Cavcraft Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 You had a right result at the MOT, nice one. Captain Furious 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Furious Posted March 1, 2017 Author Share Posted March 1, 2017 No idea what's wrong, but let me be horribly late to say TAILBLAZER WIN!Well, this is awkward...a stock boot panel arrived in the post today from that there eBay... richardthestag and Magnificent Rustbucket 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollywobbler Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Well, this is awkward...a stock boot panel arrived in the post today from that there eBay... That's ok. Simply cut it and the tailblazer in half and have the best of both worlds. Skizzer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Keep the tailblazer safe until November, then throw it on a bonfire. Captain Furious, John F, richardthestag and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiC Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Do the trailblazers light up? If not, I always thought they should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Furious Posted March 1, 2017 Author Share Posted March 1, 2017 No they just sit there and look tacky...in my humble opinion of course. John F 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiC Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Put it in the loft, well away from the elements and UV to stop it degrading. Then when you find it in 15-20years it'll be worth mega bucks. Magnificent Rustbucket 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 My other thought was throttle position sensor, purely due to the way it seems to be very throttle position related, but I've never known one produce such dramatic running issues and it's not generally come up in the list of common issues. Unlikely - it's a glorified throttle closed and throttle fully open switch on these, rather than a conventional throttle pot. Unplug it completely to rule it out - it's not ideal longer term as fuel economy will be a little bit worse (no fuel cut-off on overrun) and you'll lose some power flat out (no WOT enrichment) but otherwise it'll behave and drive just fine. Gut feeling from the symptoms is either a seriously knackered AFM or the ignition is breaking down under load. A degree of low-speed kangeroo'ing on light throttle is "normal" on these btw until you get the knack of it, makes crawling along in slow moving traffic in 1st gear great fun. Captain Furious 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barefoot Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 No they just sit there and look tacky...in my humble opinion of course. What's up with you man? They provide a much larger expanse of reflective surface to make you 93% safer in typical conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardthestag Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Tailblazer was due* to Voxal facelifting their incredibly popular Cavalier in 86ish to come up with this brilliantly fresh modern look on an slowly ageing design *possibly non cavalier reps were incandescent with rage, probably and thus the 2 week long frenzy for trailblazers was born. before everyone realised that they looked a bit shit when compared to the Cavaliers rather clean styled arse end Verdict - clean 205 back end looks infinitely classier Captain Furious and BorniteIdentity 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardthestag Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Never understood the love for these. Drove one back in the day & it was shite, I preferred the Orion I had at the time. But it'll be earths, the french can't do electrics. Crikey I bet you had a check blanket on the rear parcel shelf and a packet of werthers in the glovebox. Magnificent Rustbucket, dome and Captain Furious 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardthestag Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 re running issues it could be something as simple as stale pez Sooper market pez goes off within 3 months. super unleaded lasts a little longer Invest in a can of electric contact cleaner. undo each multi and sensor connector around the engine and give it a good spray, wiggle the connector back into place. Inside the air flow meter there should be a tinsey ickle wire - do not touch but use wd40 etc spray to lube it and compressed air to blow away the crap from around it Make sure the air filter is a) not ancient and blocked up not some barried affair. does it run better without the air filter. dont do it for long obviousment Clean up the earths in the engine bay - loose the bolt/screw, wire brush it like you are giving it an angry arse wipe , vaseline it and retighten Check that there is a main engine earth cable, big fat fucker normally goes from the engine block to the side of the engine bay. If all else fails lob some injector cleaner into the tank and give it an italian tune up DeeJay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
For Fiats Sake Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 My abiding memory of the 205 is my mate running out of talent on a single track road and us going through an open gate and into a field. He was a rep for philips car audio and had two weeks in the Gti, another in a Belmont and then an Orion as they visited the various garages trying to get the salesmen to recommend the products at the point of sale. As I recall the stereos were as shit as his driving. dome and Stevebrookman 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hooli Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Crikey I bet you had a check blanket on the rear parcel shelf and a packet of werthers in the glovebox. Well the onion was on cut xr3i springs, xr3i rear brakes (much bigger drums for handbrake turns), xr3 carb & 1.6i exhaust so I didn't drive it too slow. I found the 205 gutless at less than eleventy billion rpm & crap handling, it didn't turn in & then tried to snap. Oh it was uncomfy with a crap driving position too. And they are ugly... Mind you it was a 1.6, that'd make all the difference to the looks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Furious Posted March 2, 2017 Author Share Posted March 2, 2017 Unlikely - it's a glorified throttle closed and throttle fully open switch on these, rather than a conventional throttle pot. Unplug it completely to rule it out - it's not ideal longer term as fuel economy will be a little bit worse (no fuel cut-off on overrun) and you'll lose some power flat out (no WOT enrichment) but otherwise it'll behave and drive just fine. Gut feeling from the symptoms is either a seriously knackered AFM or the ignition is breaking down under load. A degree of low-speed kangeroo'ing on light throttle is "normal" on these btw until you get the knack of it, makes crawling along in slow moving traffic in 1st gear great fun. Thanks for that, I think I'm going to give it a shot tonight with the TPS unplugged, just so I can tick it off the list and my mind can move past it. Because the more I'm thinking about it the more I think it fits the symptoms. I think you're right about the ignition being the problem though. There is a 2nd AFM in the boot as though a previous owner has already attempted that and it looks as though it has already had new plugs and leads recently, as well as a new battery (that I've put on) and a new alternator (that a previous owner put on) We have checked plug gaps etc and they all look good. Which brings me down to checking electrical connections\earths, then the coil and amplifier module, which I assume there is no real test for other than replace and see if there is a difference? I haven't as yet been able to do any real electrical diagnostics, because, incredibly, I have been without a meter since I've had it. Mine was discovered to be flat when we were looking at the internal electrical issues so we just did without, then I thought by the time I've bought a new battery I could just buy a new meter because its only a £5 ebay spesh...so I did, but didn't read the ad properly and bought one with no battery included! Incidentally, this is way beyond normal kangarooing, this is more violent, whiplash inducing jerking back and forth...it actually gave me a headache last night after about 10 minutes driving Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardthestag Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 update AFM on the Pug is more likely to be the very simple flap design rather than hotwire I originally guessed at check vid on yawtoob for instruction like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Furious Posted March 2, 2017 Author Share Posted March 2, 2017 re running issues it could be something as simple as stale pez Sooper market pez goes off within 3 months. super unleaded lasts a little longer Invest in a can of electric contact cleaner. undo each multi and sensor connector around the engine and give it a good spray, wiggle the connector back into place. Inside the air flow meter there should be a tinsey ickle wire - do not touch but use wd40 etc spray to lube it and compressed air to blow away the crap from around it Make sure the air filter is a) not ancient and blocked up not some barried affair. does it run better without the air filter. dont do it for long obviousment Clean up the earths in the engine bay - loose the bolt/screw, wire brush it like you are giving it an angry arse wipe , vaseline it and retighten Check that there is a main engine earth cable, big fat fucker normally goes from the engine block to the side of the engine bay. If all else fails lob some injector cleaner into the tank and give it an italian tune up Again, thanks, all suggestions more than gratefully received, one of them will be the golden nugget Pez - it was about dry when we got it, my mate chucked a can of fresh in it when he collected it, I have since put £10 in when I took it for MOT and £20 of Shell's finest last night with no noticeable difference. We're going to change the fuel filter on Sat, I don't think that'll cure it, but its a cheap service item and another one struck off the list. Am I right in thinking the tanks are plastic in these and therefore tank corrosion shouldn't be a problem? Contact cleaner has already been acquired while we were doing the electrics around the rest of the car, but that's a good idea which I will carry out post-haste As above there are two AFM's with the car and I'd be surprised if both exhibited the exact same issue, but i'll keep it in mind Air filter is a barry affair I'm afraid, a K&N 57i, however under certain conditions it will wind out to the redline so I don't think there is any significant obstruction there Clean up earths - Yes, I really need to put some effort into this one. I haven't checked specifically but also a good suggestion, the fact its had a new alternator would lead me to believe there is a history of electrical issues there - I was going to try using an old jump lead as a make-shift earth strap too and see if it made a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiperCub Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 On a similar theme, didn't someone (Superchips??) do a replacement ECU IC/chip to greatly reduce the low speed throttle response on the 1600's? I've had four in all but never bothered with this mod as I find it's something you largely get used to. Can anyone shed light on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 On a similar theme, didn't someone (Superchips??) do a replacement ECU IC/chip to greatly reduce the low speed throttle response on the 1600's? I've had four in all but never bothered with this mod as I find it's something you largely get used to. Can anyone shed light on this? They did. It's basically a bodge with a handful of resistors etc to make the mixture silly-rich on initial throttle application, thus greatly reducing the tendency to kangeroo. Laughable really given what they charged back in the day. If you open the Jetronic ECU up you'll see that it's a properly old-school analogue thing, hence you can disable the rev limiter by cutting a diode and all sorts of things. You can also reduce kangeroo'ing by mis-adjusting the throttle switch so that it never reads closed, thus disabling the fuel-cut off which tends to greatly exacerbate the issue. Like you, I've never bothered with either as you get used to it, plus I don't like the side-effects of either "fix". Putting the later Motronic management on fixes the issue properly, although that's slightly more involved as you need to change the flywheel etc to do that. PiperCub 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiperCub Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 ^^ Anthony - thanks for clearing that up, i was wondering. I did see something on ebay ages ago that purported to be a replacement chip (can't recall who's it was) but I wasn't convinced. The resistor ladder type 'mod' is a bodge I'd heard of elsewhere but didn't know that's what the 205 'update' consisted of. I do now!! Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Furious Posted March 4, 2017 Author Share Posted March 4, 2017 Some minor progress, my co-owner thought it was the fuel filter, must admit I was sceptical but for the sake of a £10 service item, there was no harm changing it. So we did this morning, rather unconvinced, I took it for a test up the road and blow me, it was driving exactly 798% better than it ever has, it was still a little bit hesitant but it never missed once. Excitedly returned to announce victory, he took it out and confirmed the same results. After all that, it was the fuel filter! Well, no, it wasn't, upon taking it for a longer drive normal service resumed, so I can only surmise it was a coincidence and whatever is the real cause of the problem is still very much there. But we did come eliminate a few suspects such as the TPS, AFM, Fuel pump, pressure regulator, engine temp sensor, some suspect wiring to the coil which we re-did. So now the spotlight is on either the coil itself or the ignition module, new parts on order, more updates Tuesday or Wednesday when these don't fix it and I'm shit out of ideas again I can say though that when it runs well....it is enormously grin inducing Magnificent Rustbucket 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiC Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 Do these have intake fuel filters/meshes? Maybe some crud is getting stuck onto it when driving, then after stopping it slowly falls back to the bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Furious Posted March 4, 2017 Author Share Posted March 4, 2017 Well, that thought did occur to me, but when the problem is occurring it will not pick up and kangaroos violently, you can nail the throttle and it just will not clear...but if you're carrying enough speed that you can force it above 4K rpm by dropping a cog it will pick up and wind out to the redline, so I don't think it's fuel starvation. I have actually had the exact symptoms you described above on my daily drive and they manifested in an entirely different way, it would simply die off at the top end and refuse to rev past 4000rpm, getting progressively lower and lower as presumably more shit accumulated around the pickup, stopping and restarting would temporarily clear it. There was no jerkiness, or sudden cutouts etc This definitely feels entirely ignition related, however I reserve the right to retract that statement when the ignition components fail to cure it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dome Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 I wonder if the tanks REALLY full of shit and has clogged the new filter already? Sticking a clear in line fuel filter in between the tank and filter would show if this is the case Magnificent Rustbucket 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Furious Posted March 4, 2017 Author Share Posted March 4, 2017 I guess it is possible, but other than the first initial drive the symptoms haven't really changed, it's always revved cleanly above 4K rpm. The old filter didn't seem blocked at all and liberal quantities of pez were deposited around the engine bay and garage floor. If these parts don't cure it though everything will be back on the table and I'll probably remove the fuel pump for a look inside the tank. It's a plastic tank so there shouldn't be too many horrors going on inside and the petrol coming out the fuel lines even pre-filter was clean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERBS Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 seeing as we are showing the old pug here is mine,she's an oldie but what a great drive Sudsprint and Captain Furious 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braddon81 Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 Are the Afm's the correct items? If I can recall the 1.9 and the 1.6s look identical but are a different internal spec....and a 1.9 won't run properly with a 1.6 Afm.My friend had a Gentry 1.9 auto 10 or more so years back and that started running like a sack of poo,turned out that the complete distributor was faulty. That might be worth checking if the replacement ignition module/amplifier doesn't come up trumps either. Captain Furious 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERBS Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 1.6 (XU5J) 1983-90 - Bosch LE Jetronic, OE part number 0 280 202 056 (also fitted to 1.6 litre 309 SRi 83/90) 1.9 (XU9JA) 1986-89 - Bosch LE Jetronic, OE part number 0 280 202 109 (also fitted to 1.9 litre 309 SRi 86/89) 1.9 (XU9JA) 1987 onwards - Bosch ML4/M1.3, OE part number 0 280 202 202 (also fitted to 1.9 litre 309 GTi 88/93 & 1.9 litre 405 88/92) Braddon81 and Captain Furious 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Furious Posted March 5, 2017 Author Share Posted March 5, 2017 Yup, I did happen across an article on a 205 forum listing the correct part numbers for the AFM and we checked yesterday, it's definitely the correct one. (The middle one in the list above). Also checked the resistance on the signal output and that seemed roughly correct (according to this forum guide at least) something like 60 ohms flap fully closed up to 1Kohms fully open with a fairly linear progression I've also heard about distributors themselves being faulty so that's probably where we'll have to go next if it doesn't fix it, fingers crossed it will though. Nice looking early example above there too, B reg must be one of the first? richardthestag 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERBS Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 Yes they started production on A registration, i got mine at the right time,it was a bit rough round the edges, i paid £800 for it, and my labour is cheap as i spent ages nipping to the garage and doing bits at weekends but well worth it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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