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1600E What is the modern equivalent?


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#61 OFFLINE   JeeExEll

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 11:46 AM

History is littered with these -

2 Door saloon cars were the povvo option until BMW decided they could be called coupe and charged even more for despite the lack of doors

Absolutely. How cool is this? 1600E 2-door.
ZaDn6NG.jpg
wqmvOLy.jpg


Interesting site for anyone interested in Mk2s, it's a Lotus info site but Cortina geeks could hide in here for weeks.
http://www.lotuscort...m/?page_id=3704
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#62 OFFLINE   danthecapriman

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 01:58 PM

The ultimate Ford ‘E’ model for me is the Cortina mk3. I like the mk2 but never even half as much as the 3,4 or 5 ‘Tina’s. I sound like a broken record player, but to me the mk3 was and still is an absolutely superb looking car even in basic spec. E it up and it’s just epic! Though a GXL wouldn’t be far off the mark for me either!
Probably the rarest Ford E must be the Capri 3000E? Rare as fook and very valuable now if you can find a real one.

Back to the original Q, I’d probably agree, BMW 3 series.
Fords aren’t like they were (for better or worse!) back in the good old days Ford created and lived well off of all their little options packages, extras and so on, they did it very very well and you could tell who the cheapskates were and who flashed the cash just from a glance at the car. You could create pretty much whatever you wanted if you could afford it for whatever model you wanted. Ford Capri GTXLR anyone!?
That was lost in the 80’s and 90’s though.
My dad’s 60 reg Mondeo is a Titanium X estate, it’s a bloody nice car and very well specced but somehow it’s not the same.
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#63 OFFLINE   FakeConcern

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 07:56 PM

A couple of other Cortinas I remember, a man over the road from us had an aubergine Mk2 Savage, he showed me and my dad the engine bay once, pretty impressive! Anyone know if these were based on a 1600E?

Years later my FIL replaced his V8 Rover P6 with a Mk5 2.3 V6 that was always going wrong. I remember taking him and MIL to Norfolk in my 1275gt because it wasn't working!



#64 OFFLINE   Paul Dupart

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 08:46 PM

Another car of the era that comes to mind is the Humber Sceptre (Hunter shape).  Maybe if that had been given wider rims and a sports steering wheel, it would have been a serious competitor...


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#65 OFFLINE   danthecapriman

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 08:51 PM

Marina TC? Lots of hate for them but I’d love one!
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#66 OFFLINE   CortinaDave

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 09:14 PM

Fords arent lusted after now in the way they were then, or even when i was in my teens in the 90s when an Orion 1600 Injection Ghia was king of the carpark in my eyes.

The Cool Dad choice that also appeals to the acne brigade (which is where the 1600E was really) has to be some kind of big alloyed Golf these days.
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#67 ONLINE   SiC

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 09:26 PM

What about the new Mustang 2.3 ecoboost? Yes it is a fast car, but its a striking car. Plus loved by many and hated by few. Plus they're about the same on finance as a 320d estate.
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#68 OFFLINE   NorfolkNWeigh

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 11:43 PM

A couple of other Cortinas I remember, a man over the road from us had an aubergine Mk2 Savage, he showed me and my dad the engine bay once, pretty impressive! Anyone know if these were based on a 1600E?
Years later my FIL replaced his V8 Rover P6 with a Mk5 2.3 V6 that was always going wrong. I remember taking him and MIL to Norfolk in my 1275gt because it wasn't working!


I'm pretty sure you could have a Savage version of any Mk2, logically if you were going to spend all that money an E would make more sense. I've seen Savage estates and Crayford's , which couldn't have been Es and even a Savage Lotus, which seems a bit pointless, unless it was converted as a used car and the twink had blown up.
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#69 OFFLINE   NorfolkNWeigh

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Posted 17 May 2018 - 11:56 PM

Mention of V6 mk4 and 5( or 80s, for the pedantic) reminds me that they and the subsequent Sierra and Mondeo V6s, always had a certain Council House Prestige about them . I had a T reg 2.3 Ghia auto that was slower than a 2.0 manual, but felt and sounded lovely, likewise Mrs N had 3 different 2.3 Sierra Ghias and all three were sold at a nice profit without even trying, just by people coming up to her and asking to buy them. Should have kept the immaculate red manual one, it had aircon and pepperpots, on an A so had the thicker carpets,piped seats and felt lined cubbies that disappeared with the 85 cost cutting facelift.

Never owned one but a Mk2 GhiaX V6 Mondeo saloon with the chromed 15" Scorpio alloys and leather was a proper 1990's 1600 E.
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#70 OFFLINE   FakeConcern

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Posted 18 May 2018 - 07:35 PM

Golf R/ Audi S3 Sportback/Focus ST. probably.

The more I think about it, the more I think the Golf R is the spiritual successor if not the modern equivalent. It gets stolen frequently and is desired by teens and 50 somethings alike (as said by NorfolkNWeigh), but perhaps the emphisis is a bit too much on performance.



#71 OFFLINE   AnthonyG

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Posted 21 May 2018 - 09:22 PM

A Golf R is the equivalent of a Lotus Cortina. I think the closest modern equivalent of the 1600E would be some sort of top spec BMW 3 Series, but they all look the same unless they are the full-on M3, whereas the 1600E was easily identifiable as the top of the range from just a glance.

Quite honestly I don’t think there is an equivalent these days as the market is so different, in the same way there isn’t an modern equivalent of the Wolseley 16/60 or the Vanden Plas 1500.

#72 OFFLINE   Squire_Dawson

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Posted 21 May 2018 - 09:40 PM

I was under the impression that Fords of this era were thought of as tinny things by many people, no?


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#73 OFFLINE   GrumpiusMaximus

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Posted 21 May 2018 - 10:14 PM

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#74 OFFLINE   Ghosty

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 03:41 AM

A Golf R is the equivalent of a Lotus Cortina.

 

Golf GTD, then?


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#75 OFFLINE   AMC Rebel

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 10:49 AM

Ford could have ruined it all too by releasing (maybe for 1969, instead of the s2 1600E), an 'improved' Mk2 1600E with the V4 GT engine, a Cortina Mk2 2000E.

I don't think an Essex V4 Mk2 Cortina would have had the same appeal, but am surprised they didn't make any V4 Mk2s.
For a short time the V4 Essex was considered for competition use and there were a few works Mk1 Escort V4 rally cars built, late 60s. (I think Roger Clark tested one but could be wrong).


I am sure I remember seeing some V4 Capris in the scrappies back in the day
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#76 OFFLINE   anonymous user

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 03:19 PM

It's my fault that my father never had a 1600E, as I was the unwanted third child it made a car with four bucket seats an unuitable choice, he had to make do with a Corsair 2000E instead. (where I sat on the hump in the middle of the back seat and got car-sick, probably another reason they didn't like me)

Today's equivalent from Ford is probably a hotted up Focus, or the latest iphone
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#77 OFFLINE   JeeExEll

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 06:26 PM

I am sure I remember seeing some V4 Capris in the scrappies back in the day

All 2000cc Mk1 Capris were Essex V4s, even the facelift 2000GTs. (Only UK ones I mean).
Only changed to Pinto 2000 OHCs for the 1974 hatchback Mk2s.

The early Consul 2000 (Mk1 Granada shape) used the Essex V4 2000 from 1972 till mid 74 too. (Again, UK only).
Ford had to use them up. The rest ended up in late Mk1 Transits til 1978.
Check out this 72 Consul V4 :-)
eq6J0TG.jpg
CPv2OCi.jpg
lNsaQk9.jpg
1996cc of puttery fluttery V4.
Dinner would have been cold by the time The Sweeney got to it.
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#78 ONLINE   Tadhg Tiogar

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 07:43 PM

.....1996cc of puttery fluttery V4.
Dinner would have been cold by the time The Sweeney got to it....


What hp rating did they manage to squeeze out? The ones that were used to keep NSU Ro80s on the road seemed to be in the 85-95hp range....
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#79 OFFLINE   JeeExEll

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 08:13 PM

^ Sounds about right in peak condition for 2000E Corsair / Mk1 Capri 2000GT spec.
Difficult to imagine that a Ford Essex V4 from a Zeffer Mk4 would be used as replacement for a rotary NSU engine in the fabby Ro80. Or a low compression V4 from a Transit.

#80 ONLINE   Tadhg Tiogar

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 08:22 PM

^ Sounds about right in peak condition for 2000E Corsair / Mk1 Capri 2000GT spec.
Difficult to imagine that a Ford Essex V4 from a Zeffer Mk4 would be used as replacement for a rotary NSU engine in the fabby Ro80...


Unfortunately it was one of the very few that would fit into the engine bay without major modification; Hurley Engineering in Coventry did a fair run of these V4 conversions using not much more than an adapter plate for the bellhousing, and a change to Dellorto carbs.
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#81 OFFLINE   JeeExEll

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 08:35 PM

I'm guessing but maybe there were lots of ruined-engine but otherwise-good Ro80s around at that time selling at relatively cheap prices.

Essex V4 best option to make an Ro80 serviceable again, it's probably saved a load of Ro80s from being cubed.

A quite simple type of old-school mod just not possible these days.

#82 ONLINE   Tadhg Tiogar

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 08:42 PM

I'm guessing but maybe there were lots of ruined-engine but otherwise-good Ro80s around at that time selling at relatively cheap prices.
Essex V4 best option to make an Ro80 serviceable again, it's probably saved a load of Ro80s from being cubed.


The only other options at the time were the Ford V6 (slightly too tall), a Triumph 2-litre, or an Audi 1.8ltr (from the Audi 100). Or a replacement NSU Wankel, as nobody had cottoned onto the proper solution, which was a Mazda 12A or 13B rotary.
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#83 OFFLINE   cort1977

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 09:10 PM

I was under the impression that Fords of this era were thought of as tinny things by many people, no?

 

Not in Essex M8.


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#84 OFFLINE   skoda_fan

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Posted 22 May 2018 - 09:44 PM

I'm another whose dad had a 1600E, in "pale orchid" (BGT 273H), and he taught me to drive in it. Once I'd passed, I was the envy of my friends when he let me borrow it to tool around in. Little did they know that I was more envious of them because although they were driving around in ancient Beetles and Minis and suchlike, they at least owned their own cars whereas I was borrowing my dad's, which wasn't quite the same.

To answer the question, I agree times are so much different now and there is no equivalent.
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#85 OFFLINE   Tetleysmooth

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Posted 23 May 2018 - 08:30 AM

The closest I got to an 'E' was a Saluki bronze 1300 Mk 2 Cortina. NMM 718E. It was about 5 years old when I bought it. By christ I was green then. It had shagged Mc Phersons. It used to bounce around like a cork on the ocean. Had the struts done and loved it. I put the five-and-a- half J's off of my 105e Anglia on it, which made it look quite mean. Spent lots of time hooning around Canvey Island in that.

I had a Mk 3 Cortina as well, had a couple actually, but by far the best one was a 2.0 litre GXL auto. K reg, pillar box red with a black vinyl roof and Rostyle wheels with trim rings. Absolutely loved that car, it even had an 8 track in it. The first Mrs Tet hated it and spent most of her time trying to kill it.

I don't think there is, or ever will be an equivalent to the 1600E. It was 'of it's time', and will never be replicated.



#86 OFFLINE   AMC Rebel

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Posted 23 May 2018 - 09:21 AM

The only other options at the time were the Ford V6 (slightly too tall), 

Eh? How is the V6 taller than the V4?


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#87 ONLINE   Tadhg Tiogar

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Posted 23 May 2018 - 11:18 AM

Eh? How is the V6 taller than the V4?


Possibly because of the air cleaner box, etc. that Hurley decided to stack on top of it, which meant having to modify the Ro80 bonnet lid slightly....
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#88 OFFLINE   AMC Rebel

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Posted 23 May 2018 - 11:57 AM

My point was that surely the V4 and V6 Fords are the same height?


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#89 ONLINE   Tadhg Tiogar

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Posted 23 May 2018 - 12:15 PM

My point was that surely the V4 and V6 Fords are the same height?


They probably are. But for the conversion inserted into the Ro80, the V6 required the bonnet lid line to be modified, whereas the V4 didn't!
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#90 OFFLINE   adw1977

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Posted 23 May 2018 - 12:28 PM

What hp rating did they manage to squeeze out? The ones that were used to keep NSU Ro80s on the road seemed to be in the 85-95hp range....

 

In the Mark IV Zephyr the 2.0 V4 had 93 bhp

 

6640979927_3448649b98_o.jpg

 

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