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wanted an invacar AC Model 70 (and general ramble thread, with survivors list on Page 26 and thread index on page 1)

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#1321 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 05:51 PM

well this one didn't last very long...

 

Screenshot 2019-04-06 at 18.48.50.png

 

(im surprised it even shows up on the DVLA checker...)



#1322 ONLINE   egg

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 05:57 PM

unless it was exported to Northern Ireland...!


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1967 Mk12c Invacar, 1993 Ford Mondeo 1.6 base, 1995 Mazda 323c 1.5 auto.


#1323 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 06:06 PM

unless it was exported to Northern Ireland...!

 

haha could well be  :)

 

heres another one that was not taxed for long, its interesting to note the Mid month expire date, means it would of had a change of owner as tax does not carry over right? (iv noticed a good few other Model 70s with Tax expired on Random dates like this but untaxed much later on in life, im guessing thats when the scrap yard did actually have the V5 transferred to them or the tax was canceled for some other reason?)

 

image (23).png



#1324 OFFLINE   cms206

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 08:09 PM

haha could well be :)

heres another one that was not taxed for long, its interesting to note the Mid month expire date, means it would of had a change of owner as tax does not carry over right? (iv noticed a good few other Model 70s with Tax expired on Random dates like this but untaxed much later on in life, im guessing thats when the scrap yard did actually have the V5 transferred to them or the tax was canceled for some other reason?)

attachicon.gifimage (23).png

Tax did carry over back then, tax expiring at any point other than the last day of the month means the vehicle was physically delicensed.

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#1325 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 08:29 PM

Tax did carry over back then, tax expiring at any point other than the last day of the month means the vehicle was physically delicensed.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

oh cool

 

is physically delicensed the old timey equivalent of a CoD today then or something?

 

(out of curiosity would it affect a V62 application this day and age?)



#1326 OFFLINE   busmansholiday

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 08:51 PM

oh cool
 
is physically delicensed the old timey equivalent of a CoD today then or something?
 
(out of curiosity would it affect a V62 application this day and age?)

Not necessarily, remember in those days there was no interwebie thing so if you wanted to get any tax back you had to fill in forms and rely on Postman Pat to get the letter to Swansea in time.
Retaxing involved a visit to the Post Office, proving you had an MoT (stories about being able to buy them for a few quid in your local pub are errrrr), Insurance, and the cash to pay it.
Also in those days there was no SORN, people, usually the Plod, walked around streets and if there wasn't a valid tax disc you got a fine.
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#1327 OFFLINE   Dick Longbridge

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 08:52 PM

Road tax which is logged as ending partway through a month is when the car was officially consigned to the crusher.
That’s why I’m always intrigued by the demise of my first car. Road tax was due on 1st December 1996, which would have made it a nineteen year old Golf at the time. I’m sure it probably did go for scrap at some point after I sold it a couple of years previous, but I guess the V5 was never filled in and sent to DooVLA to confirm it was dead.
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#1328 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 08:56 PM

Not necessarily, remember in those days there was no interwebie thing so if you wanted to get any tax back you had to fill in forms and rely on Postman Pat to get the letter to Swansea in time.
Retaxing involved a visit to the Post Office, proving you had an MoT (stories about being able to buy them for a few quid in your local pub are errrrr), Insurance, and the cash to pay it.
Also in those days there was no SORN, people, usually the Plod, walked around streets and if there wasn't a valid tax disc you got a fine.

 

ahh literally just removing the Tax to get your monies back then, makes sense :)

 

tho why on an invacar? Tax was free LOL

 

and back then pre SORN, if you didn't want to tax a car, you could just let current tax expire and make sure it was not parked on a public highway right?

 

Road tax which is logged as ending partway through a month is when the car was officially consigned to the crusher.
That’s why I’m always intrigued by the demise of my first car. Road tax was due on 1st December 1996, which would have made it a nineteen year old Golf at the time. I’m sure it probably did go for scrap at some point after I sold it a couple of years previous, but I guess the V5 was never filled in and sent to DooVLA to confirm it was dead.

 

ah was there a specific thing back then you could send to the DVLA to tell them the car no longer exists, bit like a CoD these days?

 

although one would wonder why the car would still be on the DVLA database, unless when they computerised everything, back then they did decide to include cars that had "scrapped" markers anyway?

 

(I remember DW mentioned how TWC was "unscrapped" on the DVLA system when he applied with the V62, but IIRC TWCs tax was just expired normally rather then on a random day)

 

http://autoshite.com...iles/?p=1389747



#1329 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:52 PM

some more Mk10 stuff :)

 

its a shame this website only has postage stamp sized images *grumble* https://www.worthpoi...aflet-276265432

 

invacar-mark-10-invacar-leaflet_360_ba0990c1673fd72b807d5f636b25ed02.jpg

 

(this may have been the other picture I saw, but I could of sworn I saw a picture of a Mk10 in colour somewhere, but who knows)

 

(if ya zoom in you can just about read the small text)


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#1330 ONLINE   egg

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Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:59 PM

yes, the resolution is terrible!

 

I think it says the villiers engine offers 'unparalleled reliability'  :shock:

 

mk10.JPG


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1967 Mk12c Invacar, 1993 Ford Mondeo 1.6 base, 1995 Mazda 323c 1.5 auto.


#1331 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 01:46 AM

heres a fun picture of a Model 57 rubbing shoulders with RM1414 :) (both made of aluminium too)

 

15048984758_1721d83d1c_k.jpg

 

https://www.flickr.c...-rGQwo4-df79S1/


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#1332 OFFLINE   plasticvandan

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 06:30 AM

Here's a snippet I don't think I've mentioned, back in the 60s there was a separate tax class for Invalid Carriages,which was lower than for Tricycles aka Reliant and Bond,so long as it weighed iirc under 5cwt or so.There was a tax break of some sort whereby the DHSS paid the tax on them all as if was peanuts.while the model 70 was being developed it got so much heavier than the villiers models it was actually too heavy for the invalid carriage class and was classed under weight as a tricycle,but after all the pressure they were under to come up with something better and all the criticism around it,rather than admit it they swallowed their pride and stumped up the extra money for taxing them all,which must have cost a fortune back then
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#1333 OFFLINE   Datsuncog

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 10:51 AM

I've sent an email to the Ulster Transport Museum, to see if I can beg permission to poke around a bit on WOI654 - I'd like to take a proper image of both the VIN plate in the cabin and also the chassis number, to add to the records being built up here. I'm hopeful that permission will be granted, since it's a bona fide academic research project and I hold longstanding museum membership.

 

Ten working days and still nothing back through 'official channels' - will give the museum a rattle tomorrow and see if they can advise. After that, I'll start pulling a few strings behind the scenes and see if that gets me anywhere.


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#1334 OFFLINE   Zelandeth

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 03:23 PM

thanks for the nice words, im happy to see others are also enjoying my sleuthing :)





when you say the original for sale post, as in the ebay listing it self or this post on the RUMCar forums? http://rumcars.org/f...hp?topic=5499.0


either way yeah pretty sparse LOL


(unless theres a prior post of the listing here on AS? I did a search of the ebay listing number here to see if the ebay listing had been posted anywhere here before, and only my posts here show up)

looking at the location, didn't realise they where so local to me, id been to brighton many times because my dad lives or lived there (honestly dont know anymore LOL)

I still have no real idea where any of them ended up aside from TWC and TPA sadly (all of them are showing last taxed since whenever they where withdrawn from ministry service)

(also rather frustrating too, because this was a recent well documented event yet)

the closest thing I have to the current whereabouts of any of them, are a few photos of OVW445P being carted on a trailer somewhere (Im not sure if it was leaving the field with ST185CS or leaving ST185CS to a new owner)

086CB697-5268-4BF4-85EE-E6E23AF1E8CC.jpeg

(at least pop her eye back in LOL)

E517A394-FB06-47BA-8161-E5D30DF714CA.jpeg


I am highly envious of the door fit in that photograph...
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#1335 OFFLINE   JimH

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 04:12 PM

This is probably only just relevantish. If you have half an hour to spare you might want to watch this film from the CoI. Made in 1949 there are some little snippets of very early attempts to get the rather large number of disabled servicemen mobile again. A proper copy of it is available on the BFI collection Land of Promise.

 

https://youtu.be/yORlQnt27bM

 

It's certainly worth a watch if you haven't seen it before.


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#1336 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 09:31 AM

Here's a snippet I don't think I've mentioned, back in the 60s there was a separate tax class for Invalid Carriages,which was lower than for Tricycles aka Reliant and Bond,so long as it weighed iirc under 5cwt or so.There was a tax break of some sort whereby the DHSS paid the tax on them all as if was peanuts.while the model 70 was being developed it got so much heavier than the villiers models it was actually too heavy for the invalid carriage class and was classed under weight as a tricycle,but after all the pressure they were under to come up with something better and all the criticism around it,rather than admit it they swallowed their pride and stumped up the extra money for taxing them all,which must have cost a fortune back then

 

I appreciate the post/intention to share information however you have mentioned this before :) http://autoshite.com...ge-1/?p=1716711

 

however I have researched this myself

 

and as I have mentioned around the place it dates back to well before the Model 70 existed,

 

http://autoshite.com...iles/?p=1787142

 

http://autoshite.com...ge-1/?p=1743729

 

 

the Model 70 is not the only "invalid carriage" to over step the 254Kg invalid carriage limit.

 

the last invalid carriage to confirm to the 254Kg Invalid carriage class was the Invacar Mk10

 

everything after that including several villiers machines weighed more than 254Kg, so where technically not invalid carriages

 

and if you where a complete nutter you could even drive them on the motorway :)

 

on the tax thing AFAIK, Disabled drivers paid no tax?

 

as evidenced by this 1971 Mk12 Tax disc

 

tax-disc-1971-disabled-exempt-invacar_360_e9c6fe90be5c5c0a787601015610fad8.jpg


#1337 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 10:43 AM

on the speedo front of things

 

I noticed while checking out the Photos of this AC Acedes electric (Model 64) again https://www.ebay.co....tm/331686712203

 

s-l1600 (2) copy 3.jpg

 

that the speedo starts with 0 on the right and the top speed on the left, I THINK iv seen that before somewhere else but cant remember where for the life of me, otherwise not seen that before...

 

 

s-l1600 (10).jpg

 

I wonder why its backwards like that?

 

 

on the Model 70 front, if you remember this video

 

 

heres a picture of it I think :) sadly I dont know any details on this one at all

 

cm21_18.jpg


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#1338 OFFLINE   plasticvandan

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 11:31 AM

backwards was standard accross the british bike industry from year dot until the mid 60s.


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#1339 ONLINE   Christine

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 04:29 PM

I found a 300w  lightbulb  :-D but it doesn't fit anything in my house. :-(

 

attachicon.gifccc 001.jpg

 

attachicon.gifccc 002.jpg

Do you want this? pm me address if you do


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Vacancy for ....Viva HB  :-D


#1340 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 05:33 PM

projector lamps of this type are not something I actively collect, so unless your actively trying to shift it, im good thanks :)

 

however if there does come a time where you do need it gone ill gladly give it a new home :)

 

I appreciate the offer :)



#1341 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 06:18 PM

oh and to keep things vaguely invacar related

 

and to try an answer Zels question from a while back if I have any bare naked Model 70 chassis pictures

 

while I still dont have anything there bar the drawings from the manual

 

I did come across this shot again :)

 

invacar002-2.jpg

 

a Picture of MPD553P/VAV1L on its side minus an engine and gearbox

 

gives you a good look at how the Model 70 was constructed from underneath  :)


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#1342 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 11:37 AM

check this out I found an intiror shot of a Petrol AC Acedes (Model 57) :)

 

AC-Acedes-04.jpg

 

Looks like fun to drive! almost looks like you can push and pull the handle bars backwards and forwards... (talk about needing 3 hands to operate)

 

18897135119190a10f8f7c9ce40966baac14f994.jpg

 

NPJ340D

 

 


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#1343 ONLINE   egg

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 12:50 PM

I also love the demister pipe pointed at the window!


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1967 Mk12c Invacar, 1993 Ford Mondeo 1.6 base, 1995 Mazda 323c 1.5 auto.


#1344 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 02:02 PM

is it wrong that the first "word" that came to mind when i saw that uhh steering contraption

 

was "dagadagaga" to the sound of a Merlin V12?  :mrgreen:


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#1345 ONLINE   egg

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 02:12 PM

Lol, quite a different set up to the Invacar developed solution, but some familiarity in how the other controls are mounted on a 'box' on the right hand side.


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1967 Mk12c Invacar, 1993 Ford Mondeo 1.6 base, 1995 Mazda 323c 1.5 auto.


#1346 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 04:02 PM

Lol, quite a different set up to the Invacar developed solution, but some familiarity in how the other controls are mounted on a 'box' on the right hand side.

 

indeed! I wonder what control options where available for the Model 57/67...

 

heres the control scheme of an unknown age Electric AC Acedes (Model 64) :)

 

s-l1600 (11).jpg

 

 

speaking of ACs got some excellent news on the Q plate invacar front :)

 

Screenshot 2019-04-15 at 16.55.40.png


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#1347 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 16 April 2019 - 05:35 PM

iv been accumlating some more random invacar tidbits that and I feel like iv got enough to glue together into a post :)

 

first off the batt is been wondering about this invacar

 

IMG_8982.JPG

 

at first glace it looks like a normal Model 67

 

however theres a couple things that are a bit odd

 

first heres a normal Model 67 Mk14

 

image (10).png

 

notice 2 things, 1 the First Model 67, lacks the front mould lines that the normal Model 67, however I believe these where removed with the Model 67 Mk15, as seen with this picture bellow of a Model 67 I came across recently

 

k-jGW9EP.jpeg

 

but the main thing iv noticed is, every Model 67 iv come across has 1 door, where the first one in this post above, has 2 doors...

 

but they are of a different tone to the rest of the body work, so i wonder if they where retrofitted at a later date from a Model 70 or something?

 

or if the first Model 67 is something special? its in a museum in Australia for those who have not read about my first post about it in this thread :)

 

 

 

second thing for today is I noticed

 

with the 2 sites I have that tell my the vin plate from the registration plate, iv noticed they only work if the car im looking at, was at least taxed until 2001

 

if it was untaxed since before 2001 then 1 site says car not found and another one just wont return the VIN

 

however iv noticed 2 Invalid tricycles that despite being untaxed since the early 1980s, do return VINs

 

and that would be 

 

an AC Model 57

 

LPD806D

 

and an Invacar Mk12

 

PEV627D

 

I wonder why these do return VINs when everything else from that time does not.

 

It is worth mentioning that both exist today, so I wonder if at some point recently V5s where applied for, and although they did not tax them, this was enough for the chassis numbers to show up on the sites I use or something?

 

(however MPH759P still wont return a Chassis number on the sites I use, and I know a V5 is on the way for that one, will have to keep a close eye on things)

 

 

 

and finally one for Jon and plasticvandan since I know he likes Tippen Deltas

 

 

Don't think I've chipped in with a comment yet but I think these are great and I'm glad that so many have been saved. Hopefully, it should be a relatively painless overhaul and you'll be back buzzing about on the streets soon enough. 

 

Mrs_Jon & I started seeing each other in 2002 and I distinctly remember sighting one in York when we were together one day, so there was at least one shite stalwart locally holding onto one to the bitter end. I'd totally forgotten about them by that time but they were a core part of street scenery when I was growing up in the early-mid eighties but just like half pennies and those red and white stripey tents that workmen used to cover holes with, they disappeared overnight.

 

 

4 years ago, I brokered a deal with my cousin to buy a Fiat 500 locally, for £2500 (!!!). It was owned by this fella, who had previously owned a much more interesting machine:

 

 

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4210/3564...

 

 

Yes, at least one Harper Mk6 Invalid Carriage made it to New Zealand! 

 

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4233/3551...

 

 

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4072/3564...

 

 

I know what it's called, from the correct identification back in 2013 by one Scott Barrett. Anyway, I think the owner was attracted to the Invacar, as he'd suffered a stroke in 1983, so perhaps it was easy to pilot. That said, it didn't stop him buying the 500 in the 1990's and driving it all over NZ, despite him having effectively lost the use of the right side of his body. The test drive of the 500 was truly an eye opener, as he drove a 3 pedal car with his left foot only - approaching a T Junction downhill and having to give way was particularly terrifying. Suffice to say, much use of 4th gear was utilised during the trip.....

 
a Tippen Delta also made it to NZ at some point :) also painted bright red interestingly enough (did NZ have their own invalid carriage service, and painted them bright red?)
 
qmATEaXn.jpeg

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#1348 OFFLINE   Jon

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Posted 16 April 2019 - 08:14 PM

Interesting!

 

Not sure if you're aware of carjam.co.nz but you can look up look up an NZ car's registration number and usually, it has some relevant info to give.

 

Here's the Tippen's details:

 

https://www.carjam.c...ar/?plate=pr471

 

 

And the Harper's:

 

https://www.carjam.c...ar/?plate=11scw

 

 

Note that the Tippen is registered as a passenger car (and has a standard number plate, issued to cars, vans and trucks (AB1234, or ABC123 layout, according to time issued)), whereas the Harper is registered as a moped (I can't work out any rhyme or reason to how mopeds, bikes, trailers, tractors etc. are issued their number plates) and mentions it being re-registered. From that, I reckon the Tippen is most likely a UK import (as it states in the report but that isn't always wholly accurate) and the Harper I imagine was sold new here.

 

I've no idea about the history of invalid carriages in NZ but I did note that both of the above got their new plates and registration only 3 months apart and both are clad in a quite lurid coat of 2 pack red, so perhaps they were owned by the same person? It could well have been the guy I mentioned on here back in 2017 but I've no idea where he is now, so wouldn't be able to verify that!


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#1349 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 16 April 2019 - 08:27 PM

very interesting stuff, will have to remember the CarJam site, shame it cant do UK reg plates :)

 

as you say id not be surprised if they where owned/imported by the same person, wonder why they where painted bright red!

 

its another invalid carriage mystery to solve :)



#1350 OFFLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 06:06 PM

today has been a nice productive day :)

 

I got talking to Fraser directly, he is the chap who owns VES108S, and owned JPA268N and a few other Model 70s in the past

 

and he has kindly provided me with some detailed pictures of VES108S :) specficly of the plate inside the car, and of the chassis number suspension top mount

 

 

57099111_330005871201654_7051248629629059072_n.png

 

the first thing I noticed is, it has a different VIN plate then any other Model 70s VIN plate iv seen

 

its much shorter, and lacks the Lube chart, also although I have edited out the VIN number, i can confirm it does match up with my records and whats on the suspension top mount (fraser knew there was a chassis number somewhere there but he did not know where exactly until I showed him so, which he was happy to find out about :) )

 

the VIN plate also quite clearly says "government property" which further verify it was most likely not a privately sold Model 70, Fraser also told me it had sat since 1998, which interestingly lines up to when me and stuart think it lost its original registration, sadly iv still not been able to figure out VES108S's orignial reg plate, because all the 89xx invacars I have documented also have weird things going on with their reg plate! (well one does, and the other is a Northern Ireland car LOL)

 

sadly he does not know much else of its history, but he is visiting to the person he bought it off soon so will ask him more questions :)

 

its also interesting to note the Date of manufacture is January 1978, so they officially made Invacars into 1978 :)

 

 

 

for reference here is TPAs Plate

 

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and here is TWCs plate

 

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Fraser says his plan with VES, is to get it back on the road then sell it on

 

probably for more money then i can afford sadly (given what he said he has put into it so far)

 

Fraser did say if he comes across any cheap Model 70s he will let me know however :)

 

(he also says theres a chap In London asking £2K for a Model 70, but im waiting for more details on that, £2K is more then I can afford, but id still like to know the details :) )

 

he said apart from JPA which came via help from stuart, he has found all his Model 70s via his gum tree wanted adverts


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