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Rupert The Stag - Seat refurb page5


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144 replies to this topic

#61 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 04:56 PM

I am going to disagree regards the Stag Distributor, its actually one of the few things on the car that does exactly what it is supposed to do. :D

 

Shaft wear and dwell angle shenanigans happens to any distributor of age. easily fixed. I cannot see how Stuck bob weighs could cause anything to grenade   :? My 40+ year old dissy misbehaved a couple of years back on a trip to Lemons, crap that had dropped off the inside of the cap fouled one of the bobweights but nothing exploded or anything. the ignition timing was a bit all over the place which did cause a lack of performance and contributed to some hot running issues, I didnt bother rebuilding the dizzy myself because for a tinsey bit more than the cost of the bits I bought a recon unit from a chap inside the stag owners club

 

Yes the rotor and distributor cap are shared with Rolls Royce and the venerable Rover V8.

 

The distributor and water pump are driven by a jack shaft from the LH cam chain. on the bottom of the distributor shaft is a gear and hole for the hex drive to the oil pump.

 

The issues thaat do exist on the traditional Stag Distributor are all around the twin point setup and getting them right and maintaining them. Not worth the bother anymore though as something like a pertronix system which replaces everything including the baseplate + it can accomodate wear in the shaft bushes too :8

 

Re engine changes a chap in SOC is busy fitting a lexus v8. others have rovers etc. 

Alas none make the noise the stag engine makes, plus being a bit shit endears it to me :D


  • Nibblet likes this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#62 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 05:27 PM

2014 was a quiet year for the stag, didnt do too many miles in it as my MOT mileage history shows

 

20150522_190437.jpg

 

I vowed to get a bit closer to the 5000 mile limit my insurance company offers.

 

First up Get the car ready for its MOT, only issue I can find is mysterious play in the steering column. Stag being a posh car has inny/outey/uppey/downey steering column.

 

The play coincided with these bit appearing in the drivers footwell

20150509_165820.jpg

 

Removal of the column is a two bolt and two pinch bolt affair. along with 3 harness plugs

20150510_131805.jpg

 

I have the slight added complication of having an immobiliser installed near the ignition switch, but nothing I cannot get around

20150510_133607.jpg

 

Although complex to look at it breaks down into the steering shaft which runs down inside an inner and outer casing and the upper bearing mount

20150510_142120.jpg

 

cleaned up and painted

20150510_161502.jpg

 

The bits in the footwell were parts of two plastic rings that sit between the inner and outer casing allowing the column to extend but not cause play in the column itself

20150516_144103.jpg

 

and all back together, in my haste I probably should have let the paint cure for 2 weeks as it is all stuck solid now lol. still i dont need to adjust the steering for me as it is perfect

20150516_153010.jpg

 


  • alf892, Magnificent Rustbucket and Coprolalia like this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#63 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 05:36 PM

MoT passed without complaint, Allowed me to face my nemesis! the South Molton Vintage Rally no less

 

Journey down was most pleasant, the show was good fun again, steam, classic cars, sheepdog trials, tractor crawling and North Devon beer

 

20150530_105210.jpg

 

Alas on the way home I noticed that the Vomiter (voltimeter) was reading off the top end of the scale. Hmmm that isnt good, then it was ok for a few miles then it did it again. fucking hell

 

I stopped and used my multimeter but when ever I did the alternator and vomiter were reading normal. So I just drove it home.

 

Next day at home started it up with the multimeter across the battery terminals and it flicked up to 16.5v before dropping back down to 14.1 after 30 seconds or so. 

 

New alternator bought and fitted, the old one is on the shelf waiting for a clean, brushes and a new regulator pack

20150603_172401.jpg

 

New alternator location is easier but does mean that the highlevel expansion tank needs to be moved

20150603_174607.jpg

 

Quick test and happy days

20150603_174853.jpg

 

Next stop Bromley Pageant of Motoring to get on the SOC stand


  • Magnificent Rustbucket and Coprolalia like this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#64 OFFLINE   The Reverend Bluejeans

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:06 PM

I am going to disagree regards the Stag Distributor, its actually one of the few things on the car that does exactly what it is supposed to do. :D

 

Shaft wear and dwell angle shenanigans happens to any distributor of age. easily fixed. I cannot see how Stuck bob weighs could cause anything to grenade   :? My 40+ year old dissy misbehaved a couple of years back on a trip to Lemons, crap that had dropped off the inside of the cap fouled one of the bobweights but nothing exploded or anything. the ignition timing was a bit all over the place which did cause a lack of performance and contributed to some hot running issues, I didnt bother rebuilding the dizzy myself because for a tinsey bit more than the cost of the bits I bought a recon unit from a chap inside the stag owners club

 

Yes the rotor and distributor cap are shared with Rolls Royce and the venerable Rover V8.

 

The distributor and water pump are driven by a jack shaft from the LH cam chain. on the bottom of the distributor shaft is a gear and hole for the hex drive to the oil pump.

 

The issues thaat do exist on the traditional Stag Distributor are all around the twin point setup and getting them right and maintaining them. Not worth the bother anymore though as something like a pertronix system which replaces everything including the baseplate + it can accomodate wear in the shaft bushes too :8

 

Re engine changes a chap in SOC is busy fitting a lexus v8. others have rovers etc. 

Alas none make the noise the stag engine makes, plus being a bit shit endears it to me :D

 

 

The issue was: you'd give it some welly, the robertweights would fling out - and stay there. At low rpm under load the timing would be massively over advanced past the point of pinking and pop a piston.

Shaft wear was very common and the first job on a Stag was to ditch the point and fit Lumenition.


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Autoshite. It's like Pistonheads...but without the wankers.

 

 

 

MASTER RACE MOTORS.

 

1989 F  730i. Prestigious.

1999 S  E36 318i Touring. Daily shitter.

1994 M 318Ti - Track whore

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


#65 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:07 PM

Bromley is a show that I last went to in the late 1980s, displaying my 105E where decided to buy a Stag and joined the Stag owners club. so we have history. There was also one reason why I didnt bother going again and that is down to the horrific traffic.

 

Never mind, cant still be that bad 25 years on can it?!?

 

SOC were give specific instructions to enter via the back gate as the stand was right next to it and we would be allowed access. sadly no one told the giffer on the gate, even though we could see the fucking stand "none shall pass" was the resolute response.

 

I then sat in traffic for a little under 2 hours in increasing heat to travel just under 2 miles to the main gate. I should have just turned around and fucked off home again. All was well initially but then I developed some cooling / heat related issues that were to plague me for the next couple of weeks!

 

My Stag has an uprated Radiator (Supergill) core, standard viscous cooling fan and the header tank. The temp gauge at this point was the original electric affair which struggles sometimes to match itself to the sender properly, there is a voltage Stabiliser that keeps the voltage stable for the fuel and water temp gauges. The car has a standard 20lb cap fitted which means that the pressurised boiling point is around 130degrees centigrade. Does mean that wear and tear on cooling hoses is higher than normal for a Triumph V8 and the hoses absolutely must be reinforced but it works.

 

In summer I am used to my car running at just about 1/2 on the gauge around town, climbing to 2/3 on a brisk motorway run and very occasionally getting to within a needle width of the dreaded red on exiting a motorway, it quickly works its way back down to the 1/2 mark after a few miles of a roads. It has never been into the red.

 

So queuing for an hour and all was well, then into the second hour the temp gauge starts to climb, didnt expect that so I lifted the bonnet on one of the many stationary for 5 minutes bits and all seems well. I am reluctant to switch off the engine because then the hot coolant will stop circulating so I keep it burbling. The gauge is now right up and on the red, the top hose is tight but not bulging and the pressure cap is leak free. At this point I convinced myself that the recent alternator failure fried the voltage stabiliser than feeds voltage to the temp gauge. Still as a precaution I had the heater going flat out and turned up the idle speed to just over 1000rpm, the water pump is not very efficient at 600rpm. Whether or not these measures made any difference I got onto the club stand eventually. I had passed many other cars that had expired on the way in but was by no means complacent.

 

The show and cars on display was good, the autojumble was shit, full of new cheap tat and no piles of old car bits to pour over, thus I was unable to secure a mechanical gauge nor a voltage stabiliser.

 

20150607_141635.jpg

 

I bought one of these which I filled with tap water and sprayed in the air to keep me nice and cool

20150607_141640.jpg

 

P6072462.JPG

 

I left the show later that day, it was a scorcher! Drove home with no real traffic except that the temp gauge sat at a needle width under the red all the way home. Doesn't help the old sphincter.

 

When back at home, I checked the ignition timing, the viscous fan for play, replaced the temp sender in the head, the voltage regulator and check all the wiring out for damage from the alternator. All seemed ok

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


  • alf892 and Magnificent Rustbucket like this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#66 OFFLINE   The Reverend Bluejeans

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:10 PM

MoT passed without complaint, Allowed me to face my nemesis! the South Molton Vintage Rally no less

 

Journey down was most pleasant, the show was good fun again, steam

 

"Them Stags were always over'eating"

 

See what I did there?

 

 

Great thread though. We truly are not worthy. 


  • richardthestag and Magnificent Rustbucket like this

Autoshite. It's like Pistonheads...but without the wankers.

 

 

 

MASTER RACE MOTORS.

 

1989 F  730i. Prestigious.

1999 S  E36 318i Touring. Daily shitter.

1994 M 318Ti - Track whore

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


#67 OFFLINE   The Reverend Bluejeans

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:19 PM

Has anyone ever tried to re-engineer the Stag motor? I was thinking a steel crank with big journals, modern lightweight rods and pistons, electric water pump down the side of the block, better timing chains, tensioners and sprockets etc? 

 

Have you an electric fan on yours?


Autoshite. It's like Pistonheads...but without the wankers.

 

 

 

MASTER RACE MOTORS.

 

1989 F  730i. Prestigious.

1999 S  E36 318i Touring. Daily shitter.

1994 M 318Ti - Track whore

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


#68 OFFLINE   Asimo

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:37 PM

Great write-up.
So glad I never wanted a Stag!, worrying about that water pump arangement in my Triumph engined SaaB was quite enough.

I always thought Triumph should have used the Daimler V8, an engine I have never heard anything bad about.
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#69 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:46 PM

Next outing was to LeMans. oh yes

 

Drove to my mate Adrian's house where I stayed over night ready for getting up at sparrows fart next morning. M25 was busy and the temp gauge did its thing of unnerving me running right on the red. arghhhhh. checked it over at Adrians and we agreed that it didnt feel that hot.

 

Next morning set off for Dover and a quick breakie fuelled crossing to Calais.

 

20150611_054538.jpg

 

80 miles south of Calais and the gauge is again pissing me orf. The car runs at 3/4 on the gauge when I am doing less that 2500 RPM and climbs upto the edge of the red very quickly at higher engine speeds. Not a huge disaster as I can maintain a 70mph dash, Thinking about shit the viscous cooling fan is largely redundant at these sort of speeds so I conclude that the most likely cause is ignition timing.

 

I stop at an aire and the car spits water as I pull to a stop. confirming yes it is running hot

Did a roadside dissy baseplate removal and found two issues.

 

This crud was jamming up the bobweights and even though the engine wasnt pinking and didnt explode etc ;) they were not helping, thermostat was also removed and replaced with a spare that I had.

20150611_220256.jpg

 

I guess that they have come from the inside of any of the distributor caps that have been on the car over the last 40 or so years

 

the second issue, I had a Piranha Electronic ignition system. It sits on its own baseplate and the vacuum advance moves the optical sender back and forth on the base plate. only mine was sticky, had worn a ridge. I loosened the securing screws a tinsey bit and lubed it using the dipstick and popped it all back together in 30 degrees and on a very hot engine it was not a pleasant job. 

 

Back on the peage and at speed the gauge is reading half, fuck yeah. Got to Rouen and stopped for fuel. I would expect the gauge to be up next to the red on restarting and drop quickly back down only this time it didnt. another bastard ignition strip down at the roadside. 

 

this made no difference, the temp was controllable by engine speed so I kept to 2500 rpm and coasted down the long hills on the run south.

 

Get to le Mans exit and waiting for some twat do get through the telepeage my gauge was doing this

 

20150611_162713.jpg

 

Still no sign it was anything other that a bit warm on a 30 degree + day I pushed on. 

 

We were late so got caught up in Le mans rush hour and sat for about an hour before the inevitable happened and it shat all its coolant and overheated. I could see the back of the main finish grandstands but we were stationary!

 

Let things cool down properly and then refilled with finest bottled water that we had recently bought on our beer run into the circuit. It started up again and ran fine but the gauge quickly found its way up to the edge of the red again. Losing any remaining sense of humour that I might have I just ignored it and pushed on to the Beausejour (oh the irony) campsite, found the lads who had reserved our pitch and settled in for a number of beers with my back to the car

 

next morning Adrian and the lads were trying to get enthusiasm in me up while I enjoyed my morning stubbie

 

We kind of got talking around ignition but that it wasnt pinking made us suspicious, then we talked about coolant flow etc and before you know it I was pulling stuff apart, the distributoir came apart so we could sort the sticky optic and thus failing vacuum advance, I also found on removing the vacuum advance that although it wasn't punctured it didnt move very far. We boiled it up in a pan and used wd40 to get things moving better but still not great. The bobweights were declared fit for purpose.

 

the rad was removed and Adrian found all this turkish delight in it

 

20150612_113928.jpg

20150612_113931.jpg

 

He went mad boiling water up and back flushing it but no more came out, I subsequently found out that this is what steelseal does, I used it on my original 2013 HGF and thought that I had flushed it all out arghh so that was the input side of the rad compromised then. The thermostat was tested against a spare that I had in a pan of boiling water and while we didnt have a thermometer both opened at the same time

 

20150612_113935.jpg

 

20150612_113943.jpg

 

More beer was consumed and we became a bit of site legend field stripping a triumph V8

 

Probably due to beer consumption I managed to snap one blade of the optical chopper in the distributor arghhhh 

 

Matt who was camping with us came up with this fix, yep that is Stella tin 

20150615_123557.jpg

 

Drive home was done without stopping, the gauge was more controlled 3/4 but still higher than I am used to.

 

Further investigation required

 

 

Attached Images

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  • Magnificent Rustbucket, Nibblet and Coprolalia like this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#70 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:55 PM

Has anyone ever tried to re-engineer the Stag motor? I was thinking a steel crank with big journals, modern lightweight rods and pistons, electric water pump down the side of the block, better timing chains, tensioners and sprockets etc? 

 

Have you an electric fan on yours?

 

Tony Hart of HRS has raced a couple of stags, one of them was a monster and the other more of a touring car. They can do it..

 

hrs1.jpg

 

hrs2.jpg

 

hrs3.jpg

 

hrs4.jpg

 

hrs5.jpg

 

hrs6.jpg

 

I have just fitted German chains to mine which are a kind of fit and forget, well until you need to replace all the bearing shells again that is, the journal issue is not so much the diameter as the width, and short of building a new longer stag v8 that wont work.

 

There is a chappy on the stag owners forum who is messing with leccy water pumps, could evenbuy a kit from him for mucho wonga, but they make me just as nervous to be honest. I am looking at getting a small central heating hall sensor on the main pipe into the water pump that could maybe light up should coolant flow stop. Any car can have a failure of the waterpump just the stag seems to be famous for it.

 

I did have an electric fan but it blocked off a big chunk of the forward face of the rad so for me it didnt work, the viscous fan is also needed to blow coolish air over the top of the engines and keep the carb temp down, a little. I have fitted a spoiler to mine now which dramatically helps with motorway speed cooling. Something that the Stag engine has always suffered from


  • Magnificent Rustbucket likes this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#71 OFFLINE   The Reverend Bluejeans

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:58 PM

A couple of things:

 

engines overheat when the timing is retarded too, especially at speed. Also, be wary of 'uprated' radiators. You used to be able to buy an 'uprated' four core rad for Minis and they were utter shit. Why? Because the inner two cores could't dissipate heat. It was found that a rad with two fat cores was much better.


  • richardthestag, Magnificent Rustbucket and Nibblet like this

Autoshite. It's like Pistonheads...but without the wankers.

 

 

 

MASTER RACE MOTORS.

 

1989 F  730i. Prestigious.

1999 S  E36 318i Touring. Daily shitter.

1994 M 318Ti - Track whore

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Thanked by 1 Member:
richardthestag

#72 OFFLINE   The Reverend Bluejeans

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 07:19 PM

Regarding the Stag crank - the big end journals are 1.75 inches in diameter, when a Ford Xflow bearings were 2 inches. At 3/4" wide they're narrow for sure. I inherited a very good book (The design and tuning of competition engines by Philip H Smith, 1971) from my Dad and there's a section about the Stag V8:

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  • richardthestag, Magnificent Rustbucket, Asimo and 2 others like this

Autoshite. It's like Pistonheads...but without the wankers.

 

 

 

MASTER RACE MOTORS.

 

1989 F  730i. Prestigious.

1999 S  E36 318i Touring. Daily shitter.

1994 M 318Ti - Track whore

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Thanked by 1 Member:
richardthestag

#73 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 07:22 PM

After LeMans and filled with enthusiasm I needed to fix a couple of things. First the RH Exhaust was blowing.

 

Thought it was the downpipe gasket - 

20150617_181703.jpg

 

On removing it showed very clear signs of blowage

20150617_183834.jpg

 

All a bit tight on the RH pipe because of oil filter which has to be removed to allow access, steering and oil pump

20150617_185813.jpg

 

Did it fix it? Did it fuck

Next removed the manifold from the head which is a right arse ache, everything is in the way

20150619_173116.jpg

 

Ok gasket looks knackered. must have been hot running that did that

20150617_194452.jpg

 

then just before putting it all together again I noticed this.

20150617_195912.jpg

 

another manifold was found in the man cave, studs moved about and itb was fitted

20150619_172037.jpg

 

Nice quiet blow free manifold again

 

One job fixed, next up ignition

 

My distributor was probably original to the car, when I first got the car it had its factory supplied engine, I moved ancillaries onto the rebuilt engine and have never really touched the dissy aside from a dot of oil and piranha ignition install years ago.

 

Old unit needed a new vacuum advance module, needed the ilectronic ignition renewing, I think I had my moneys worth out of the old Piranha and I could not get a chopper for love nor money. The shaft had slight play and so...

20150620_160902.jpg

 

I bought a recon unit for not much more than the cost of the parts, included were shit cap and rotor which I sent back with the old dissy to partly cover the fact that the original stag base-plate was missing.

20150619_112749.jpg

 

The dissy included an accuspark ignition module just wire it up to the coil and away you go

20150619_112804.jpg

 

install was easy and ignition timing is now consistent and correct

20150620_162049.jpg

 

Did it help with the cooling issue?

20150629_183802.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

  • danthecapriman and Magnificent Rustbucket like this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#74 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 07:30 PM

A couple of things:

 

engines overheat when the timing is retarded too, especially at speed. Also, be wary of 'uprated' radiators. You used to be able to buy an 'uprated' four core rad for Minis and they were utter shit. Why? Because the inner two cores could't dissipate heat. It was found that a rad with two fat cores was much better.

 

the stag "supergill" was developed by the chap who made the race car, there are some super fat rads on the market and I agree with you on those. this rad is the same dimensions at the original but packs more viens for coolant across the surface. when it isnt bunged up with turkish delight is has been good.

 

And being too retarded at speed I think was a symptom of my sticky base plate and prehistoric and stiff vacuum advance unit. That has now been replaced :D

 

the book makes for an interesting read


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#75 OFFLINE   The Reverend Bluejeans

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 07:39 PM

Good stuff. Have you tried a modern accurate temp gauge?

 

I noticed your has a Coventry NRW number - would be interesting to get old logbook copies from DVLA to see where it's been.

 

June 24th (?) this year - 40 years since the last Stag. Will there be an event?


Autoshite. It's like Pistonheads...but without the wankers.

 

 

 

MASTER RACE MOTORS.

 

1989 F  730i. Prestigious.

1999 S  E36 318i Touring. Daily shitter.

1994 M 318Ti - Track whore

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


#76 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 07:58 PM

next up in July 2015 was to back flush the cooling system to make sure all that turkish delight was gone. no more came out

 

I run the engine like this on a forward flush for 30-45mins and then back flush it for 30 mins once a year, the water always comes through clear

20150620_135131.jpg

 

I bought myself an infrared thermometer which I used to check against the gauge reading

 

Nice warm day

1.jpg

 

After a brief run the temp gauge looks like this, bearing in mind for a 20lb pressurised system to boil I would expect the temp to be 130 degrees c

2.jpg

 

At the back of the LH head - the hottest point on the engine

3.jpg

 

At the rad top hose

4.jpg

 

at the rad bottom hose

5.jpg

 

at the air sucking through the rad

6.jpg

 

Conclusions

1. my temp gauge is over reading at certain operating conditions. It is controlled by a sender in the LH head (the hottest point on the engine) but is notorious these days to be tricky to get the right sender

2. there is a lot of heat milling about between the radiator and the engine that I would have thought the fan would move away quickly.

 

I bought a new temp gauge sender from one of the topstar dealers, only it wouldnt fit into the adapter plate on my head because it had been modified to take a mechanical gauge capillary.

20150712_125453.jpg

 

Back to square one on that then

 

I also bought a cheap electric fan to give the viscous fan a boost. it is still on the shelf

20150712_145042.jpg

 

To check the viscous fan you grib the blade and try to spin it 1/4 to 1/3rd spin is pass anything over 1/2 spin is bad. Mine was around the 1/3 mark so I ignored it. until one day when it was all hot and bothered I gave it a spin and it when right round! one full revolution. so the viscous fan is dead

 

Fitting a new one aside from the wallet emptying feeling is a case of removing the radiator and the crank pulley bolt. New fan fitted and filled up and it is better but still 2/3rd up on the temp gauge. It was a nice hot summer though.

 

I installed a mechanical gauge which told me that the engine was running normally at about 80 degrees ( I have an 82 thermostat fitted) so that is about right. However on a motorway it would run at 105 degrees. there is some margin but on a hot day I think it can do better. Ignition is now spot on, so why is the rad not cooling.

 

this is probably right at the pinnacle of the header tank debate on SOC forum.

 

Looking at the layout myself again I concluded that it is entirely possibly that when the water pump sucks, the slightly easier path could be directly from the header tank which is replenished by the top rad hose, thus a chunk of the coolant is never passing through the rad.

 

in a eureka type moment I stuffed a dowel in the header tank top hose and clamped it with a jubilee clip and low and behold the car is back to 80-90degrees again. Who ever said improving things always works arghhhhhhh

20150913_164250.jpg

 

So in conclusion

I did have ignition issues

I did have cooling fan issues

I did have a bunged up radiator

The header tank plumbing comprimised the radiator efficiency so is now a high level expansion tank with a coolant level warning light

 

All combined to the overall hot running issue


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#77 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:02 PM

Good stuff. Have you tried a modern accurate temp gauge?

 

I noticed your has a Coventry NRW number - would be interesting to get old logbook copies from DVLA to see where it's been.

 

June 24th (?) this year - 40 years since the last Stag. Will there be an event?

 

It was factory registered under the home delivery export scheme. The car was sold out of the Hong Kong Dealership and little of the behind the dash wiring matches domestic models, it does however match the Post LD2001 export diagrams though

 

I have details of all the owners and the heritage certificate

 

First Owner was a Patrick J Palmer who worked for Ogilvy Mather (Marketing company) and live it Roehampton, He had it 3 years before selling it on.

 

Not sure about 24 june this year but 40 years since end of production needs to be remembered if only for the massive missed opportunity;-) 


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#78 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 09:11 PM

Chuffed that I hadn#'t spent the entire summer chasing the above issue I pampered the new set of seats, the tomcat seats no longer allowed for my growing kids to fit in the back to I reverted back to the original back seat.

 

After trying all sorts of shampoo and vinyl cleaners that I had on the shelf in the garage I tried this stuff!

20150913_144757.jpg

 

Working it into the grain and basketweave and then wiping it over with a dry cloth gave amazing results for free

20150913_144803.jpg

 

20150913_144809.jpg

 

20150913_150215.jpg

 

20150913_152957.jpg

 

Just need to refoam those front seats and the interior will be back to standard again

20150913_164234.jpg


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Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

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#79 OFFLINE   alfetta

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 09:59 PM

my next door neighbour has one. it broke doen 22 years ago and has remained in the garage ever since - with piles of ever increasing junk on top .lol



#80 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 08:05 AM

my next door neighbour has one. it broke doen 22 years ago and has remained in the garage ever since - with piles of ever increasing junk on top .lol

 

there are quite a few like that appearing as "holyshitanovabranfind" on ebay covered in dust but with the tyres pumped, up selling to hopeless romantics who think a quick sponge down and it will be motoring off into the sunset :)

 

The viable (might see the open road again) projects used to be £750 to a bag a pop until a couple of years ago. now they seem to be over £3k + I have seen 10 yard restoration projects with no MOT go for over £4k! 

 

You can still buy a complete shed for £500 but they are normally for spares / driveway ornaments only

 

With so many broken for parts over the years or just dissolved away supply is just about level with demand, hence a recent price increase.

 

A new wave of owners will fall for their charm and sounds :D


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#81 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 11:15 AM

From what I have written so far it seems like the snag is a right ballsache to own. Bear in mind that the above is a summary of the first 20odd years of ownership :D

 

True that being handy with spanners helps and a little mechanical sympathy definitely averts disaster but the Stag today is nowhere near as bad as legend may have it. I have highlighted in this thread some of the lowpoints which are largely centred around known issues with the design and poor quality parts

 

Known issues are better understood nowadays and various fixes and workaround are shared. BUT by far the biggest issue is spotting the "reputable" sellers retailing cheap crap at OEM prices, lulls the owner into a false sense of quality security!

 

Happens a lot in Land Rover Circles too so not a problem that is isolated to the Stag.

 

As a general rule I don't buy any new part from ebay unless it is being sold by one of two sellers that I know pride themselves on a reputation of not selling crap.

 

Then there are traders that I know are good and others that I know will sell you anything!

 

There are big quality problems with the longevity of anything that contains a rubber component, bushes, boots, gaiters etc

 

There can be issues with just about anything that is re manufactured, most of this is done at a cost the customer is prepared to pay and therewithin lies the issue!

SOCTFL are picking up speed on reproducing long obsolete parts at the very best quality. For instance their body repair panels are high quality and accurate, but they are not the cheapest. Folk still buy the cheapest and then moan like hell that it took the bodyshop days to adjust it to fit. SOCTFL are an independent company but because of ^ mentality they cannot risk their business by manufacturing everything needed, they concentrate their efforts on where they can make a positive impact and of course a profit. There are other UK businesses that do the same.

 

So if I do need a part I research it, unfortunately SOC Forum is very very risk averse and so doesnt allow members to warn each other of poor quality crap!! doesnt really help does it. 

 

If possible I try to buy new or used old stock and then recondition it myself. I have a shed full of bits of Stag.

 

Should I need to buy cooling hoses, or fuel line ebay is the very last place I would look! too much fake product is available and the cost of failure is high, two recent car fires in SOC were down to fuel line not being made to the right spec. I had a top hose burst very early in my ownership because it looked like it was reinforced but wasnt. It burst just after I switched off the engine so no damage, had that happened on the motorway then real engine damage would have resulted.

 

Scary stories over, for every hour of strife I have with my Stag I enjoy many hundreds more. I personally enjoy repairing and maintaining it. I dont enjoy when poor quality lets me down and I end up doing things twice.

 

In what is now my 23rd year of ownership the car has only FTP'd and been towed home once :( I have covered 36,000 largely very enjoyable miles in it. :8 Every time that I make up my mind to sell it I drive it and fall for its charms again, it was so close to being traded against a very tidy XJ12C 3 years ago, just driving the stag 5 miles to go and view the Jag changed my mild


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#82 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 07:23 PM

2016 By comparison was a very quiet year. :D

 

Some posing with the Hardtop fitted. they dont normally come with a vinyl roof but I like it. stainless trim has been removed because I am looking to restore the hardtop. it is not hanging so to speak but could definitely do with some attention for the 2 months a year that it sits on the car, 10 months of the year it is strapped to the garage wall

 

20160403_143956.jpg

 

20160403_144008.jpg

 

20160403_144014.jpg

 

20160403_144031.jpg

 

20160403_144034.jpg

 

I dont have many pics of it without oily handprints all over it / the lens, mainly because when it is not being fixed I am too busy enjoying it to take pics

 

Spring 2016 and off out for a run so off comes the hardtop

 

20160403_144405.jpg

 

20160403_144421.jpg

 

20160403_144435.jpg

 

alas the cheapo 21century accuspark ignition module let me down, damn it!

 

My only ever official FTP in this car

 

20160403_163138.jpg

 

20160403_163723.jpg

 

No spark was the instant diagnosis, thus cheap ignition module was the culprit. 

 

After dragging me unceremoniously home I set about buying a reassuringly expensive Pertronix Ignitor and powered up coil. This was fitted easily in an afternoon, the old accuspark was installed on a stag dissy baseplate so I set up an old set of points and condensor on the baseplate and keep that in the dash just incase I get a repeat.

 

The verdict on the Pertronix is OMG why did I not do this years ago. no ballast resistor, a powerful coil and decent ignition module and I have unleashed power out of this car that I have never experienced before. 

 

Now I dont poodle around but then nor do I boy it up at every opportunity but I have had to change my driving style as it is keener now to light up one of the back tyres given the slightest provocation :8

 

 

 

 

 

 


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#83 OFFLINE   Rusty Sills

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 07:31 PM

I actually think I prefer a stag with the hardtop.
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#84 OFFLINE   danthecapriman

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 08:03 PM

I bought an Accuspark kit for my Mercury, listed as suitable for all Ford V8's with single points set ups. It didn't work or even fit properly!
Then I did as you have and bought a Pertronix kit. More expensive, but the fit and quality was miles better and it worked brilliantly. Well worth paying extra for imho.
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#85 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 09:02 PM

The only other thing I did in 2016 was to fit a spoiler.

 

Mainly to keep the coolant temp down on mega hot days while at Audi bothering speeds on the motorways. 

 

Stag spoilers normally look like this

 

IMG_9098-1.jpg

 

If you are really unlucky you can look like this

 

RS1416.jpg

 

The issue is that airflow that goes over the top of the bumper hits the rad but if it goes under the bumper there is a high probability that it will just continue under the car rather than through the opening under the bumper.

 

Folk have tried all sorts, even removing the front number plate plinth and angling the number plate to try get more air through the holes below the bumper

 

All ugly solutions.

 

Here is mine

 

can you see it?

20160515_174840.jpg

 

yet?

20160515_174846.jpg

 

come on 

20160515_174858.jpg

 

Spotted it almost by accident, even though I know it exists it is a bastard to find

 

It is called secret spolier and supplied by Peter at LDPart - one of the better stag suppliers.

 

The design assumes that a chunk of air that goes over the front bumper is sucked down by the void / low pressure under the front bumper. seems to make for a logical argument. Although I could have proven with it a lump of card I chose to get out the credit card and buy the product from the chap who markets it. it was cheap enough.

 

Device is see through perspex and mounts horizontally between the inside of the front bumper and the grill. theory is more of the air that goes over the bumper is forced onto the radiator!

 

Fits in 5 mins, cannot be seen and seems so far to be very effective.

 

Another trick i did to help high speed cooling is to restrict the air clow around the edges of the radiator. see the rubber draft excluder that I installed down both side of the rad.

 

20160515_174524.jpg

 

20160515_174535.jpg

 

This further control the cooling. Most of last year when I did get onto motorways (and 2016 was a bastard for depression which I aint going into here) is was fackin marvellous. max temp on the mechanical gauge was 95 degrees c. In electric gauge terms that would be a needle width over middle rather than 2/3 which it used to run at.

 

simple success

 

 

 

 


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Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

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#86 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 09:22 PM

I last used the car in sept 2016 and it sat in the garage softtop down all winter. the last time I drove it the overdrive solenoid would not always disengage. it did when things cooled down but not ideal when it part disengages and vibration comes up through the gearbox.  I was way too fucked off to do anything about it then. I am in a better frame of mind now :D

 

I dragged the car out of the Garage beginning  April this year. needs a monster clean all over

 

As I left it :( it looks a lot cleaner than it was, bumpers were covered in rust stains, the entire body was covered in dust and crap

20170407_170234.jpg

 

I pulled it out so I could check over fluids and get it started up carefully

20170407_170409.jpg

 

mouldtacular, babywipes cleaned most of it up

20170407_170418.jpg

 

cat and mouse prints

20170407_170427.jpg

 

this is where Ivy sap that has broken through into the garage has damaged the paint. I clayed it back and think I managed to retrieve the shine

20170407_170434.jpg

 

I got underneath to replace the solenoid, very simple electric solenoid that changes the path of the oil in the overdrive to engage / disengage

I found a crowsfoot that fits the overdrive nut as access is tight

20170407_170634.jpg

 

got it up nice and high, I need to persuade Mrs Thestag to let me have a concrete hardstanding to work on. Driveway gravel is a pita in many ways

20170407_171030.jpg

 

There is it, the black cylinder on the top right of the piccy

20170407_171711.jpg

 

here is my 1/2 drive ratchet on the crowsfoot on the old solenoid. 

20170407_172513.jpg

 

If I were to do it again I would remove the gearbox cross member for access. this was one of those job where you think you are 75% and convince yourself that it is almost done, then battle for 45 mins to get the electric connections back on the new overdrive.

 

Anyway with the new unit in place, first test drive of 2017 was called for. behaved perfectly.

 

After an initial test run I took it around the M25 to see mate Adrian ex owner for e46 bimmer. The tyres are aging so I was cautious but it went very well indeed. So miss driving this car. Driving home at speed, at dusk, just listening to the exhaust. twas what this thing was made for.

 

 

 

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Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#87 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 09:51 PM

next job for the spring was to change the standard timing chains for "improved" German chains. Standard JWIS chains stretch through their life and when they start rattling they need changing, this can be anything from 20k miles upward. My drivers side chain rattles on start up which pisses me off as I only installed the bastard in 2013. Still I can fix that sump gasket leak while I am at it, oh and back flush the radiator.

 

German chains are prestretched but are better quality and the assumption is that they outlive the life of the crank bearings, so become an engine rebuild item rather than a service item.

 

First step, remove bonnet - a two man job, bonnet goes upside down on softtop for parts storage

20170414_120341.jpg

 

Here is the Germain chain kit, less the sprockets which I am sure are fine on my car

20170414_120417.jpg

 

With bonnet off access is good but a lot to remove

20170414_121219.jpg

 

Inlet pipes and airfilter come off with 6 bolts to the carb throats

20170414_121516.jpg

 

Siphoned coolant out 

20170414_122828.jpg

 

Alternator and Power steering pump off

20170414_125850.jpg

 

followed by cam covers and find the engine over to top dead centre on cylinder #2 (anomaly of Stag V8)

20170414_131633.jpg

 

The cam sprockets are secured with two bolts and lock tabs, the nearside cam lower bolt is a pita to get to at TDC so undo it first, then get to TDC

20170414_132354.jpg

 

next off comes the front pulley and viscous fan. put the car in 4th gear and handbrake on was enough to get the breaker bar to undo. Alternatively a suitable helper with their foot on the footbrake and the car in gear else a windy gun 

 

Timing cover comes off with a dozen bolts, to show two chains and their tensioners, RH tensioner is out quite a lot so either i messed up on install or the chain has prematurely stretched

20170414_140916.jpg

 

RH chain removed which leaves that LH chain, also runs the jack shaft which operates the distributor and waterpump

20170414_141636.jpg

 

All gone,

20170414_142527.jpg

 

All my chain guides were perfect except for the upper LH chain guide, no idea why the chain has gouged a lump out but worrying. the sprockets are all in alignment. and the guides were all new in 2013

20170414_144603.jpg

 

The longer of the two chains 106 links goes on the LH

20170414_144653.jpg

 

Make sure the cam and crank remain at TDC, set up everything and then with the tensioner in place and a 1mm feeler gauge between shoe and chain, adjust the upper guide and tighten it up. this maintains the chain tension

20170414_151406.jpg

 

fit the top cam sprocket bolt, you cannot fit the bottom until the engine winds over, you cant do that until the other chain is done. dont forget it though ;)

20170414_151927.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 


  • danthecapriman, Honey Badger and Coprolalia like this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#88 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 10:12 PM

RH chain fits in pretty much the same way but you may need to rotate the cam 1/2 a tooth to get the chain to fit correctly.

 

20170414_155243.jpg

 

When you are done with chains and tensioner, wind the engine over clockwise by hand at least two turns, one tooth out will catch a valve edge on a piston such was the pursuit of high compression ratio. Any resistance whatsoever, wind the engine back to before TDC and then clockwise back to TDC and double check

 

then reverse the disassembly process of course

20170414_174732.jpg

 

I had to down spanners before the test start as Gin called !! we had guests etc

20170414_180747.jpg

 

Next morning it fired up on the first click, no rattle, good oil pressure happy days

20170415_121913.jpg

 

20170415_121921.jpg

 

test drive went well for the first 4 miles theen something went clonk followed by oil pressure dropping from 45psi to 20psi. bollocks! well they are called test drives

 

First check, using endoscope down the RH head was to check the tensioners which both looked fine

20170415_162037.jpg

 

Then I marked up the ignition

20170415_171010.jpg

 

so the distributor could come out and I could check the oil pump drive

20170415_171708.jpg

 

which was still hex shaped at both ends - they can fail

20170415_171750.jpg

 

next was to find the pump anticlockwise on my cordless to see if I could get oil pressure, bear in mind that on the starter the engine can wind up 45psi from cold. I was disappointed at 20psi. 

20170415_172748.jpg

 

maybe the pressure relieve valve on the pump is jammed open, not unknown

20170415_180100.jpg

 

the pump is quite accessible once you get under the car, remove the oil filter and the RH exhaust downpipe :D

20170415_180121.jpg

 

Took pump apart, no sign of any issues and wear was well within tolerances. 

20170415_191634.jpg

 

20170415_191957.jpg

 

20170415_192137.jpg

 

Reinstalled pump, exhaust and oil filter and 

20170423_145414.jpg

 

Cranked it all over and still a very reluctant 20psi

20170423_151914.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


  • danthecapriman, alf892, Magnificent Rustbucket and 1 other like this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#89 OFFLINE   richardthestag

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 10:19 PM

next step is back to square one, irritatingly

 

An hour saw me back down to timing chains and it all looks ok

20170423_163251.jpg

 

I decided to crank the engine over, ignition disconnected and lookee whatee happened

20170423_164506.jpg

 

Clue RH chain which is on the left of the picture should be tight against the guide to the left of the jack sprocket in the middle of the pic.

 

The chain guide must have come loose, no idea why unless bolt wasn't tight enough or chain tension was too tight. Locked it up until I have time to dig deeper which I did tonight.

 

Pulled RH chain off, counted the links and yes it is the correct 104 link chain. looked at bolt threads and they seem ok. they wer 20ft/lb tight the tensioner is ok. just going to have to refit again and see what happens. Pretty sure this is root cause of oil pressure

 

Wait until next week as I am on Range Rover rebuild from tomorrow :8

 

 

 

 


  • danthecapriman, alf892, Magnificent Rustbucket and 3 others like this

Shitroen C4 GP 2007 1.6HDi - Wife's daily written off, farewell trusty but slightly unpredictable steed

Pug 307 - son's daily runner Sold to Arthur Foxhake

Range Rover Vogue 1993 - my daily runner

Daewoo Matiz 2002 - Sold

Jaguar x308 Sovereign 4 litre - nicked by Fathathestag might be up 4sayle soon

Triumph Staaag 1973 - cheaper than a mistress.. just

Range Rover 1972 - ongoing extensive restoration

Range Rover 1972 - complete shed but in line for restoration

Land Rover 1969 SIIa SWB - belongs to Fathathestag but maintained and welded by me

BMW E46 318i touring - sold to hhhugues

 


#90 OFFLINE   Rusty Sills

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 05:20 AM

Great thread!
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