12 year old car in 0 Star EURO NCAP test shocker...

[17-Coffees]

The 2017 Fiat Punto has been awarded Euro NCAP's first ever 0 rating. 

 

Now I never even knew it was still on sale in western Europe, other than maybe Italy but Fiat UK have it on there website still.

Anyway, having read this it got me thinking what the current Gen Punto was rated when it first came out in 2005.

 

So how has it dropped so far?

 

 

 

The Punto gained special attention from the body's secretary general, Michiel van Ratingen, who said: “The fact that older cars cannot compete illustrates the pace at which the vehicle industry is innovating safety and the willingness and ability of competitive manufacturers to meet the highest standards. Those who do not keep their cars up to the latest standards get left behind, as these results clearly show.”

 

Now I understand that how a car is rated has changed massively these days, with electronic assists accounting for one or two stars, but has the overall structure & rigidity of the car that bad by today's standards? 

Also worth noting, in the same test batch as the Punto, the Citroen DS3, Alfa Giulietta and Dacia Duster all got 3 stars. Note worthy as they have all been on sale for a good few years now. 

 

 

Link to Autocar story Here: https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/fiat-punto-gets-euro-ncap%E2%80%99s-first-ever-zero-star-rating

 

 

Its also got me thinking, how 'well' do 20 year old cars fair by today's standards? And also do we actually care about NCAP ratings? 

[alcyonecorporation]

I barrel rolled a 1973 MG Midget with the roof down and lived. 
You can have the best safety cell in the world, but at the end of the day it boils down to context (and what you end up hitting). 
 

That post reads more fatalistic than I realised. 

[Dick Longbridge]

I think the main issue is that the Fiat is made of cheese.

[AlabamaShrimp]

I barrel rolled a 1973 MG Midget with the roof down and lived.

You can have the best safety cell in the world, but at the end of the day it boils down to context (and what you end up hitting).

 

That post reads more fatalistic than I realised.

For once we agree. No matter how safe* a car is meant to be it all depends on what you hit and at what speed. The star ratings thing can be manipulated too to get different results.

[phil_lihp]

It's the same as back in 1996-ish when the Rover 100 was slated for scoring 1 star and folding up like a crisp packet - it was being compared to brand new models when it was, fundamentally, a design which was nearly 20 years old.  It wasn't being compared to the Vauxhall Nova or Citroen AX (or even the Visa/LNA) which it grew up with, it was being compared to some stuff which had been launched within the last 12 months.

[Split_Pin]

So I can disregard the 'safest car in its class' sticker on my 2001 Megane then!

[busmansholiday]

I thought the Tata Nano was the first car to get a zero. Or as it's a wheelbarrow with a roof doesn't it count?

[warren t claim]

How about trying not to crash in the first place?

[John F]

So I can disregard the 'safest car in its class' sticker on my 2001 Megane then!

 

It's French... it has to be capable of reliably producing enough electricity to drive in order to have an accident

[Kiltox]

So I can disregard the 'safest car in its class' sticker on my 2001 Megane then!

I’ve seen really messed up Laguna IIs and they looked brilliant inside. I would feel safe in a Renault of that kind of era.

[Eddie Honda]

The 2017 

 

Modern shit.

[FakeConcern]

I know we've had this sort of thread before and it does raise a lot of issues about visibility and various other things in new cars. I can't help but feel that the strength of cars reached a sort of plateau about 2003 or so and since then the NCAP gives points for what I would consider to be technical solutions that attempt to take the place of driver awareness (lane departure, blind spot, radar distance sensor etc) rather than the fundamental safety of the car in a crash. When we aquired the Moodus for Mrs Concern, someone posted this video of a Moodus crashing into a much larger, but older car (Volvo). The NCAP video also shows it fareing very well in that it does not distort all that much. I haven't seen any videos of the Moodus or its contemporaries being ploughed into a new car.

 

[oldcars]

Any idea what my Rialto scored?

[warren t claim]

Any idea what my Rialto scored?

It got a minus 5. It qualifies for a MENCAP rating instead.

[mercrocker]

Completely destroyed the opposition, apparently....

 

 

[alcyonecorporation]

For once we agree.

Yeah. I wasn't aware of this changing, but it did, and suddenly.

 

I needed 36 stitches and plastic surgery after the accident. I have to have regular meetings with the maxilio-facial team at UHSM up north.

 

Later that year I discovered that Ford Sierras weren't lightly built, either. I was travelling away from a news conference in the New Forest when a pony bolted across the road. I was travelling just under the speed limit in a five-door XR4x4; I swerved and the pony bounced off the NSF wing, went up over the roof and crushed it, shattering the glass sunroof.

 

Agister had to come and shoot the pony. When it landed it had broken three of its legs and I heard the gunshot go off as I was giving my statement to the police.

Breathlysed with no alcohol content - I still have the sample tube. I was thanked for stopping but told I wasn't going to come off well against the Magna Carta and freehold grazing rights for animals.

[Matt]

Any idea what my Rialto scored?

 

Doesn't matter. People can't crash into something they are staring at!

[alcyonecorporation]

How about trying not to crash in the first place?

That was TVR's official mantra under Peter Wheeler. Obviously Wire fans.

 

 

Also: did that 940 have an engine in that Fifth Gear crash test, or not?

[Uncle Jimmy]

For once we agree. No matter how safe* a car is meant to be it all depends on what you hit and at what speed. The star ratings thing can be manipulated too to get different results.

Sepp Blater- new encap chief exec?

[Ghosty]

FakeConcern, please don’t use that Fifth Gear video as a ‘new cars are better’ argument. The Fifth Gear crash tests were always exaggerated for dramatic effect - another example is slamming a Smart into a concrete barrier at a 45° angle at 80mph.

In this case, the 940 had its engine removed (a fairly well known fact). Of course the Modus didn’t deform.

[strangeangel]

All this stuff about NCAP stars should make me think about giving up my bikes. But I won't.

 

Logic is over-rated

[HH-R]

Ncap did wonders for manufacturers making small cars that didn't kill or paralyse you if you hit a headwind too hard back in the early 2000s (even if the manufacturers saw it as a marketing stunt, it did make them better) but it's just a joke now.

 

They keep redefining what the stars mean, so you can't really compare apples with apples when buying used. I know it's NEW car assessment programme, but cars aren't just scrapped after 3 years. Hence the Punto, it getting zero is a bit of a joke really, that should be reserved for absolute deathtraps that fold up on impact which it clearly doesn't.

 

Nowadays, stars are gained or lost on stuff like if the passenger airbag warning label is in enough languages, traction control on cars with 60 BHP, or the seatbelt warning system is so obnoxious that it makes you put it on even if you're driving to the other end of the car park. Cars that crash well can have poor scores and cars that crash poorly can end up having decent headline ratings.

 

I sometimes glance at the actual driver and passenger protection scores and notes, but other than that, the actual ratings are meaningless nowadays.

[alcyonecorporation]

I think it could be male bravado, but the accidents I had calmed my driving down somewhat.

I was never a particularly fast driver anyway.

[HH-R]

My Kia is 4 stars (mid 2000s era) but I have no doubt that in a bad crash I'd end up seriously injured at best.

[tooSavvy]

Slight ot....

 

Some loon has taken to dropping/picking up 'Shenniezze' at our school in a Freelander D.

 

Back to front redneck cap + blaring n* root beat

 

... Oh yeah '0-60 past the gates..Yo!'

 

 

NCAP on my Gdaughter :(

 

 

Some 'stealth lobby recording action' coming our way soon !!

 

 

TS

[Dick Longbridge]

How does nocap work for motorbikes then? Will a 2017 Yammy fare similarly to a 1917 Indian? Or does it have airbags to inflate the rider themselves, in case of a hard landing? Could I patent this idea?

[Justin Case]

That Punto seems to have stood up to the crash test well. The passenger compartment didn't deform, the wheel didn't seem to move back far enough to injure the 'passenger's' legs badly and the airbag (s?) did its job. Even the door looks as if it would open. I would imagine that unlike say an XF, the Punto will lose marks by possibly injuring a pedestrian who is hit rather than tapping him gently on the shoulder and telling him not to be so silly.

[FakeConcern]

FakeConcern, please don’t use that Fifth Gear video as a ‘new cars are better’ argument. The Fifth Gear crash tests were always exaggerated for dramatic effect - another example is slamming a Smart into a concrete barrier at a 45° angle at 80mph.

In this case, the 940 had its engine removed (a fairly well known fact). Of course the Modus didn’t deform.

Ok well you learn something every day, a well known fact I hadn't heard. I'd not seen that video until someone on AS posted it when we swapped my XM for the Moodus and I'm afraid I took it as Gospel.

I could also point out that a 54 plate Renner is hardly a new car and as I said earlier I sort of thought cars haven't really got any safer since then, just using technology to encourage drivers to be less attentive and rely on the car saving them from their poor judgement. That was my point really.

[FakeConcern]

How does nocap work for motorbikes then? Will a 2017 Yammy fare similarly to a 1917 Indian? Or does it have airbags to inflate the rider themselves, in case of a hard landing? Could I patent this idea?

Not a motorbike but......

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzoakbBxm5g

[Kiltox]

My Kia is 4 stars (mid 2000s era) but I have no doubt that in a bad crash I'd end up seriously injured at best.

Rio? Performed excellently when I punted one into a tree at some miles per hour