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mk1 focus FTP boiled up HELP


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34 replies to this topic

#1 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 01:55 PM

mk1 focus petty 1600 , was on the motorway this morning , dash lights up and it felt like it was slowing , managed to dive down a exit almost straight away 

 

got out and the header tank was full to the cap and spilling over , fan not on , no obvious coolant in oil or vice versa

 

ive let it cool down and its lost about an inch of coolant , starts and sounds fine no misfires or rattles from the pump

 

any ideas im thinking maybe water pump or stat ??  can the stat close up after driving for 2 hrs 



#2 OFFLINE   mrbenn

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 02:09 PM

Believe it or not, these do something clever whereby they drop to two cylinders when overheating in a bid to cool themselves down somehow. Sounds like that could have happened here, hence the slowing down.

 

Any warning lights? What was the temperature gauge showing?


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#3 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 02:22 PM

temp gauge was straight up normal 

 

yes haynes suggests what you mention...i guess thats the slowing down was

 

lights ....yellow wheel shaped one manual says overheat and then the check engine one came on , now once cooled its just the check engine

 

**what movement should i see in the header tank??   at the side of the road when still warm there was none and i just started it from cold and again no movement over a few mins 



#4 OFFLINE   sierraman

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 02:23 PM

If it's a Ford Stat they usually fail safe I.e open, I'd doubt it's that. Unlikely to be a seized water pump as that would whip the drivebelt clean off, could well be a failed impeller on the pump. As you say I'd doubt it's the head gasket, they very rarely go on these.

Simple answer might be a failed cap on the header tank, in a way these are meant to be a service item, if you look on the service book it says you ought to replace it at Xxx miles. Doubt f it makes a difference. Could be that the pressure relied on yours has failed. Cheap to replace I'd give it a go, then check the water pump if the impeller has failed on it, then go down the route of compression testing etc.

Hot to cold should be about an inch on the header tank, maybe a bit less.
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#5 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 02:27 PM

thanks ...header tank i mean would you expect to see flow from the smaller tube , theres nothing that i can see( but darent run it too long  )

 

pump isnt seized and no major noises from it

 

so you think first idea is pull the pump?



#6 OFFLINE   sierraman

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 02:30 PM

No, I'd spend £3-4 on a new cap, I think the cooling system could be overpressuring. I'd see how you get on with that first. The pump is a bit involved, taking timing belt off to get behind it. If it was the bearings on it you'd hear it, plus it'd leak from the weep hole underneath. Could be the impeller has come off internally.

#7 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 02:33 PM

thats what i was thinking the impeeler has come off ...but surley would rattle a bit?

 

would running it up with no cap be okay...im kinda stranded theyve towed me home and cant get out for parts



#8 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 02:35 PM

cap doesnt explain no coolant flow in the tank tho??

 

off to warm it up again ...brb



#9 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 03:04 PM

ok ran it again

 

temp gauge shot up to normal within a minute , ran it for around 10 mins the oil filter was hot but neither of the rad hoses were even warm ?

 

again no flow /movement in the header tank...



#10 OFFLINE   sierraman

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 03:22 PM

As a temp measure if the cap is overpressurising you could drill an 1/8 hole in the top. Wouldn't run it with no cap, there'll be coolant everywhere otherwise.

The temp gauge is fed from the cyl head temp sensor as opposed to an actual coolant feed for the gauge on some modern Fords.

If the stat was jammed open the gauge though wouldn't get past about 1/3 even after a while. If it's an aftermarket stat it's possible it could jam closed.

#11 OFFLINE   Parky

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 04:39 PM

Mrs P's Bini did a similar thing and that was traced to some sort of relay in the radiator fan assembly failing and the fan not working.

The fact you mentioned the car boiling up and the fan not kicking in might mean something similar? If it was hot enough to boil over I would expect the fan to be running constantly

#12 OFFLINE   sierraman

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 04:43 PM

Bypass the fan switch and see if the fans seized. I'd doubt the fans would be running at 70mph.

#13 OFFLINE   mrbenn

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 05:32 PM

Put the a/c on, fans should come on straight away if they're working.


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#14 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 10 March 2017 - 05:43 PM

Bypass the fan switch and see if the fans seized. I'd doubt the fans would be running at 70mph.

 

no shouldnt expect the fans to be needed at 70

 

so far ive pulled the stat and it checks out in the saucepan of hot water , then started on water pump removal but got stuck so will carry on tommorow  



#15 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 11 March 2017 - 11:09 AM

water pump all good...stat all good 

 

fml



#16 OFFLINE   sierraman

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Posted 11 March 2017 - 11:11 AM

Like I say I'd look at the expansion cap. If the system is over pressurising, it'll cause it to overheat.

#17 OFFLINE   egg

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Posted 11 March 2017 - 11:24 AM

Even OEM caps aren't expensive. I've changed them on both my Fords as a precaution.

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#18 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 11 March 2017 - 12:05 PM

will look at a cap on monday cheers

 

ran it up again....seemed fairly normal heater started to work after 5-8 mins , gauge crept up to the middle but the rad hoses stayed cold

 

took it for a 2mile run to circulate things and this is where it gets wierd , the rad hose on the passenger side was hot , other side near the stat stone cold 

 

header tank and hoses cold ..at that point that rad fan came on and ran until i decided to turn off 

 

*****so engine hot /pipework not *****



#19 OFFLINE   hairymel

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Posted 11 March 2017 - 12:20 PM

run it without the thermostat if you can? 



#20 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 01:22 PM

right if anyone is still looking in 

 

rad all flushed out , new coolant , new cap

 

from the engine bay all appears normal , warms up as it should , isnt stupidly hot after hours driving around town- never appears too hot

 

the most random thing is now happening , if you get to 70mph for a few mins then back off to 50 or below the gauge will shoot from normal to red and back again in about 10 secs , only seems to do it under those circumstances and never around town or prelonged idling   



#21 ONLINE   SiC

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 01:40 PM

Water pump not pumping very effectively and so on overrun it struggles to cool things?

A mates Focarse mk1 had a coolant temperature (or was it the wiring?) fail when driving in the rain. That caused the temp gauge to go to the max and wouldn't let the engine accelerate.
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#22 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 01:50 PM

happens so fast  i dont believe its really overheating and then back to normal so quick



#23 OFFLINE   IainL

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 05:06 PM

It's normal for the gauge to rise slightly after being on the motorway but it should rise only a small amount any then return to normal.

Obvs yours rises much more than that which suggests that something is either not pumping or restricting the flow. What makes you think the waterpump and stat are ok? My Corsa stat stuck shut from cold which was a bit scary temp wise.
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#24 OFFLINE   andy18s

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 05:12 PM

Is the rad warm all over?
May have a partial blockage/collapse inside.....
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#25 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 05:48 PM

 What makes you think the waterpump and stat are ok? My Corsa stat stuck shut from cold which was a bit scary temp wise.

 

took the pump off , impeller like new and not spinning on shaft , stat checked in a pan okay and then replaced with new one out of desperation 

 

rad..yeah feels normal- thing is i can do 40 mins at 75 and no issues as long as i never back off or brake , as soon as i brake its flicked over to red for a few seconds ,drive off again at 70 and its fine for ever until i slow again , i feel if the rad was blocked /fucked it woulnt stick motorway speeds for long at all



#26 OFFLINE   IainL

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 05:53 PM

Still sounds like a flow issue to me.
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#27 OFFLINE   The Reverend Bluejeans

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 06:31 PM

took the pump off , impeller like new and not spinning on shaft 

 

 

 

Even when it's good and hot?


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#28 OFFLINE   mrbenn

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 06:52 PM

You know what, it had completely slipped my mind but there was a chap on a now defunct Focus forum that had a 53 plate 1.6 Zetec which had exactly this issue. The full two cylinders/engine lights thing. My memory is hazy but I'm fairly sure it came down to the water pump on his car, even though it looked ok at the time.



#29 ONLINE   steveo3002

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 06:52 PM

well no it had cooled off by the time id removed it , had the pulley in the vice and no movment on impeller , no marks to suggests its slipping or otherwise

 

cant in my mind see how it would cool fine for miles at motorway speeds or idling ... 



#30 ONLINE   rainagain

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 06:33 AM

Is it a plastic impeller? To me it sounds like the impeller is becoming loose at high temperatures




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