Rover 820 failed alternator.

[tommytwo]

After 16 years of ownership, my 1992 Rover 820 has failed to proceed due to the alternator failing, and so is off the road. When I took the alternator off the car, there was evidence of extensive corrosion on the stud terminals. This model alternator (A127i) was not designed to be serviced by the home mechanic. To service the brushes, one needs the small sockets to take off the regulator body and gain thus access to the brushes. One socket id 5.5 mm so I am talking really small stuff here. All the nuts and bolts are hardened, some deeply recessed, so grinding them cutting them off, etc, is not an option. I managed to get the top brush out but not the bottom.

 

Ideally, I would would like to replace the alternator which is an A127i-85 Magnetti Marelli. But they seem to be very hard to find by these days and the re-manufactured ones I have seen are priced north of £100+. Second hand ones, breakers are asking £80 for.

 

Does anyone on here have such an alternator going spare? If so I can offer a good price. How about a A127 rated 65-75 amps? The A127i has four mounting points and the A127 has three. But size and shape are otherwise identical.

[Stanky]

Give this man a ring

 

http://www.jasm.co.uk

 

Mike?

 

Its where i went earlier today with my myriad starter motors. The chap doesn't really 'do' social interaction but very much seems to know his stuff. He can almost certainly repair your existing alternator if you can get it to him? The farm is in the middle of bloody nowhere in mid-hampshire. If transport is an issue then I'm more than happy to have it sent to me, I'll drop it at his place, and then collect and courier it back to you when he's finished?

[Dead_E23]

I have used this lot in the past.  They were cheap and good, and judging by what was on their shelves they are unafraid of working on old or unusual stuff.  A friend recently had them look at his Citroen Light 15 and came back singing their praises.

[Des]

Long shot but it could be worth looking a bit further for poor connections, or gamble a voltage reg if they're priced reasonably. It looks like a normal alternator, probably plenty of alternatives that would fit the space.

[johngarty]

A127 (Lucas)

https://www.atpelectronics.co.uk/p/rover-820-alternator/rover-820-alternator-a127.html

 

A127i (Marelli)

https://www.atpelectronics.co.uk/p/rover-820-alternator/rover-820-alternator-a127i.html

 

Any good?

[tommytwo]

Thank you gentlemen, your efforts to assist are much appreciated. The details from Stanky and Dead_E23 I have written in my dairy for future use. Thanks to johngarty for the link to ATP electronics, who seems to have exactly what I need, a YLE10128 alternator. At £90 all in, it seems a good price and the unit is up rated from 85 to 120 amps.

 

I went to the ATP Electronics web site and tried to place an online order but their system rejects my email address so I cant complete my order. So I called them and spoke to the switchboard lady who put me through to sales. After a wait, I find myself transferred to the voicemail of some sales guy who claims to be busy. So I have left my phone number and can only hope he gets back to me sometime soon.

 

I could fix my existing unit but for the fact that it is not possible to remove the regulator. It needs special tools.The bearing and slip rings are very good. I will see how today turns out.

 

Thanks again.

[phil_lihp]

Tommy, there's a company in Barnstaple called Alterstart who can probably rebuild your alternator - they did the one on my Jag no bother and I don't remember it costing very much.

 

http://www.alter-start.co.uk/

 

I also tried them for the starter motor out of the Octavia as it was worn out and getting slow, they could repair it but advised it would cost almost as much as a new one so sold me a brand new one instead for a decent price.

[johngarty]

A127 (Lucas)

https://www.atpelectronics.co.uk/p/rover-820-alternator/rover-820-alternator-a127.html

 

A127i (Marelli)

https://www.atpelectronics.co.uk/p/rover-820-alternator/rover-820-alternator-a127i.html

 

Any good?

 

If you are struggling with the website they have an ebay store with a good rep.

I think this is the one you want:

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-CANAL-BOAT-ALTERNATOR-HIGH-OUTPUT-120-AMP-A127i-TYPE-/181430420788?hash=item2a3e188534

[holbeck]

A127i was also used on a lot of Land Rover's and Ford Scorpio's of a similar vintage

[tommytwo]

Just to up date all you interested guys. Thanks for all the suggestions, much appreciated. Dad a call this afternoon from Craig at ATP Electronics. He agrees that the numbers I sent him are correct for my car, he had a re-manufactured unit on the shelf, up-rated from 85 to 120 amps so I have ordered that. £88.50 and guaranteed. Should be here on Monday. Assuming good weather allows fitting on Tuesday, Wednesday is my last MoT day then it it is out. Hopefully, the car will fly through again.

 

Apparently, the ALT-237im from an 89-98 discovery will also fit the 820 from 92 onward and its rated 120 amps.

 

This has been the only alternator problem I have had in 50 odd years. My old unit managed 26 years on the road. You cant beat good old British Engineering. To all you gents on here, I say "Be Lucky" I was!

 

Thanks again.

[johngarty]

Glad you got sorted. Keep us updated and mooooare pics 

[tommytwo]

Update for johngarty. My new alternator was delivered today on time, so was fitted this afternoon. It seems to perform perfectly and is pushing out 14.53 volts at engine idle. Allowing for the fact that my old one was failing (gave 14.17 volts) and I used an el cheapo digital meter, that seems about right to me. I also have a calcium battery and not lead acid, as the car would have had from new. Any way, here are some pictures:

[johngarty]

Excellent, glad you got sorted out. Now lets have some pics of the 820 beast itself

[tommytwo]

Yoyr wish is my command johngarty. First one is when I did the head gasket to cure the oil leak last year, engine now oil tight.

[Lord Sterling]

Yo Tommy, nice Rover you've got there. A big Rover 800 fan myself, I have 2 in that shape and used to have a 820i SE;

 

825 Sterling V6:

 

827 Sterling 'K'V6:

 

My old 820i SE:

 

I wish I never sold it, it was a pretty nice 820, but sadly my situation conspired against me; it broke down and wouldn't start, I had it recovered to some chap I knew, but things got a bit tougher, promises broken and financial situation was getting worse, I stuck it on eBay and it sold for a measly £100.

 

Still, I've got a few of the Mk1s aswell;

 

827 Sterling:

 

825 Sterling:

 

1987 820E:

 

Most of these are sadly looking quite sorry for themselves these days, hopefully they'll be moved to a new home in the next few weeks, given a wash, valet, run and some proper storage until I can get around to them.

 

So, erm...yeah...you've got a fellow 800 enthusiast/owner on these hallowed pages.

[tommytwo]

Nice selection of 800's you have there, Lord Sterling. If I had more space here at home, I would buy another myself before they all disappear. Let me know if you are selling any Mk2 820's in the next few months, especially a manual Stirling spec hatchback. I have owned my 820 saloon for 16 years now, bought at 10 years old. In that time, it has never failed to start or stranded me anywhere. Wish I had waited for a fastback to come up. Went for an 820 due to the KV6 reputation for cooking head gaskets and the 820 has more room in the engine bay in which to work.

 

I also own a MK3 Mondeo estate 2 litre petrol automatic. Nice car, quieter than my 820, rides much better, and in many ways is a far superior car. And yet I find that I prefer driving my manual 820. Cant figure it out myself. Tried to sell the Mondeo twice now but no interest.

 

I had this problem with the alternator last year as well, just prior to an MoT. The problem resolved itself and then has come back again this year, again just prior to an MoT. It must be Gremlins!

 

Lovely 800 pictures! You have certainly owned some fine cars.

[Lord Sterling]

Cheers man. Yeah, I am a bit of a nut about them, have all sorts of brochures, and other Rover 800-related bumph. I've also got some proper floor mats for these laying around if you want a set. I've got loads in fact, just not in all the available colours.

 

Despite the reputations between the KV6 and Honda engines, I have had 2 Honda engined V6s blow up (the G-reg one above and an identical car to the White 825 V6) yet my KV6 still lives and goes despite a busted radiator and more recently lack of use, I reckon it wants to live! Who am I to kill it?

 

Unfortunately, for now, these are all the Rover 800s I own, I've no manual V6s in Fastback spec available, I did used to many years ago though;

 

 

Now probably either parts of other 800s or bean cans now.

[johngarty]

Some lovely cars there chaps, Tommy you could try and stick your Mondy up for sale on here, its a trusted way to pick up a motah (with shitters discount of course  ). 

[tommytwo]

Lord sterling, that's a cracking looker, the grey 800 Mk1 picture you posted. Shame if it has ended up as bean cans, a motor like that deserves to be preserved. But there seem to be plenty of owners who know the price of everything and the value of nothing, and just run them into the ground. Surprised to hear that you have had a couple of Honda V6 engines blow up, I was under the impression that the 2.7 engines were long lived and gave no trouble. Of course, they were never tested by the designers with no water in the rads! Get your KV6  surviving engine fitted with a new rad ASAP. Don;t take a chance on it.

 

As for putting my Mondeo on here for sale, once I get the new MoT done in Mid March, I may just do that. (with a suitable shitters discount)

 

I now only need to remove one 4BA =(1/4 A/F) nut on my old alternator to get the regulator and brush box off and renew the bushes I have ordered a small 1/4 drive socket set and it should be here tomorrow. I am pretty sure this old unit can be saved. But it will still be only 85 amps, whereas my new one is 120 amps, much more suitable for me as I dont drive much over the winter and when I do, it is mostly short runs.

 

MoT test tomorrow morning, I will post how it goes (or does not)

[tommytwo]

Car has now gone in for the MoT and I am left, biting my nails, waiting for a call. They always find bloody something, even when it is not there!

 

I have driven less than 10 miles with the new alternator in place but I could tell the difference this morning. The battery swung the engine very fast, like having a new battery, freshly charged, fitted to the car. It is likely that the old unit was failing for more than a year and I never thought to check its output. So its a good idea to check your alternator output, once in a while, and not jump to suspecting the battery as the cause, if you are having difficulties in this area.

 

[johngarty]

Good luck with the MOT

[tommytwo]

Today there was bad news first, followed by good news. Passed the MoT with no advisories.

 

Discovered when I got home from dropping the car at the garage that my landline was not working so the garage could not contact me when they were done. (Bad weather here overnight) I went back to the garage at 12 and I was told that the car had failed the test on emissions. I then pointed out that because the car was an early Mk2, there was a gap in the MoT database and it was allowed to be tested as a non cat car,  even though it has a cat.(Up to 3.5% Co is allowed, has passed like that now for 8 years at around 0.97Co) Much head scratching from the tester and he had to look it up on the computer to check that what I said was actually so. He then did a new emissions test and it was a pass. He must have put in the wrong number for the first test, otherwise, I cant see that it would not have passed.

 

So I am a happy bunny again. Yesterday, No.1 son passed his Driving Theory test and wife got a good report also from her dentist, no work needed. Off to have a lie down now, cant take in all this good news.

[tommytwo]

After so much good news, I was half expecting some bad news, and it was not long arriving. Today, the car refused to start. The only light on the dash was the handbrake light which was very dim. I put my charger on and the needle swung to 5 amos so the battery was heavily discharged. So either there is a fault in the new alternator (failed diodes) or the battery is at fault. The battery is only 3 years old. I know batteries can give up at any time so I have ordered a new battery for delivery tomorrow. Thats my way of discounting the battery as the cause of the fault. If it goes down again, I reckon it has to be the alternator that has a fault. Its guaranteed so I will get it exchanged. ****sticks!

[tommytwo]

My new alternator that was supplied by ATP Electronics has proved to be a complete dud. It charges fine but leave it overnight and it causes a huge battery drain so the battery is flat in the morning.  Had it tested by an Electrical Specialist and the regulator has failed. And I read that ATP had a good reputation for supplying quality re-manufactured parts.  Not any more! This problem has cost me much time and money. I now have the aggro of shipping the thing back to ATP, and has left me with a disabled car. Annoyed is putting  it mildly.

[Stanky]

What a faff, can you not tell them to ship you a replacement, with a pre-paid returns label and on fitting - and proving the wretched thing actually works - you'll return the last one at their cost?

 

It doesn't seem unreasonable, granted it's a bit different but all server manufacturers do this. Dud part? order new one, next day delivery, includes return label and you post back the broken part. zero cost to the consumer. This should be no different. In fact, it should have been tested thoroughly before being sent to you.

 

90% of the grief is your (valuable) time fitting the damn thing. You are basically doing this free of charge. The least they could do is stump up £10 to cover the postage of the duff unit.

 

Worth an ask I reckon. No need to go in shouting, just be firm that you've wasted your valuable time on this so they should do the right thing.

[tommytwo]

Thanks Stanky, I agree with everything you have said. I have had an email exchange with Craig at ATP and he said that that basically they stand behind their product and will exchange it if it is faulty. I hope ATP really means that and its not PR. But of course the real problem is the wasted time. I started to seek the source of the problem on Friday and had to battle some atrocious weather working outside over the weekend. Its been freezing outside and so much rain fell yesterday that many places in Devon flooded and Police advice was not to travel. I was reluctant to come to the view that ATP had supplied a defective product and looked at every possibility before concluding that the alternator was indeed faulty.

 

I guess this is where I get to see just how good customer service really is.at ATP