engines of the late 60's early 70's. Utter wank. Can't beleive they are fetching good money now.

 

I briefly had a BSA Starfire which broke down with alarming regularity, everything from cracked pistons to knackered big end and rod, via sticking slide in the carb, slipping clutch and about 50 false neutrals.  

[PiperCub]

VM diesels as fitted to early diesel Rangies were appalling - couldn't get out of their own way. (& another vote for small LR engines).

 

'Prince' engine (PSA/BMW MINI etc) - all been said before.

 

N42/43 BMW - leaked like a beached oil tanker, horrid & unreliable once much over 100k.

 

70/80's Honda's with their camchain/tensioner festivals. 

[cros]

The land rover 2.25 was actually introduced as a 2 litre diesel before being 'petrolised'. This may explain its lardyness. It can be long lasting, smooth and quiet for a 3 bearing engine of its size. I once put a different, lighter petrol engine in a Landrover (as have many others) and it still used a lot of fuel.

Most modern designs make old ones look pathetic, but thats progress. Some reasonable engines have gained a poor reputation because manufacturers overstretch them, fail to maintain production tolerances, or don't do enough to keep the coolant inside. My Rover will stick with its prehistoric '4' and I'll roll in a few minutes later than you