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Dollywobbler's Invacar - 2000 miles!

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#3271 OFFLINE   dollywobbler

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Posted 05 April 2019 - 03:10 PM

Cheers. MOT man did express some surprise!


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#3272 OFFLINE   Wingz123

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 12:33 AM

I would still love to see this hammering down the M5 or round the M42....

Needn’t be too scary - just keep to the slow lane and do one short motorway junction to begin with. Just let lorries roll past in the middle lane and I think you’ll be fine.

Would certainly get a feel for it. If she can do 60, 50mph in the slow lane would be alright I think...

Come on man! ;)

Furthermore....when is she due another oil change?

I love your video of this....especially when you take off....the noise that I can only compare to my time as a young child about to mix up some cake mix banging the wooden spoon against the edge of the bowl...
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#3273 OFFLINE   HarmonicCheeseburger

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 12:36 AM

Congrats on the MOT, I would have found the shiniest poshest MOT garage possible, and rattled up in TWC, and filmed the slow stoppage of work as realization kicks in.


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#3274 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 01:16 AM

I would still love to see this hammering down the M5 or round the M42....

Needn’t be too scary - just keep to the slow lane and do one short motorway junction to begin with. Just let lorries roll past in the middle lane and I think you’ll be fine.

Would certainly get a feel for it. If she can do 60, 50mph in the slow lane would be alright I think...

Come on man! ;)

Furthermore....when is she due another oil change?

I love your video of this....especially when you take off....the noise that I can only compare to my time as a young child about to mix up some cake mix banging the wooden spoon against the edge of the bowl...

 

Slow lane?

 

I think not, not with a reported top speed of 82Mph  :mrgreen:

 

theres a verse in the song "Thunderseley Invacar" at about 1:56 that goes something like "Mercedes car can never touch my Thundersley invacar now!" and I would be lying if I said I didn't want to blast past a modern Mercedes in an invacar as that verse comes up on whatever improvised music device I happen to be using LOL

 

(iv never actually had any of the various top speed reports properly verified, so iv been just as eager as you are, to see someone take a Model 70 onto a motorway for a proper thrashing/top speed run :) )

 

I know DW has wound the 2CV up to 70 before, and the Model 70 is a good 200Kg lighter but with similar horse power figures....



#3275 ONLINE   PhilA

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 01:38 AM

And at that pace, one Polish artic doing 78 past it to put it in a PULL UP! PULL UP! WHOOP WHOOP WHOOP TERRAIN! TERRAIN! kind of maneuver...


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#3276 OFFLINE   Mrcento

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 02:38 AM

I would still love to see this hammering down the M5 or round the M42....

Needn’t be too scary -

 

The scariest part of a motorway in a small car isn't the speed itself, it's other motorists taking a dislike to being overtaken by a small car and treating you like a bug they want to swat as a result. You have to give everyone 4 times the space you would in a normal car, trucks "can't"/won't see you and others seem to adopt a "meh, if we crash, at least i'll be better off than you" mentality.


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#3277 OFFLINE   Saabnut

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 05:54 AM

Be careful. Invalid carriages were specifically banned from motorways (see the big blue sign near the slip roads, along with tractors etc). I know that it is now taxed as a tricycle, but that does not alter what it is (taxing a lorry as an agricultural vehicle does not stop it being a LGV) so I think they are still banned from motorways by law.  At the very least it could be a long, time consuming and expensive court case.



#3278 OFFLINE   dollywobbler

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 06:03 AM

This larger class of Invacar wasn't technically part of that ban I don't think. The earlier two stroke versions certainly, and rightly, were. That said, I do know someone who was stopped by the Police in one on a motorway. They just told him to get off at the next junction.

What puts me off an attempt is the fact that speed can still be a touch variable when gradients kick in. Also, it is so horrifically unstable in a crosswind that passing trucks could be a very real danger. It's just not something I'm really prepared to try.

She's due a service. I have the stuff. Maybe next week. Maybe today!
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#3279 OFFLINE   plasticvandan

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 06:58 AM

All invalid carriages were banned,inc the model 70,but as its now registered as a tricycle, legally you should be fine.

#3280 OFFLINE   GrumpiusMaximus

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 07:08 AM

I drive through the Roundhill Tunnels into Folkestone on the A20 every morning.

 

Each time I do, I drive past a sign that specifically bans Invalid Carriages and motorcycles under 50cc.

 

It always raises a smile and reminds me of this thread.


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#3281 OFFLINE   dollywobbler

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 10:04 AM

Gave her a service. Well, changed the oil and checked the valve clearances - fine. Haven't got the right spark plugs it turns out, so I'll have to order some up.


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#3282 ONLINE   tooSavvy

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 12:05 PM

And at that pace, one Polish artic doing 78 past it to put it in a PULL UP! PULL UP! WHOOP WHOOP WHOOP TERRAIN! TERRAIN! kind of maneuver...
Phil


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#3283 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 01:33 PM

All invalid carriages were banned,inc the model 70,but as its now registered as a tricycle, legally you should be fine.

 

its true that invalid carriages where banned from motorways

 

but the Model 70 is not an invalid carriage, its an invalid tricycle and those where never banned from the motorway :) any invalid vehicle between 5CWT-10CWT is considered an invalid tricycle rather then an invalid carriage

 

(in terms of legislations, and licensing , an invalid tricycle was treated the same way any 3 wheeled car would be, its also why you do see period Photos of Model 70s with L plates, because the users where required to get a proper licence, even if the test was done very basically)

 

of course the question is how many people including the constabulary actually knew this, is why you sometimes heard stories of Model 70s being told to pull off the motorway back in the day, but there are other stories of People driving happily on motorways, including one Catholic father who drove his Model 70 from Newcastle to Lourdes and back!

 

 

its also worth mentioning, that the only thing on the V5 of a Model 70, that alludes to it being any sort of invalid tricycle, is the body type, "invalid vehicle"

 

a lot of current owners have incorrectly assumed or been told you have to change this from "invalid vehicle" to "tricycle" when this is NOT the case, all you have to change, is the tax class from Disable, to either Tricycle or Historic vehicle

 

(since all Model 70s are over 40 years old, they can all get lumped under the historic vehicle tax class, but before that legislation kicked in, you just changed the Tax class to tricycle, NOT the body type)

 

a fun tidbit, is the Invacar Mk10 was the last Invalid carriage, everything after that where invalid tricycles :)

 

 

(this does mean even Egg if he really wanted to could drive his Mk12 on the motorway LOL)


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#3284 OFFLINE   HarmonicCheeseburger

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Posted 08 April 2019 - 07:50 PM

Bonus marks for filming TWCs motorway run while screaming the whole way down. 


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#3285 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 08 April 2019 - 07:54 PM

Bonus marks for filming TWCs motorway run while screaming the whole way down. 

 

:mrgreen:

 

 

happy to see more reports of smooth running (and smooth flooring!) and she now has her AC badge (time to Gate crash an AC Cobra meet!)

 

considering this is exactly the sort of thing id be using mine for, glad to see she works well for doing so  :)

 

 

I look forward to the Mad dash across town at 70Mph for her first MOT  :)

 

"Hey dude I saw an Invacar screaming its way along the motorway today!"

 

"An Invacar?!"

 

"No it was the driver!"

 

:mrgreen:

 

in regards to body work repairs, any plans to neutralise the rust on the window frames? I hear that those are the weak spot of the Model 70 and have a bad habit of rusting out, so might be worth having a look at, same goes to DW and TWC  :)

 
I dont think TWCs latest video has been linked here, so here it is :)
 
 
I wonder if we will get a video on the servicing :)
 
grease points next? :)


#3286 OFFLINE   UltraWomble

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Posted 08 April 2019 - 08:26 PM

Be careful. Invalid carriages were specifically banned from motorways (see the big blue sign near the slip roads, along with tractors etc). I know that it is now taxed as a tricycle, but that does not alter what it is (taxing a lorry as an agricultural vehicle does not stop it being a LGV) so I think they are still banned from motorways by law.  At the very least it could be a long, time consuming and expensive court case.

Hes quite right you know...

 

 

Motorway_Ahead_%28IRL%29.PNG

 

however....

 

 

253
Prohibited vehicles. Motorways MUST NOT be used by pedestrians, holders of provisional motorcycle or car licences, riders of motorcycles under 50 cc, cyclists, horse riders, certain slow-moving vehicles and those carrying oversized loads (except by special permission), agricultural vehicles, and powered wheelchairs/powered mobility scooters (see Rules 36 to 46 inclusive).

From 4 June 2018 provisional licence holders may drive on the motorway if they are accompanied by an approved driving instructor and are driving a car displaying red L plates (D plates in Wales), that’s fitted with dual controls.

Laws HA 1980 sects 16, 17 & sch 4, MT(E&W)R regs 3(d), 4 & 11, MT(E&W)(A)R, R(S)A sects 7, 8 & sch 3, RTRA sects 17(2) & (3), & MT(S)R reg 10

 

So maybe.....


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#3287 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 08 April 2019 - 08:34 PM

as I have explained this above and in my own thread,

 

things get a bit confusing 

 

because if 3 things

 

the Model 70 is not an invalid carriage

 

and the fact the government at one point had 2 vehicle classes both called "Invalid carriage"

 

both invalid carriages classes are/where banned from the motorway

 

however

 

one refers to the original style invalid carriage like the early open frame 3 wheelers

 

Invacar-1953-Thundersley-4328-07.jpg

 

the other, is that the government officially refers to modern day "Mobility scooters" also as invalid carriages, but they have their own set of rules and classes, bellow is the rules for Old timey invalid carriages (I think modern day "invalid carriages" aka mobility scooters are limited to something like 110Kg)

 

 

 

 

  • "In this Act `invalid carriage' means a mechanically propelled vehicle the weight of which unladen does not exceed 254 kilograms and which is specifically designed and constructed, and not merely adapted, for the use of a person suffering from some physical defect or disability and is used solely by such a person".
 

 

 

and (its worth noting that the Model 70 specifically has 410Kg listed as its revenue weight on its V5, AFAIK normal cars dont have their revenue weight listed on the V5)

 

 

 

 If an invalid carriage exceeds 254 kg in unladen weight it will not be classified as an "invalid carriage" for the purposes of the RTA 1988, the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 (the "RTOA") and the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (the "RTRA") and of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 (SI 1986/1078) (the "Construction and use Regulations"). It will, instead be a motor car or, if it has less than four wheels and the weight does not exceed 410 kg, a motor cycle. 


#3288 ONLINE   adw1977

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 09:29 AM

So a Model 70 is classed as a motorcycle?
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#3289 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 05:09 PM

So a Model 70 is classed as a motorcycle?

 

technically I guess? LOL, for the stated road traffic act things at least



#3290 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 06:11 AM

while talking to a friend not of this parish about invacars

 

it got me thinking about the fact since the new pulley setup, TWC holds 3500RPM till 55Mph now instead of the normal 45Mph, what would TWCs theoretical top speed speed be, assuming a red line of 6300RPM

 

now a stock invacar has a reported top speed of 82Mph, at which the engine would be doing 6300RPM (if the engine is doing 3500RPM at 45Mph, which is final/max ratio,  so we can divide 3500 by 45 gets you the magic number of 77 (im not sure what this number would actually be called) so 82*77 gets me 6300RPM roughly)

 

 

now on TWC she holds 3500RPM until 55Mph so in this case we divide 3500 by 55 gets you a "magic number" of 63, so now if we do 6300RPM divided by 63,

 

we get a theoretical top speed of 100Mph LOL!

 

I have a feeling the engine would run out of puff before you got there (we only have 20 horse power on the best of days, and I dont think a Model 70 is exactly what you would call aerodynamic), but its hilarious to to think about a 100Mph Invacar  :mrgreen:



#3291 OFFLINE   MorrisItalSLX

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 06:44 AM

Does the speedo on an Invacar even go to 100mph?
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#3292 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 07:00 AM

Does the speedo on an Invacar even go to 100mph?

 

Nope  :mrgreen: (on goes up to 80, so even at 82Mph you would be off the scale just :) )

 

Screenshot 2019-04-10 at 07.53.04.png

 

 

 

it would be hilarious in court

 

a bit like the stories of people getting cought doing nearly 100Mph in a Bus/coach and it getting thrown out because the judge genuinely did not belive a Bus could do 98Mph or something :)


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#3293 OFFLINE   somewhatfoolish

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 07:58 AM

Prosaically it does not have enough power to get much beyond 70 mph, it may even have a lower absolute top speed than the standard gearing as the higher gearing may not let the engine rev out.


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post-9424-0-06631200-1530529320.jpg


#3294 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 08:48 AM

Prosaically it does not have enough power to get much beyond 70 mph, it may even have a lower absolute top speed that the standard gearing as the higher gearing may not let the engine rev out.

 

aye yeah, im not even 100% sure on the 82Mph claim, its a top speed iv seen thrown around a lot (but i have heard of at least 2 reports of Model 70s going even faster one doing 85, and another doing 90!) however I have not had anything actually verified first hand etc

 

and as evidently proven on the various invacar threads on this forum, what little information there is out there on these lean mean blue machines, can often not actually be the case or be skewed in someway or another

 

its one of the reasons im eager to see someone try a top speed run in a Model 70 :)

 

 

it would be much fun to throw some 650cc engine parts at a Model 70  :mrgreen:

 

(apparently one was built with a 650cc steyr puch engine to test the drive belt to destruction I bet whoever had to rag that round a test track to do so must of had some fun :) )



#3295 OFFLINE   dollywobbler

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 09:09 AM

Prosaically it does not have enough power to get much beyond 70 mph, it may even have a lower absolute top speed that the standard gearing as the higher gearing may not let the engine rev out.

 

That's certainly have it feels. She's no faster, just more relaxing - an overdrive will generally provide a lower top speed than the gear without, and some cars are fastest in fourth gear than fifth. If I could improve the aerodynamics, or slip stream a Merc Sprinter, then maybe more than 65 is possible. As it is, I don't think so.

 

Sadly, no servicing video. There simply wasn't time. Filming stuff makes it take about three times as long, and time is not something I have much of. Haven't touched the Fox for days!


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#3296 OFFLINE   Zelandeth

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 09:29 PM

One thing I'm curious about is whether closing off the area under the front service hatch would help both the overall aerodynamics and reduce the tendency for front end lift. It's something I've half a mind to investigate at some point, would quite like to have a small compartment up front I can stick a basic toolkit in and/or possibly stick the battery there to get a bit of weight there.

Hopefully I'll be able to confirm or deny TP's ability to do 70 before too much longer! Realistically though, 50 feels like where she's going to be happiest.
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#3297 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 11 April 2019 - 08:32 AM

 If I could improve the aerodynamics, or slip stream a Merc Sprinter, then maybe more than 65 is possible. As it is, I don't think so.

 

what something like this?  :mrgreen:

 

8558460260_2a4a8ba3c9_o.jpg

 

https://www.flickr.c...N06/8558460260/


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#3298 OFFLINE   Peter C

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Posted 11 April 2019 - 04:49 PM

F13261F3-1ECE-402A-BE35-03C0C5307C4F.jpeg
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#3299 ONLINE   LightBulbFun

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Posted 12 April 2019 - 01:08 AM

 

hah yeah iv seen that a few times, :)

 

heres a higher rez version with fewer compression artefacts :)

 

invacar1.jpg
 
(id love to know where this thing originated from exactly and if any other such brochures etc exist for the Model 70)






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