AnthonyG Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Well its offical - GM is to close or sell Saab. Doesn't look good: http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/b ... 757562.ece Hummer and Saturn will also disappear, although I guess somebody will buy Hummer - possibly AM General, a seperate company based in South Bend, Indiana (where Studebakers used to be made*) which still makes the proper military vehicle. (Personally I think Hummer should be put down, as it represents all that went wrong with the US car industry in the 1990s/ start of this decade - trashy overblown SUV shite.) A year ago, I'm sure SAIC (who own MG & Ssanyong) would have been only to happy to take on Saab - it would end the Roewe brand nonsense - but given the state of the Chinese car market, they would have to dig deep and end up borrowing from the Chinese state. The other likely buyers, Renault or PSA, who I think were both tentavely interested in Jaguar early last year, have enough problems of their own to take on Saab I reckon. Anyway what do you guys think? * I can recommend the museum if you are ever in the area Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew e Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 The President is not going to rescue Saab over the domestic GM brands.The buyer? Fuji heavy industries* or Scania.*Don't forget the Trebica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volksy Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 It will be a shame if it goes, but GM seem to be holding SAAB to ransom to gain cash injection from the Swedish Government.IF WEZ DONT GET $400,000,000 BY END OF AUCTON WE IZ GIVIN IT TO THE BANGER BOYZ OR BRAKIN IT UP INTO BITZ.The closure of Hummer is no great loss, the civilian version should never have been made in the first place IMO.Saturn however is a different matter, as most saturns IIRC these days are re-badged Euro build GM products, i.e. Opels/Vauxhalls. These are exactly the cars they should be keeping, not to secure european jobs, but they are probably the best cars that GM sel in the US! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew e Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Originally Saturn was Gm's go at japenese style just in time production. Of course it never worked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollywobbler Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 It's a shame but when it comes to the Big Swedes, Ford really hit the mark with Volvo whereas GM always seemed to struggle with Saab - the designs just weren't sharp enough really (chrome Dame Edna glasses FTL!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnthonyG Posted February 18, 2009 Author Share Posted February 18, 2009 The President is not going to rescue Saab over the domestic GM brands.The buyer? Fuji heavy industries* or Scania.*Don't forget the Trebica Scania's a possibility, although there is a massive WHY? that the Scania shareholders might reasonably ask. Plus weren't they getting stalked by MAN themselves?Subaru, Mitsubishi, Suzuki and Mazda all have their own problems to deal with. IIRC Subaru have left WRC this year due to cost reasons? I reckon there will be some mergers amongst the smaller Japanese makers before this recesssions out, although the brands will probably all survive . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashmicro Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Hmm. Have to say I agree with all of the above. The Spam car industry has only itself to blame. The popularity boom for SUVs was great for Ford and GM as these things cost buttons to build and development costs were low, due to parts-bin raiding.I must admit I've no idea what kind of money SAAB is actually worth.As for the surrender monkeys, didn't Renault have to ask Monsueir Teacosy for a few quid quite recently? Also perhaps a bit of resistance from the Swedes as to the cheese eaters having such a stranglehold on the Swedish car industry might be on the cards.Be a shame if SAAB sunk because of General Monkeys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volksy Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 (chrome Dame Edna glasses FTL!)Whoever is responsible for those wants shooting, When they first came out they displayed one in Leeds City Square as a marketing ploy, i walked past and openly lol'd at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRegieRitmo Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 the cheese eaters having such a stranglehold on the Swedish car industry might be on the cards.The Dutch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Bo11ox Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Reggie man, he's talking about the French!I'd say saab is utterly bo11oxed thanks to years of GM ineptitude. All those warmed-over cadillacs, vectras and chevy blazers have erased any identity that Saab had. And who wants to buy a struggling car company in 2009? I dont think even the chinese will be up for it. You might get some clueless moron sniffing round like that Russian lad who bought TVR, but that would just be an equally sure death knell. I'd say 18 months from now SAAB will be gone and history will put it down as 'worn away to nothing by GM, then finally killed off by the 08/09 global financial crisis' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seth Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE ARCHITECTS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pogweasel Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 LOL @ seth. Why is mrs_seth not rolling a 9-5 then? (And I had been eyeing up a 9-3 on contract for when the money starts rolling again ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seth Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Why is mrs_seth not rolling a 9-5 then? She's not an architect! Did roll a 95 for a while though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CortinaDave Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 I quite like the current saabs... I'll have one when they are 500 quid, which will be a lot sooner if the name disappears. Woohoo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tatmeister Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 I pass a Vauxhall dealer every day on the way to work. Mid-2008 they also became a Hummer dealer, and proudly displayed their one demonstrator at £38000 (08 plate). By the end of 2008, it was down to £32000 (no doubt due to fuel prices - talk about bad timing). Haven't seen it for a while, but it turned up again last week, now at £23999! £15K loss in around six months! I reckon they still won't sell it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owain-328i Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 LOL @ seth. Why is mrs_seth not rolling a 9-5 then? (And I had been eyeing up a 9-3 on contract for when the money starts rolling again )Avoid, the 9-3 is nice dont get me wrong, the old man had a 56 plate 9-3 Vector Sport TDI, and it blew its 6 speed box after 1500 miles. Grim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milford Cubicle Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Hey it must be a real SAAB if it has a self-destructing gearbox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead_E23 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 I pass a Vauxhall dealer every day on the way to work. Mid-2008 they also became a Hummer dealer, and proudly displayed their one demonstrator at £38000 (08 plate). By the end of 2008, it was down to £32000 (no doubt due to fuel prices - talk about bad timing). Haven't seen it for a while, but it turned up again last week, now at £23999! £15K loss in around six months! I reckon they still won't sell it..I passed a Hummer on the M25 at the weekend and it crossed my mind that you hardly see any around recently. This is absolutely spiffing (imho), but does anybody know where they're all disappearing to? Are Chingford and Billericay suddenly dotted with monstrous boxy CPTCs, or has someone started shipping them all out to Russia to sell to skint oligarchs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew e Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 I can confirm Billericay favours the Q7 and the Cooper convertible as the mum car of choice, I believe we are Hummer free! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead_E23 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Russia it must be, then. So it suggests here, anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r.welfare Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 Avoid, the 9-3 is nice dont get me wrong, the old man had a 56 plate 9-3 Vector Sport TDI, and it blew its 6 speed box after 1500 miles. Grim.O RLY? I had the very same as a company car from new, no problems in 11 months and 25k miles other than a broken ashtray! Went like the QE2 outta Southampton when it was off-boost, mind. Nice-looking car - one of the most handsome midsize saloons (well, until the 2008 facelift anyway), but I wouldn't buy one with my own money, there's too much to go wrong - like any new car really. Anyway, I see your gearbox lunching effort, and raise it with my dad's Mk3 Mondeo TDCI auto breaking after 128 miles...Saab's current stuff is dynamically average and really only a decent choice because you are (a) an architect; ( like the comfy seats and ignition switch between them; © get a cracking deal, or (d) you want something different to an A3/A4/1-series/Golf. I was a (d). That said, a non-Dame-Edna 9-5 estate is on the "next car for Mrs W" list, along with a just-replaced-shape V70, Avensis or Mazda6 estate, for £2.5k or less ideally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Bo11ox Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Hey what about this then? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7901027.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnthonyG Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 Saab have a good brand, but two cars that need replacing - the 93 (first out in 2002?) and the 95 (first out in 97). When they went off on their own, Rover had £500m, one new car - the 75 - and a reasonable following for the 25 and the MGF. On the down side they also had the warranty liability K series engine and the bunch of self deluding tits that were the Phoenix Four.I doubt Saab can survive on its own, even with $400m dollars. Still, I wish them the best of Swedish luck. The Swedish govt may arrange a 'marriage' with someone Asian or Russian.Ford must be so relieved they sold JLR, and Aston, when times were good'ish', although I reckon they needed to develop and launch the XF just to prove Jaguar had a viable future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnthonyG Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 I passed a Hummer on the M25 at the weekend and it crossed my mind that you hardly see any around recently. This is absolutely spiffing (imho), but does anybody know where they're all disappearing to? Are Chingford and Billericay suddenly dotted with monstrous boxy CPTCs, or has someone started shipping them all out to Russia to sell to skint oligarchs?I used to see the odd one in Central West London, but they were pretty rare - I would see at least as many Lincoln Navigators and other stuff that wasn't even officially imported. When I first saw a Hummer H2, (the first GM one) in the centre of Sheffield it was so astoundingly ugly and out of place it made the local trams look like the French TGV.I don't object to Hummers because they are large SUVs, it's because they are so tacky and poorly built. The panel gaps would make a series 1 Landy blush, and the general lack of build and material quality give, in comparision, an early Skoda Favorit the feel of a Lexus LS600 hand finished for the Emperor of Japan. That's what I object to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Interesting, would be nice for Saab to make a comeback, provided they make smart and slightly leftfield cars again.All I hope for the new car scene is that we eventually end up with some of this 4-door executive grot from China, I'd love a Brilliance BS6 or a BYD F6. Lashings of chrome and tacky pretend walnut? Yes please! Also I like the idea of someone from Auto Express or similar having to drive around in one and getting REALLY angry about interior plastics, because seemingly that's all that matters nowadays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollywobbler Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 I've done over 250 miles in a 95 (pre-chrome nose) this week and it's been a bit disappointing to be honest. It feels very cheap inside, not a premium product at all. The indicator stalks sound like someone cracking their knuckles. Horrible. NVH isn't fab either and the auto box seems a bit inidecisive. Don't get me wrong - cruises very nicely and serenely but it's bland looking rather than odd looking and just didn't get my boat floated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reallyloud Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 The BBC article suggests that Saab will go it alone, but realistically even the Swedish government won't bail the company out to pay its debts. If no one out there is actually buying cars, what chance have Saab got? Saab needed to have expanded their range when they had a chance - the American Subaru link up was interesting, they got an Imprenza and wanged a Saab front end on it. What do they have at the moment other than 2 large luxury cars with GM mechanics? Its all rather tragic. I also heard today that another UK car factory is due to close down soon. I know Transit production ends soon, but I can't think who it might be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollywobbler Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 I reckon Ellesmere Port is at risk and, sadly, Lode Lane. Land Rover is in trouble and Lode Lane is far from a modern plant. Halewood is much better in that regard.Already, I'm wondering why Tata haven't shipped Defender production to India. Perhaps they could even start fitting the Tdi engines again or, even better, the old 2.5 diesel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrshirelad Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 I think Saab has lost its distinctly disgined model range.Hence the sales drop.People think they are now merely rebadged Vaxhalls unfortunatly.Who will buy it i do not know.Not sure if there is nayone able to afford to buy it.I still think Opel and Vaxhall arnt completly safe.At our local Vaxhall dealership if you go in with approx 8 grand in u r pocket you can drive out with a brnad new Vectra if that is your desire.Just befroe x mas they hadnt sold a new car in appprox 3/4 months.The signs advetising for sales persons or executives was a tad optmistic.They are still looking for staff too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the spidery land's eye Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 let's have a root through our pockets and see if we can make a bid. i've got 63p: anyone fancy an autoshite buyout? we could relaunch the 900. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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