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The slow death of Vauxhall?

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#31 OFFLINE   RoadworkUK

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 06:41 AM

Vauxhall aside, I'd like to see a far wider dismissal and restructuring of franchised dealers, because very few of them are genuinely run with the manufacturers interests at heart. Although there are a few sparkling independents, the vast majority belong to huge organisations, each of which have so many layers of management and shareholders to satisfy that the intake of cash takes precedent over everything else, and the shop floor is run ragged.

 

Pretty sure this is why it's rare to expect a customer experience any more enjoyable than you'll get in Halfords, whether you're buying a car or having one serviced.

 

Vauxhall has the added gloom of a non-aspirational image, but there are plenty of Audi, BMW and Merc dealers that are a blight on the brand's name.


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#32 OFFLINE   They_all_do_that_sir

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 06:47 AM

They just aren't aspirational and the current range is a bit meh.

Somehow ford have managed to fill the same market segment with cars that feel more premium. See focus vs astra.

Kia and hyundai make better cars

Corsas aren't terrible first cars but they are like a starter home for most people, after a few years they want a conservatory and a wanky postcode so migrate towards so called premium badges. An astra isn't going to cut it here.

Over here most insignias seem to either be cop cars, company cars or chav wagons.

Mokkas have a very council image, taking over from where the zafira left off.

I've never seen someone under 80 drive an agila

The Adam was too late to the party, fiat 500 and mini have that market to themselves (though audi are sneaking in with the A1)





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#33 OFFLINE   Isaac Hunt

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 06:55 AM

Not sure how Vauxhall sales overall compare with other brands on run rate.

The PSA ' happenings' won't help.

Then we have 'direselgate' where a recently fashionable diesel is now a gift from Satan, Euro 6 or not.

And the 2.0 Insignia Diresel with the oil pick up seal that perishes, looses oil pressure and runs your mains and b'ends.

Car Mechanics have one as a project car, 11 plate, 160k and it is 'fooked', engine out.

Scumtree is littered with 2.0 Siggy's with borked engines. It isn't as though it is a shitters paradise, cos where do you get a decent seconnahd lump from when they are all fooked and those that are not fooked will be in a few thousand miles.

Didn't NSU try that shit with a rotary engine that would last until. Ford V4 conversion, where did that get them,
........Vorsprung Dirt Technique.

A well maintained Diesel Engine should be good for more than 150k. So the brand and model gets a reputation, all Vauxhall are shit and Insignia's blow there engines up at 100k. How many new ones do they hope to sell even if it is a different engine.

#34 OFFLINE   SierraMikeHotel

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 07:04 AM

Blaming their own dealers is clearly a terrible thing to do. If I was thinking of buying one that sort of thing might well put me off.

I haven't had a lot to do with them recently so no strong feelings either way... I rented a Signum about six years ago and liked it, bit big for my needs though. A friend has an Adam which she (and I) really like, other friends have a Corsa that they're a bit disappointed with (poor ride quality and fuel consumption).

I've seen a couple of the new Insignias around and I think they look fantastic, don't know anything else about them though.

Is that good enough in such a crowded and competitive marketplace? I think they need to look to the product. Look how much Fords have improved in perceived quality of late. Something that's just ok isn't good enough any more.

#35 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 07:09 AM

195,000 Vauxhall sales in total last year - pretty small - Toyota alone sold over 100,000 cars into the UK market in 2017 and 33,000 so far this year - and that is in just one market.



#36 OFFLINE   sam simmons

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 07:16 AM

I recently purchased a 2017 Astra sri 1.4t petrol for a shade over £10k with original price of £20k (similar spec Focus was £5k more) that is perfectly adequate for its purpose after looking at the Korean offerings first.

It is very comfy for me at 6 ft 4 and 16 stone and economy is averaging 48 mpg atm with mainly suburban driving but as i have never been a fan of the brand this car does not endear me any more so but it was cheap enough and has a good warranty is fairly sprightly and the dog seems to like the back seats.

I can park it where i like without fear of it being stolen or scratched due to jealousy but i guess i may have trouble finding it in a sea of mediocre modern shiteboxes..

all in all it is ok...but i doubt it will be with me for more than a year as i have my eye on something else already ;)
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#37 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 07:17 AM

They just aren't aspirational and the current range is a bit meh.

Somehow ford have managed to fill the same market segment with cars that feel more premium. See focus vs astra.

Kia and hyundai make better cars

Corsas aren't terrible first cars but they are like a starter home for most people, after a few years they want a conservatory and a wanky postcode so migrate towards so called premium badges. An astra isn't going to cut it here.

Over here most insignias seem to either be cop cars, company cars or chav wagons.

Mokkas have a very council image, taking over from where the zafira left off.

I've never seen someone under 80 drive an agila

The Adam was too late to the party, fiat 500 and mini have that market to themselves (though audi are sneaking in with the A1)





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Where the Met police used to run Vauxhalls they often run Hyundais these days and unless you spot the badge you would not know they were not Ford or Vauxhall. So that was another contract lost to Vauxhall.



#38 ONLINE   pshome

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 07:23 AM

look at the history of brand names PSA got under its control:

 

Citroen - survived
Simca - gone
Talbot - gone
Sunbeam - gone
Hillman - gone
Humber - gone
Singer - gone
Commer - gone
Karrier - gone
Ambassador - gone

 

Verdict: there is a 10% chance for Vauxhall to survive.
 


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#39 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 07:37 AM

It also make little sense to have 3 main PSA brands with all the marketing and associated manufacture costs unless they can be adequately differentiated across the range. Renault - Dacia do it and VW/Seat/Skoda but will, or even do they want, PSA to go down that road?



#40 ONLINE   GrumpiusMaximus

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 08:31 AM

Just went off down a proper rabbit hole searching for cars on the ncap site.
They did some sort of Golf Buggy alongside the microcars, hilarious video! Not so much for a driver I suppose, it got annihilated.

 

At one point I had a dozen or so crash test PDFs downloaded because I was just clicking on them and reading them for fun...



#41 ONLINE   Cavcraft

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 08:55 AM

They just aren't aspirational and the current range is a bit meh.

Somehow ford have managed to fill the same market segment with cars that feel more premium. See focus vs astra.

Kia and hyundai make better cars

Corsas aren't terrible first cars but they are like a starter home for most people, after a few years they want a conservatory and a wanky postcode so migrate towards so called premium badges. An astra isn't going to cut it here.

Over here most insignias seem to either be cop cars, company cars or chav wagons.

Mokkas have a very council image, taking over from where the zafira left off.

I've never seen someone under 80 drive an agila

The Adam was too late to the party, fiat 500 and mini have that market to themselves (though audi are sneaking in with the A1)





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As much as I’d like to disagree with that, it’s spot on.

Yesterday a link on the web (I only saw the headline) suggested Vauxhall were pulling ALL of their dealerships out, but would imagine at the moment that’s probably not true.
Besides the usual boring Vauxhall bashing on here and other bits of the web, and the old ‘they went down hill after the Cavalier’ sort of thing, they did and do still make some decent motors. The Corsa is a great little car but needs replacing with a new model and the Insignia is a fine looking car, for example. That Viva I had (albeit probably a rebadged ‘platform’ car) was fantastic, too. Then again they seem to have a bewildering range of small cars which seems pointless.

Sadly, with all the sort of rumours and scaremongering, they’ll lose a lot more sales as people will be less willing to buy if they think Vauxhall are going under.
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#42 ONLINE   Captain Furious

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:05 AM

Yeah I think that's right, it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy once people smell blood in the water.

 

Trouble with the Insignia is that its natual rival, the Mondeo, has always felt like the better car and the gap seems to be widening.  The new Mondeo is an amazing looking car and looks a worthy rival to the likes of the A4, 3 series BMW, VW Passat etc.  Whereas I dunno what it is, but the Insignia just feels like its a car for people whose company car grade isn't high enough for anything else.


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#43 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:10 AM

As much as I’d like to disagree with that, it’s spot on.

Yesterday a link on the web (I only saw the headline) suggested Vauxhall were pulling ALL of their dealerships out, but would imagine at the moment that’s probably not true.
Besides the usual boring Vauxhall bashing on here and other bits of the web, and the old ‘they went down hill after the Cavalier’ sort of thing, they did and do still make some decent motors. The Corsa is a great little car but needs replacing with a new model and the Insignia is a fine looking car, for example. That Viva I had (albeit probably a rebadged ‘platform’ car) was fantastic, too. Then again they seem to have a bewildering range of small cars which seems pointless.

Sadly, with all the sort of rumours and scaremongering, they’ll lose a lot more sales as people will be less willing to buy if they think Vauxhall are going under.

If think the dealer might close and then you'd have servicing, spares or warranty problems arising from this I'm sure it will put people off to an extent.



#44 OFFLINE   Paul Dupart

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:14 AM

PSA have probably bought Vaux just so as they can get them out of the market place and thus take more market share for themselves.

 

PSA'a business is not about making cars, its about making money.  And to do that, they just happen to make cars.

 

The French do make good small, fun throw away cars, they always have.  They've learnt to drop what isn't working for them - big cars.  Leave all that to the Germans.  They know their niche.

 

And now they (well Peugeot at least) seem to have some good designers aboard and make some nicer looking little motors instead of those goppy fish faced looking things of recent years. 


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#45 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:21 AM

PSA have probably bought Vaux just so as they can get them out of the market place and thus take more market share for themselves.

 

PSA'a business is not about making cars, its about making money.  And to do that, they just happen to make cars.

 

The French do make good small, fun throw away cars, they always have.  They've learnt to drop what isn't working for them - big cars.  Leave all that to the Germans.  They know their niche.

 

And now they (well Peugeot at least) seem to have some good designers aboard and make some nicer looking little motors instead of those goppy fish faced looking things of recent years. 

They got the van business which is probably useful. 


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#46 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:24 AM

Thats where the initial investment has gone. It strengthens the PSA brand in that area. 


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#47 OFFLINE   adw1977

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:26 AM

Yesterday a link on the web (I only saw the headline) suggested Vauxhall were pulling ALL of their dealerships out, but would imagine at the moment that’s probably not true.


PSA have given all the Vauxhall dealers 2 years notice of termination of their contracts.
But the expectation is that about two thirds of them will be given a new contract. Assuming that dealers even want a contract with Vauxhall any more!

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#48 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:30 AM

This may of course be to please Citroen and Peugeot dealers who may pick up the business?



#49 OFFLINE   lisbon_road

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:36 AM

Seems a shame.  Shitters response should be to watch the price of the cars plummet and buy one.  Rather like a vulture sitting on a tree.

 

Well, perhaps PSA will turn them around.  Rebranding, new image, after all, they've pulled the French brands back from the brink.  Lets give them a chance and see.  No-one wants to see the jobs at Ellesmere Port go.


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#50 OFFLINE   barefoot

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:42 AM

Sadly, with all the sort of rumours and scaremongering, they’ll lose a lot more sales as people will be less willing to buy if they think Vauxhall are going under.

 

 

Like the end of Rover.

 

Now is probably a good time to start looking out for a big new car at a lunatic discount and stow it away for twenty years

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#51 ONLINE   Slartibartfast

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:42 AM


PSA'a business is not about making cars, its about making money.  And to do that, they just happen to make cars.

 

You've just described every successful business ever.


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#52 OFFLINE   Ghosty

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 09:45 AM

I think badge engineering is the best case future for Vauxhall/Opel. As others have said, the new Insignia looks ace (but probably isn't that comfortable), and everything else is a dull facsimile now. Corsas used to be everywhere, those and Fiestas are an uncommon sight now in a sea of Binis, Fiat 500s and the like.
Default rep car has been the 520d for some time now so Insignia market is limited.
Nissan have crossovers tied up, Kia were on to something with the Sportage but they seem to be past their best, they put a new model out that was even uglier than the one before and since then numbers have been falling.
Greater Manchester Police used to use Astras as panda cars but that's gone over to Hyundai i30s now, and the bigger ones are all BMWs. There are some Vivaro vans mind.
I've no idea who Vauxhall are trying to be now, I struggle to even compare them to Ford. There just doesn't seem to be a place for them in the market any more.

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#53 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:13 AM

Having two identical brands in Vauxhall and Opel doesn't seem to make sense. Looking abroad for a moment on LeBonCoin there are 21 second hand Vauxhalls for sale in France (interestingly quite a number are RHD personal exports now being sold off  probably by expat families - though there are also two VX490's for sale!). That's compared to 31,970 second hand Opels on the same site. Clearly GM kept Vauxhall out of France but it does mean the Vauxhall brand has little visibility in Europe.



#54 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:18 AM

Both LHD I think. Happier times for Vauxhall.

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#55 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:21 AM

And if Vauxhall is considered to be a bit naff in its own country - where next? 



#56 OFFLINE   beko1987

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:28 AM

I agree with most of this tbh, Vauxhall seems to have fallen by the by nowadays. When I were a lad *misty eyes* my Grandparents always had Vauxhalls (because British*). Dunno what they had before I can remember stuff (I've seen pictures of a Chevette) but Granny had a pea green Nova, then a Blue J reg 1.4 Nova Luxe Saloon, and Grandad got a J reg Astra Mk2 for his work shitter until he retired. Then they traded the Blue nova in for an X reg Astra 1.6, kept that 5 years and now they've had a sea of Hyundai ever since.

 

Back to the modern times though sadly, Gareth hired an Adam the other weekend when I was at the FOD and couldn't lend him the Gooner. I laughed at him obviously but he had it until the Monday night so he drove me to and from work. And in the front, it wasn't too bad. 0 rear legroom and a boot barely big enough for his laptop bag, but with the front seats right back it wasn't bad. Interior felt decent, android auto radio with SEPERATE normal heater controls, at 80 it wasn't too noisy although apparently that was all it had to give, nippy around town (1.2 I think) and it was averaging 47mpg. Took £40 to brim the tank, and looked quite nice from the front. Not bad we thought. So we did a bit of lunchtime looking on the internet...

 

And found out that the one in his trim was nearly £19k! That's standard everything and the android auto box ticked. Fuck all else. We then found the VW Up! Gti which had alot more kit as standard, with their version of androud auto was almost 16k... We didn't like the Adam anymore, it feels OK, but not £20k of OK. What fucked up world is a VW ever any cheaper than a Vauxhall.

 

The icing on the cake is Gareths 15 year old Daughter, in my eyes THE target demographic for the thing said she didnt like it because it was a Vauxhall!

 

Bad times for Vauxhall in my eyes. I'll stick to the late 90's/early 2000's unloved astras/zafira A's and Vectra's if I ever decide to go down the cheap German route


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#57 OFFLINE   MorrisItalSLX

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:32 AM

Hopefully they don't pull a Holden and run at a loss, rely on Government funding to survive and go tits-up when the funding dries up.


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#58 OFFLINE   Felly Magic

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:35 AM

PSA fell out with Fiat, so they needed another van partner, and have it with the Luton plant, and I think that is the only reason why they bought GM Europe, the rest will simply become surplus to requirements. The Mokka is shit, seriously shit, you can tell it is a Daewoo in disguise, as the quality is simply awful, I was chatting to the bloke at my local Enterprise, and that was their last Vauxhall at their branch, they'd had numerous Insignias that had grenaded, and didn't even bother with Astras. Vauxhall simply do not have a place in the market any longer, and that fault lies squarely with GM, who couldn't run a piss up in a brewery


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#59 OFFLINE   Picketlinefeelingfine

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:35 AM

Car buyers won't touch a vauxhall that's made by psa. Vauxhall driving experience and French build quality? They'vr been making shit for years and it going to get worse. Give it five years and they'll be gone like lovely Rover

#60 OFFLINE   lesapandre

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:36 AM

Hopefully they don't pull a Holden and run at a loss, rely on Government funding to survive and go tits-up when the funding dries up.

Well PSA got a £10M Government sweetner on the Luton van deal...






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