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Saab 93 - electrics have died. Again. Probably Terminal

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#61 OFFLINE   Stanky

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Posted 03 July 2018 - 05:39 PM

The cheapest place for carb cleaner is toolstation, about £2 a can there. I buy it for mowers.

 

That does sound like dying battery related lolz to me, get a secondhand one from a breakers with a 3 month warranty. How much is it to plug into the tech2 at the local place? If its >£10 then buy a knock-off op-com from ebay and I'll bring my 'dirty' laptop for diagnostics over and we can play about with seeing what codes it has?


2003 Toyota Yaris

2004 SAAB 9-3

1998 Toyota Celica ST

 

1996 Nissan Almera GX (departed)

198? Jago Geep (Now resideing chez red5)

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#62 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 03 July 2018 - 06:58 PM

Main battery is near enough brand new - massive Varta lump I got back in march from Tayna. Consulting HBoL and goggling the interwebs there is apparently a separate battery just for the alarm siren. I have a long run planned this weekend up to Kent, so 80 miles each way, poor thing has only done 300 miles since we moved 5 weeks ago, mainly to the shops and back once a week and 2 trips to work - not good for the battery in a weasel engined car. Get no other faults come up, just this alarm one. If it is the battery at least it has some guarantee with it.

 

Just a thought. It's not the heat is it? Once the day cools down in the mid-late evening I can engage the alarm and it doesn't go off all night. Seeing as previous charging issues with the new alternator and battery were down to bad earths, I might have to go over every earthing point in the next few weeks.


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#63 OFFLINE   xtriple

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Posted 03 July 2018 - 09:33 PM

Probably the seperate battery in the alarm siren on its way out. They do need changing every so often and do the sort of thing yours is doing.



#64 OFFLINE   Jim Bell

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 08:18 AM

Have you checked the boot for oranges?
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#65 OFFLINE   Hooli

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 11:18 AM

If it's like the alarm on a 9-5 then it does have a battery within the siren. SiC turned the siren etc off on mine before I got it (using Tech2 I think) to solve what I think I remember as a similar issue.



#66 OFFLINE   EoGS

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 12:12 PM

I should break cover and delurk...

I’ve got a 9-5 with more or less the same engine - which generated tons of black smoke on acceleration. It would also go into limp mode pretty regularly and traced this to a hole in the intercooler about 1cm long.

The easy test is to pull off the hoses from the turbo and the inlet manifold, and fashion a bicycle inner tube into a ghetto boost leak tester. You need 2 sections about a foot long one with the valve in it. On the valve end roll up one end to seal the tube and pull it condom fashion over the smaller hose. Slice open the other bit and tie wrap it on to the other end. Pump and see if it hold pressure. If not you need to replace something.

Or rent a boost leak tester, it’s probably less of a pain in the tits.
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#67 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 01:32 PM

Have you checked the boot for oranges?

 

 

¿Que?


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#68 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 01:37 PM

Just done a quick goggle search, I can find kits for the 1st gen 93, but not the 2nd gen (which mine is).

Looks like a simple soldering job, some new lithium cells and a few capacitors.

 

Weirdly, it's also sorted out the accelerator fault for the time being, went for a good hour and a half's drive after work and no limp-home mode. Doesn't mean it won't come back, and knowing this car, it'll do it at next year's MoT.


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#69 OFFLINE   Hooli

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 02:14 PM

¿Que?

 

Referencing Barefoot's strange noise in his Jag that turned out to be loose oranges in the boot.



#70 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 04:56 PM

Referencing Barefoot's strange noise in his Jag that turned out to be loose oranges in the boot.

 

 

Not au fait with that story, I'm still quite a newby to the site.


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Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#71 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 01:01 PM

Had 4 days of no limp-home mode, no electrical weirdness at all. Alarm no longer setting itself off at random either, but still won't save its settings. I'm putting it down to the excessive heat and/or a fly being trapped in the car!

My trip to Kent has been abandoned due to yesterday's heatstroke/hyponatremia incident as still not feeling 100% the ticket, so spent the morning studying the HBoL to see how to reinstate the air conditioning pump. I seem to remember when I had the system checked over last year that the system had coolant in it, no leaks, but wasn't compressing when AC switched on, hence thinking the pump was shot.

Would a faulty pump clutch relay show up a diagnostic code if I put a reader on the diagnostic socket? I also don't have a working outside temperature sensor either if this is part of the problem, which on some cars I know is linked in with the air con system.


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#72 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 01:02 PM

PS this is first car I've owned with air-con!


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#73 OFFLINE   SiC

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 01:19 PM

The diesel compressors on these are a simple on/off clutch arrangement. The petrols have a variable deplacement pump that doesn't engage in or out as such.

For the diesel, I don't think it knows if the clutch is dead or not. (i.e. open circuit). Would have to check wiring diagrams to see how clever it is wired up. Have you checked to see if the belt goes round it? Sometimes people get a shorter belt if it siezes up to save replacing the compressor.

Likely the lack of working outside air temp sensor could be causing problems. Usually the system won't/can't engage in sub-zero temps, so no sensor means it can't check that and defaults off. Would again have to check the Saab Workshop manual for that. I'm not near my computer with it, so can't easily.
Oldies: 1972 Austin 1100 2dr - Project Rust bucket, 1974 MGB GT - A stereotypical classic car.
Moderns: 2008 Audi TT - Utterly boring but very compentent, 2010 Aldi A4 - Owned to placate the wife on my crap buying.

#74 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 01:35 PM

The belt goes round the compressor and it spins nicely - I think I'll try a temp sensor as they are not expensive plus I need to take the front bumper off anyway to sort the headlamp washers from pissing out whenever the wash/wipe reservoir is filled up.

 

Hopefully something I can source this week. Unfortunately HBOL has a "typical" wiring diagram for the climate control, but it does incorporate an external temperature sender. Looks like they're only a tenner or so. Had a look in the front grill of the car it appears to be missing. If it hasn't fallen out and broken a wire that it...


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#75 OFFLINE   Hooli

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 05:18 PM

Likely the lack of working outside air temp sensor could be causing problems. Usually the system won't/can't engage in sub-zero temps, so no sensor means it can't check that and defaults off. Would again have to check the Saab Workshop manual for that. I'm not near my computer with it, so can't easily.

 

That'd I'd say is likely, I've heard of it on a few cars causing the AC to stop engaging.



#76 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 09:15 PM

I've managed to order an external temperature sensor from eBay for £5 inc P&P, it's a Corsa/Astra/Vectra part, but same as the Saab part number and £10 cheaper. We shall see what it does.

 

I can whip the front bumper off, sort out the wheel arch liners and glue up the few broken bits of plastic which join the bumper and arch liners together. I have millions of imitation araldite - even if it keeps everything held together for a few months and the aircon working.

I've also seen while googling a non-functioning external temperature sensor can make influence the mixture and help with excessive smoking etc. which does sound a little far fetched that I'm not ruling out egr/manifold/swirl flaps/generally worn engine though.


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#77 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 18 July 2018 - 06:00 PM

Saab has been dead for a week. No electrics at all when key turned, but central locking still worked on the remote. Thankfully I have a working pushbike for work and now with access to the Corolla for the time being, a poor connection on cylinder 4 spark plug saw rude health being resumed this afternoon. Could do with new leads though.

 

Voltage tested battery and was showing 12.4v, not excessively flat but not enough to crank over a diseasel. Battery is now on a trickle charge overnight. Also noticed there is a big multi-plug on the side of the battery box. It looks wonky. and dirty. It also looks like the main feed from the battery +ve.

 

I've had enough of cars for today though, so tomorrow will involve checking this multi-plug for connectivity and corrosion, reinstalling the battery, and take a dismantled bed to the tip - it's been sitting in the car for 8 days now!

 

I'll report back tomorrow.


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#78 OFFLINE   SiC

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 07:49 AM

Is the key turning? If so, quite a few systems must be coming alive for it to do that. They're fussy at the best of times to allow that key to disengage and turn.

Have you tried disconnecting the battery for a bit? Sometimes a full power cycle and reboot can solve gremlins in these.
Oldies: 1972 Austin 1100 2dr - Project Rust bucket, 1974 MGB GT - A stereotypical classic car.
Moderns: 2008 Audi TT - Utterly boring but very compentent, 2010 Aldi A4 - Owned to placate the wife on my crap buying.

#79 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 02:36 PM

Battery charged up last night, just fitted to Saab, started fine and a lovely healthy 13.7v on the meter at tickover.

 

Blipped the throttle - donk donk donk

 

Noticed engine cover wasn't level, took off and realised whoever had taken it off last (probably me) hadn't put the rubber spacers in correctly.

 

Then I noticed this.

 

image1-2.jpeg

 

Soot should not be around there.

 

Then I noticed swirl flap actuating rod has gone missing, and No 4 swirl flap spinning round with the engine ticking over. It's a shit photo but best I can manage with phone.

 

image2.jpeg

 

Probably explains the limp-home mode, the boomy exhaust and the excessive smoke. I'm not sure what type of flaps this engine has, but looks like I need to whip the manifold off now and fit a blanking kit. Or new flaps.

 

Bollocks.


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#80 OFFLINE   FPB7

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 04:55 PM

Strangely enough.....

Having a look at my flaps tomorrow. I fear the worst.

#81 OFFLINE   FPB7

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 04:58 PM

Saying that, I think parts for Saabs do a blanking kit for not much. It's a known weak spot on them apparently, the rod (or ends) on earlier ones are plastic and break for fun. Later ones are metal and are a bit better. Actuator fails too.

#82 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 05:55 PM

I've no idea where the actual rod went. Does the ECU need remapping for this?


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#83 OFFLINE   FPB7

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 06:57 PM

I think the actuator has to still be there and possibly connected to the first flap to fool the ECU.



#84 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 10:07 PM

Phew. that means if I've got the flap system I think I have, I don't need to remove the manifold to put the blanks in. Bet I've got the ones with the screws that hold the flap to the spindle.

 

Then again, a full manifold removal will give me a good chance to clear out all the soot and give the EGR a good seeing to.


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#85 OFFLINE   SiC

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 10:17 PM

Full manifold removal on this requires fuel pump off. Which is a cambelt job.

However there are repair kits that can fit onto the remains of the existing spindle. The original rod bar is likely there still, just fallen deep into that well. You can get it out, just requires patience.

My 9-3 had this happen and twice too. First time with my parents it was sorted under Saab warranty. Second time was with me and it was long out of warranty at that point. As the repair kits didn't exist at the time, I used numberplate caps glued on to the rod. Worked fine and put another 15k or so on it. Until it got rear ended and written off.

The car is still on the road somewhere so can't be that bad!
Oldies: 1972 Austin 1100 2dr - Project Rust bucket, 1974 MGB GT - A stereotypical classic car.
Moderns: 2008 Audi TT - Utterly boring but very compentent, 2010 Aldi A4 - Owned to placate the wife on my crap buying.

#86 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 10:25 PM

Full manifold removal on this requires fuel pump off. Which is a cambelt job.

 

 

Fuckshitbollocks!


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#87 OFFLINE   SiC

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 10:26 PM

Like I said, you don't need to have the manifold off to reattach swirl flap rod.
Oldies: 1972 Austin 1100 2dr - Project Rust bucket, 1974 MGB GT - A stereotypical classic car.
Moderns: 2008 Audi TT - Utterly boring but very compentent, 2010 Aldi A4 - Owned to placate the wife on my crap buying.

#88 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 19 July 2018 - 10:30 PM

Like I said, you don't need to have the manifold off to reattach swirl flap rod.

 

 

my fingers are huge.

 

Then again cambelt is due a change I think. last changed at 150k, it's at 200k now. And I want to go down the total deletion of flaps route if possible.

 

Number 4 cylinder (furthest from gearbox) is actually blowing soot out of its housing with the engine running.

 

Then again I am tempted to fuck the car off and get that Samba on the tat thread


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#89 OFFLINE   dozeydustman

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Posted 25 July 2018 - 07:02 PM

Spent a couple of hours this afternoon in a shady spot with my head under the Saab's bonnet. No sign anywhere of the flap actuation rod. It would also appear that the swirl flap for No 4 cylinder has now jumped right out of its port. Buggerations.

 

I've also got 3 new faults which appear at random, but when they do, it's all at the same time. ABS, ESP and Traction Control failure. Going to trace more wiring diagrams tonight in the HBOL, I'm hoping again it's a dodgy connection or faulty ESP switch on the dash (had this before). Sometimes it's when I start the car, they're there immediately. Other times I could be driving for an hour and half with no fault.

 

However I'm now getting to the point of real frustration with this car, the Mrs no longer trusts it, and has started losing coolant and oil.

 

With MoT until mid May next year, I might put £100 a month by until then and get something a bit better. I think it's got to the point of not worth fixing TBH, unless there is a really brave shiter who wants to take it on?


Dream shite.

Talbot Sunbeam 1.6 - Shove-it - Viva HC - Samba - Triumph Dolly - Triumph 2000 - Avenger - Pug 205 with a suitcase engine - AEC Mammoth Major - Hillman Hunter - Allegro - another Simca would be nice as well - any 80's Peugeot - Routemaster


#90 OFFLINE   SiC

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Posted 25 July 2018 - 09:29 PM

Have you ever had the wiring on the back ABS sensor fixed?
Oldies: 1972 Austin 1100 2dr - Project Rust bucket, 1974 MGB GT - A stereotypical classic car.
Moderns: 2008 Audi TT - Utterly boring but very compentent, 2010 Aldi A4 - Owned to placate the wife on my crap buying.





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